Lincoln Park - A gem of some kind ...

[Kalen Braley]

Tom,

Does Lincoln qualify as a "Strip Club" course?

Nah, not really.  It's too cheap and there's no shame in playing it.

TH

Tom,

Given those constraints would it be the equivalant of going to a bikini bar in Tijuana??  

[Tom Huckaby]

LOL
No, not as I see that term I created.

When one plays Lincoln Park, one does a favor to the city of SF, giving them some badly needed revenue.  It's more like doing one's civic duty then going to strip club or bikini bar.

I see "strip club" courses as overpriced monstrosities where your income benefits no one but the proprietor and where you have mindless fun but feel guilty afterward.

Thus, The Crossings at Carlsbad.  And I know that that is a municipal course.  But at least when I was there it was not suffering for income... and Carlsbad ain't San Francisco.

[Kalen Braley]

Tom,

The more I think about Lincoln Park, the more I think its a no win situation.  

Do your civic duty as you say, and all you are doing is supporting a very ineffecient organization that is giving you a crappy product.  Why reward them for this?

On the other hand, boycott it, and if enough people do this, eventually the powers that be will claim no one is playing the course, shut it down, then turn it into a park for the tourists and homeless to occupy.

Futhermore, its not like san francisco is likely to ever elect someone with the balls to get in there and fight the system to clean up the mess.  

So what to do??  Sue them for course negligence??  

[Tom Huckaby]

Kalen:

I think you have this perfectly assessed.  There is no good answer.  I just throw up my hands and say "it's San Francisco, what do you expect?".  Others go on diatribes... Gib Papazian has done a few in here about this issue that made one's toes curl.

In the end it is what it is and unless things change a LOT in that unique city, there's always going to be no good answer.

TH

[Kalen Braley]

Can't some logic be used here?

How much does the city spend on the gay-pride parade every year?  Gotta be in the millions right?

So if gays represent 2.8 % of the population in the US (while advocay groups say this number is 10%, most credible research shows its only 2.8%), and golfers represent 8.5 % of the population, shouldn't this mean we could and should spend more on courses than parades?  

[Tom Huckaby]

Logic?  San Francisco?

Surely you jest.

TH

[Forrest Richardson]

It is a mess.

http://www.sfnpc.org/documents/NGFFinal.pdf

Having contributed to this report, I can further say that the City of SF needs action, and quickly. However, "logic" as Tom points out, may be hard to come by in these lean years.

[Bill_McBride]

Even though its very unlikely, I think holding a pro match play event at Lincoln would be a hoot.  With all the short holes, it would create a ton of risky and fun to watch shots by the big boys.  Granted they would have to at least mow the fairways and get the greens to at least 8 on the stimp.    

Kalen, as I recall Lincoln from days of yore, the crew would have to do a lot of hard work to get the stimp up to 5!  

[Bill_McBride]

Could we discuss the bikini bars of Tiajuana a little more?    I'm home prepping for tomorrow's colonoscopy    and that does sound like a more interesting topic.

[Patrick Kiser]

Kalen,

This is what I called the ''self fulfilling prophecy''.  I said the same previously and on a PM to DT.

It''s actually quite strategic and smart when you think about it.

The only way to keep the prophecy from happening is ... to just keep going.  Regardless of the ''products'' condition.

Tom,

The more I think about Lincoln Park, the more I think its a no win situation.  

Do your civic duty as you say, and all you are doing is supporting a very ineffecient organization that is giving you a crappy product.  Why reward them for this?

On the other hand, boycott it, and if enough people do this, eventually the powers that be will claim no one is playing the course, shut it down, then turn it into a park for the tourists and homeless to occupy.

Futhermore, its not like san francisco is likely to ever elect someone with the balls to get in there and fight the system to clean up the mess.  

So what to do??  Sue them for course negligence??  

[Mike Benham]

It is a mess.

http://www.sfnpc.org/documents/NGFFinal.pdf

Having contributed to this report, I can further say that the City of SF needs action, and quickly. However, "logic" as Tom points out, may be hard to come by in these lean years.

Well, with Fringe and Overhead costs adding up to 65-70% on top of every dollar of labor, having the facilities staffed and managed by the private sector might be a start ...