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Nick Church

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Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« on: December 28, 2007, 10:04:35 AM »
I've been reading "The Match."  As the author described the proximity of 17 Mile Drive to the 15th tee, I was curious to look at Google Maps.

I then noticed an interesting estate to the North East of the 13th green.  It appears this little cottage has an extensive golf practice area as its front yard.

Does anyone know the story?  Curiosity got the best of me.

Thank you.

« Last Edit: December 28, 2007, 10:07:51 AM by Nick Church »

TEPaul

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2007, 10:15:35 AM »
If the house is adjacent to the 13th it may be the place that George Coleman used to own. According to the book that's where the bet that created The Match took place.

Tom Huckaby

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2007, 10:21:09 AM »
Many of us know a man who knows the entire history of that house quite well.  Great guy, Zimbabwean, Wolf-game champion.  Perhaps he will see this and expound.

Outside of that, I will say the caddies love to tell storis about that property... and that I have never heard the same story twice!

TH

Nick Church

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2007, 10:25:22 AM »
Thanks, guys, I appreciate the insight.

What struck my curiosity were the practice greens.  I can only imagine what kind of golf fanatic would go through that trouble, coupled with that ocean view, adjacent to that historic golf course.

It got me to thinking, what other small-scale, home practice complexes exist elsewhere.  A few wishful GCAs, I would imagine.  I certainly would enjoy pushing the dirt for a fun rolly-poly short game practice area.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2007, 10:28:11 AM by Nick Church »

AndrewB

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2007, 10:52:28 AM »
There was another thread started about this house a while ago.
"I think I have landed on something pretty fine."

Tom Huckaby

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2007, 11:00:25 AM »
It's been discussed many other times in here as well.

We just need our resident to come in and expound.  I'm sure he will at some point.  The house does have a fascinating history... heck I wish I remembered exactly what it was.. if so I wouldn't wait for Bob!

 ;D

Nick Church

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2007, 11:19:05 AM »
Andrew --- thank you for the link to the earlier thread.

Mike Hendren

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2007, 11:37:02 AM »
To keep this topic on target and to be intellectually honest and critical with no regard for jeopardizing future access:

Incredibly poor maintenance practices and the advent of the riding tri-plex mower have obviously  yielded Constanza-like shrinkage of the greens, not to mention rounding off.  

Hopefully, the owners will commit to a restoration so that the green pads are again extended outward to the bunkering and their original shapes restored.  

Sheesh - what a bunch of California hillbillies!

Mike
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Tom Huckaby

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2007, 11:41:49 AM »
Michael my friend:

Huh?

The property does have a really interesting history (as such has been told to me), I just didn't want to guess at it as I sincerely can't remember the details!

What this has to do with jeopardizing access, or being a hillbilly... well that sailed right over my head.

TH

Mike Hendren

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2007, 11:45:00 AM »
Tom,

The front yard golf architecture is awful.  By so stating, I have likely blown an invitation to experience it first hand.  

Mike
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Tom Huckaby

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2007, 11:48:31 AM »
Tom,

The front yard golf architecture is awful.  By so stating, I have likely blown an invitation to experience it first hand.  

Mike

 ;D ;D ;D

You rebel.

Funny thing is, I've seen that "course" hundreds of times, and never once have seen anyone playing the game on it.  I've always wondered if anyone ever has....

TH

Bob_Huntley

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2007, 01:16:00 PM »
Nick,

The house was built by a local man some seventeen or eighteen years ago. He sold it two or three years ago to a financial maven for something like $14,000,000.

Last year, the California Coastal Commission decided to come up with a demand that the golf greens be torn up and replaced with native plants as per the requirements of the permit granted to the original owner. These requirements were ignored by the original owner and the subsequent buyer then had to fight the Coastal Commisssion to retain the greens. All this at considerable expense.

The Judge hearing the current owner's appeal against the Commission, asked that august body how on earth it took seventeen years to discover that there was no native plantings as required. The Judge pointed out that some one million tourists a year travel the 17 Mile Drive and if they could see a golf course why on earth couldn't the protectors of the environment? Much gobbledygook followed and the Greens stayed.......for the present. I believe that the Commission is appealing the dismissal.

Bob

rjsimper

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2007, 01:24:42 PM »
Perhaps lining a few of the "fairways" with iceplant and a strategically placed Cypress sapling or two would qualify as native.

With a little loophole-exploiting work, how could this be anything other than an extremely well-landscaped lawn?

Anyone have a house number/address for this place?  www.zillow.com could be fun to check out.

Adam Clayman

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2007, 01:26:17 PM »
Nick, Along the 14th Fwy at Pebble there may still be an exact replica of one of the other greens at Pebble. I forget which hole. Maybe #7? I think there were two practice greens at one time in this guys yard.

Bob, As I recall your stories about this yard, part of the reason they didn't get involved was due to a person no one wanted to mess with. Capice?
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

JohnV

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2007, 01:26:25 PM »
Ryan,

Good idea except that ice plant isn't native.  The Coastal Commission and most environmental groups would like to get rid of it.

Chuck Brown

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2007, 01:27:22 PM »
Not to take this topic too far off track, but I saw a similar thing in looking at satellite photgraphy of Seminole.  The house on the ocean on Seminole's south boundary (Seminole Blvd. and Seminole Beach Rd.) has its own Dick Wilson-appearing green.
Is that/was that George Coleman's house?  Is that the place where Ben Hogan was filmed in Coleman's home movies, hitting balls into the Atlantic Ocean?

Joel_Stewart

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2007, 01:55:25 PM »
JUST AS $6,000-a-day penalties were set to hit the owner of a private, three-hole golf course in Pebble Beach, a Monterey County judge ordered the California Coastal Commission not to enforce its ruling that the course be destroyed.

The order, signed by Superior Court Judge Robert O'Farrell, came as Robert Feduniak, a retired Wall Street executive, filed a lawsuit against the coastal commission for deciding the lush course in his front yard has to be replaced with native plants. It's a legal battle Feduniak -- an expert on commodities trading and a well known high-stakes poker player -- expects to win, according to his lawyer, Doc Etienne.

"He's very determined," Etienne said.

Last July, the coastal commission told Feduniak he had to remove the golf course because a previous owner of the property, Bert Bonanno, agreed to create a "conservation easement" on the land in 1983 in order to get a permit to build a new house. The house was finished in 1985, and the course was built soon after, according to legal documents. Three years ago, Bonanno sold the property to Feduniak for $13 million.

"I was highly motivated to buy the property because of the lovely, three-hole course at the front," Feduniak said in a deposition submitted to O'Farrell. He said he was unaware the course might not be legal, and he was "completely astonished" when he found out last December he was the target of a coastal commission enforcement action. Because the small golf course has existed for more than 17 years in full view of everyone on 17 Mile Drive, "it would be unjust and inequitable for me to be required to remove it," Feduniak said.

Instead, he is willing to contribute up to $500,000 for "off-site mitigation" elsewhere in Pebble Beach. The president of the Del Monte Forest Foundation, Jeff Craig, said the contribution would be welcome.

"It isn't up to us to decide what is done with the small golf course," Craig said. "But, personally, I think it would be more worthwhile to restore existing natural habitat, rather than manufacture habitat on Feduniak's property." His group has pinpointed two sites -- Indian Village and Pescadero Canyon -- where Feduniak's half-million dollars could be well spent.

But the coastal commission rejected Feduniak's offer.

"The current owners didn't put that thing in there, but there's no way we can simply say that's too bad and let them keep it," the coastal commission's enforcement officer, Sheila Ryan, told the San Jose Mercury News.

According to the commission, Feduniak's property is ESHA -- environmentally sensitive habitat area -- for which the Coastal Act requires protection.

But Etienne maintains that determination was based on flimsy evidence that won't hold up in court. Before Bonanno built the house and the golf course, the lot was overrun with invasive, non-native Hottentot fig iceplant, just as most of the neighboring properties are even today, Etienne said. Furthermore, the original coastal permit for the property does not say the land is ESHA, a review of court documents showed.

The coastal commission also said the golf course must be removed because it isn't "visually compatible" with surrounding areas. But Feduniak maintains that his small course, which is right next to the 13th Fairway of the ultra-exclusive Cypress Point golf course, merely "continues the golf course/ocean interplay occurring . . . along this stretch of coastline."

The commission gave Feduniak until Sept. 21 to stop watering his elaborate landscape and prepare a plan to "restore and revegetate" it, or face fines of $6,000 per day -- a deadline now moot because of the temporary restraining order issued by O'Farrell. The judge scheduled a hearing Oct. 17 to decide whether to continue his order until a trial can be held on the merits of Feduniak's suit.

TEPaul

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2007, 02:14:20 PM »
I'm sorry, I was wrong, the book (The Match) did not say that house off the 13th green was George Coleman's. The book said Coleman always rented the same house up in the hills from an oilman friend of his.

The book mentioned the house off the 13th green was Bing Crosby's house.

Is that house in the photo above the house that Bing Crosby used to own?

JMEvensky

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #18 on: December 28, 2007, 02:40:49 PM »
Anyone know the relationship of Bert Bonanno to Joe?

Ken Moum

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #19 on: December 28, 2007, 02:51:46 PM »
The book mentioned the house off the 13th green was Bing Crosby's house.

Is that house in the photo above the house that Bing Crosby used to own?

As a long-time watcher of the Clambake, I think Bing had a house on Pebble Beach, not on Cypress Point. Besides, didn't Bob say the house was built in 1983? Crosby died in 1977.

Given earlier discussions here, it's entirely possible the book has mislocated the house.

Ken
« Last Edit: December 28, 2007, 02:53:19 PM by kmoum »
Over time, the guy in the ideal position derives an advantage, and delivering him further  advantage is not worth making the rest of the players suffer at the expense of fun, variety, and ultimately cost -- Jeff Warne, 12-08-2010

Steve Lapper

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #20 on: December 28, 2007, 02:59:53 PM »
Anyone know the relationship of Bert Bonanno to Joe?

Yes
The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking."--John Kenneth Galbraith

Bob_Huntley

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #21 on: December 28, 2007, 03:02:09 PM »
The book mentioned the house off the 13th green was Bing Crosby's house.

Is that house in the photo above the house that Bing Crosby used to own?

As a long-time watcher of the Clambake, I think Bing had a house on Pebble Beach, not on Cypress Point. Besides, didn't Bob say the house was built in 1983? Crosby died in 1977.

Given earlier discussions here, it's entirely possible the book has mislocated the house.

Ken

Tom,

Crosby's house was on the 13th fairway of Pebble Beach, not Cypress Point.

Adam,

The caddies had a lot to say about the house owner, most of it wrong.

Joel,

I should have gotten more up to date information from Doc Etienne and his client's suit, he is my attorney as well.

Bob


TEPaul

Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #22 on: December 28, 2007, 03:41:30 PM »
"Tom,
Crosby's house was on the 13th fairway of Pebble Beach, not Cypress Point."

Bob;

I see but we should not quibble over such a minor point.

David_Tepper

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #23 on: December 28, 2007, 03:42:38 PM »
Joel S. & Bob H. -

While I am no legal expert, it would seem Mr. Feduniak (the current owner) would have a substantial legal claim against Mr. Bonanno (the prior owner), if, in fact, Mr. Feduniak purchased the house from Mr. Bonanno without being advised by Mr. Bonanno of his outstanding obligation to the Coastal Commission to create a "conservation easement."

Although we are only reading Feduniak's side of the story, it sounds like Bonanno possibly sold the house without full disclosure.

DT    

Nick Church

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Re:Curious - The House Adjacent to Cypress Point's 13th Green?
« Reply #24 on: December 28, 2007, 04:07:35 PM »
Not to take this topic too far off track, but I saw a similar thing in looking at satellite photgraphy of Seminole.  The house on the ocean on Seminole's south boundary (Seminole Blvd. and Seminole Beach Rd.) has its own Dick Wilson-appearing green.
Is that/was that George Coleman's house?  Is that the place where Ben Hogan was filmed in Coleman's home movies, hitting balls into the Atlantic Ocean?

Google Maps does show that.  Good eye.

Some mighty fine looking houses in that area, too.

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