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TEPaul

Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« on: December 14, 2007, 11:45:39 AM »
This week Bob Crosby and I spent most of a day in New York looking through old original copies of London's "Field" magazine from the old days for some specific articles.

I'd never seen London's "Field" magazine before but I did grow up with England's "Country Life" magazine.

First of all, in my opinion, "Field" was about five times more written and directed at the GB rural aristocracy of the old "estate/farm" culture and all that that particular world meant socially, recreationally and economically. The "Field" probably has about ten times more content in it too in that regard than "Country Life" magazine ever did.

One thing that struck me about the size of that weekly magazine and the remarkably small print of it was that culture must have had a ton of time to read! Those weekly magazines were essentially the content size of a medium-sized book.

The topics covered weekly were also voluminous and some almost hilarious---eg "Kenneling", "Coursing", "Canoeing", and numerous other estate and sporting recreations I've barely heard of.

Golf always had a section too, although it appears perhaps 75% of the time it was dedicated to tournment reporting.

But when it wasn't it had some very sophisticated articles about golf architecture---eg a six part "series" on the philosophy of bunkers and bunkering. Believe me, this website would be fascinated in that series and discussing what it said back then and the similarity of what's discussed in that vein on here today.

But the thing that struck me, as good and as sophisticated as was some of the writing and content, was the writers were almost always anonymous. The only hint the magazine gave of who these people were writing for the "Field" about golf was that they were a 'team of experts'.

Of course for Bob and I that's somewhat maddening. We suspected one of them had to be Charles Ambrose even if he did write at least one article we saw under his own name. But that particular article was not much more than a quoted reprint of someone else's named article in another magazine.

Who were those golf writers and why did they so often not use their names or even byline pseudonyms in the "Field" back then?

In American, in some of the old golf magazines such as American Golfer and Golf Illustrated they frequently used byline pseudonyms and sometimes pretty humorous ones but very infrequently used their actual names. We probably know who most of them were such as Tillinghast as "Hazard" or perhaps "Joe Bunker" or even "Billy Bunker".

Many on this website don't like pseudonyms or anonymity but who really cares and why did they use both so often back then?

Did it allow them to write more honestly and openly and critically?

I'd say so, and thank God for it! but I still wish I knew more about who those writers back then really were.  ;)
« Last Edit: December 14, 2007, 11:52:13 AM by TEPaul »

Dan Kelly

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Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2007, 12:07:14 PM »
Many on this website don't like pseudonyms or anonymity but who really cares and why did they use both so often back then?

Did it allow them to write more honestly and openly and critically?

Yes. Of course it did!

Also more viciously -- though I suppose their basic civility (and their editors) kept that from happening too often.

Can't say those forces are in play here and now.
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

JMorgan

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Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2007, 12:08:49 PM »
Absolutely.

-J-Mo

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2007, 12:27:02 PM »
"Can't say those forces are in play here and now."

Dan:

While I think the phenomenon of the instant interactive communication of the Internet may've made textual communication more vicious in some ways than it's ever been there is no question at all that some of the participants in the Crane/Behr debate, particularly Crane and Behr and even Charles Ambrose, were pretty damn vicious with each other, even bordering on personally.

So, I guess I'd have to say I disagree with you and that it's probably just human nature, and probably emanating from real passion, and not just this website and its participants as some so often suggest.  
« Last Edit: December 14, 2007, 12:28:15 PM by TEPaul »

Jim_Kennedy

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Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2007, 12:28:48 PM »
TE,
Wouldn't it tend to have that same effect on the reader, i.e. a more open, honest, and critical read?  
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Peter Pallotta

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2007, 12:31:41 PM »
TE -
I think if a magazine wants to appear to be presenting 'facts' instead of 'opinion', the anonymity of its writers is one way  to indicate that. "The Economist" has always used anonymity and continues to so for that very reason. That magazine was around when the "Field" was, and maybe it was just the prevalent style of the time. But maybe there is something more subtle going on, i.e. a conscious or unconscious belief system that there was nothing to 'debate' about golf or golf course architecture at the time, and thus no room/need for personal opinion; it was all about agreed upon 'facts'.  

On the other hand, Darwin was writing modern-style opinion pieces quite early on (I don't know if the articles you looked at pre-date him), so maybe I'm way off the mark. But if my suggestion holds water, it's interesting to think about how the state of the game/architecture was thought of back then, and whether the (slightly later?) debates between the Cranes and Behrs etc were a break with the belief system that assumed the 'facts' were apparent to all.

Peter
 

Dan Kelly

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Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2007, 12:34:19 PM »
there is no question at all that some of the participants in the Crane/Behr debate, particularly Crane and Behr and even Charles Ambrose, were pretty damn vicious with each other, even bordering on personally.

Yes, and they used their own names.

How vicious might they have gotten, anonymously?

(I certainly did not mean to suggest that "the Internet" or gca.com had invented or perfected viciousness. I merely meant to suggest that this Web site, among other Web sites, would be considerably less civilized if it lacked the "governor" of posting under our own names.)
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Joe Bausch

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2007, 12:41:40 PM »
In a PM I recently asked Phil Young about why AT went by a pseudonym in his "Joe Bunker" Philadelphia Inquirer articles.  Here was his response:

"One of the things that most don't understand was why did all of these guys back then use pen names? The answer lies in the time period and the question of what activities would make a person that most evil of all golfing people - a professional. In late 1915 the USGA declared that anyone even writing about the game and getting paid for it was a professional. This was changed about 18 months later, but it created problems for a great many talented players.

Tilly never fought or asked for re-instatement when he could because he was nearly 42 at the time and was now concentrating all of his efforts to design and writing."

Anything more to add Phil?
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2007, 12:52:10 PM »
"TE,
Wouldn't it tend to have that same effect on the reader, i.e. a more open, honest, and critical read?"

Jim:

Of course it would. How could it possibly be otherwise?

It might be true to say that there is a certain amount of arguing and even personal viciousness on this website but there's also a whole lot of "me-tooism" and attempts at consensus-making on opinions.

The thing that I think is so interesting about some of those writers back then is how remarkably original many of their opinions were----and that I REALLY like.  

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2007, 01:01:39 PM »
Tom --

You think it's our lack of anonymity that gets in the way of original thinking?

I'd respectfully suggest that originality was easier to come by in those days, because the "art" was considerably younger.

If you want original thinking, try ... oh, maybe nanotechnology.

Dan
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2007, 01:08:31 PM »
Dan:

You should be able to see that I did not say original thinking on architecture back then was some result of anonymity.

I don't believe I said that lack of anonymity on here today gets in the way of original thinking. On the other hand, I think lack of anonymity on here today certainly does get in the way of some of those who do think originally from sharing it on here!  ;)  And in some ways that's always bothered me about the way this site is now.

I think it was probably more a function of that time and probably largely for the reason you just gave---the art of man-made golf architecture was younger then and consequently more unformed and uninformed including a lot less general perception amongst golfers of the way things should and shouldn't be compared with today over 80 years later.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2007, 01:11:43 PM by TEPaul »

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2007, 01:10:34 PM »
Tom --

Oh, I see!

You decided to change the subject, and just forgot to say so!

(Emoticons omitted.)

Dan
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2007, 01:16:31 PM »
No, Dan, I believe it is you who is trying change the subject! ;)

(Emoticon included)

You know, I certainly don't mind you playing the part of the constant writing editor on here but I do think it shouldn't be all you do on here.

I'm pretty confident you do know exactly what many are saying and trying to say on here even if you may not  particularly like the way they say it or write it!  ;)
« Last Edit: December 14, 2007, 01:18:49 PM by TEPaul »

Bob_Huntley

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Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #13 on: December 14, 2007, 01:25:31 PM »
Tom,


The Times golf reporting was for decades written by "Our Correspondent" even though everyone knew it to be Bernard Darwin.

I daresay it may well have been something to do with the lilly-whiteness of the Corinthian ideal.

Bob

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2007, 01:42:57 PM »
"I daresay it may well have been something to do with the lilly-whiteness of the Corinthian ideal."

Bob:

Hmmm, sounds interesting but I'm afraid you went clear over my head there. What is that?

« Last Edit: December 14, 2007, 01:45:22 PM by TEPaul »

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2007, 01:49:58 PM »
Bob:

On the other hand, would you say when the Corinthian Ideal was at its pinnacle gays were totally in the closet, totally out of the closet, or was the closet door somewhat ajar leading them to dream of springing head-first out of the closet even if they preferred not to write about such things as gayness and closets and doors?  ;)

Mike_Cirba

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2007, 01:50:07 PM »
Absolutely.

-J-Mo

J-Mo.

I love it!  

You are definitely going to have to come to Philadelphia where we'll take you down to the 'hood with Huge Puffy Wilson and posse and I think you'll be representin' just fine.  ;D

JMorgan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2007, 02:06:52 PM »
Absolutely.

-J-Mo

J-Mo.

I love it!  

You are definitely going to have to come to Philadelphia where we'll take you down to the 'hood with Huge Puffy Wilson and posse and I think you'll be representin' just fine.  ;D

Rittenhouzzzze yo.

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2007, 02:09:29 PM »
MikeC:

Do you think J-Mo is a blood relative of Flo-Jo or J-Lo? If so I'd say his chances of gettin' raped by Huge Puffy or somebody else in the Philly 'hood is pretty MFing good, wouldn't you----even if he screams Rittenhoooouzze yo at the top of his lungs?
« Last Edit: December 14, 2007, 02:13:18 PM by TEPaul »

Phil_the_Author

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2007, 02:09:32 PM »
As a practice, using pseudonyms when writing articles for golf journals go back to before the turn of the century. Probably the most important reason for doing so was to maintain the appearance of not being or having anything to do with the professional side of the game of golf as possible.

For example, the January 1898 issue of GolfUSGABulletin has articles by C.B. Macdonald, W. Proudfoot and several others whose names have become long-forgotten. Yet also within its pages is an article written by a regular contributor known only as "Niblick." (Sorry, I can't remember off-hand who Niblick was and I can't locate where I wrote it down!)

He would continue writing under this pseudonym for a number of different journals, including Golf Illustrated into the the 1930's.

The culture of the game translated over to the what was written about it and by whom, and the culture of golf, up to the mid-20's at least, was dominated by the great amateurs.

The professionals as a group were slow in gaining influence, despite the triumphs of Hagen and others individually.

It was after the amateur debates in the teens that Tilly, having been declared a professional for good in 1918 by the ruling that year of the the USGA stopped using his pseudonym of "Hazard." In fact, it was a column about the death of his father, B.C. Tillinghast, in May of 1918, in which he explained how almost all of the poetry found in the "Hazard" columns had been written by him, that he came "officially" out in the open identifying himself as "Hazard."

In 1916, Tilly was 41 years old when Wanamaker gathered that small group at the Taplow Room and formed the PGA of America. Tilly was there and a contributor to the meeting and discussions. Yet, most likely because he still held out hope that he would be able to keep his status as an amateur as the USGA was flip-flopping on the issue during these years, he never signed the original charter as most of the others present did.

Tom, I believe that Rand Jerris knows the names of those behind most of the pseudonyms.

Neil_Crafter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #20 on: December 14, 2007, 03:33:29 PM »
Bob
Many of Darwin's contributions in The Times were under the by-line of "Our Golf Correspondent", however, there were many he wrote where they allowed him his actual name. We know Darwin wrote a significant number of the humorous and entertaining "Fourth Leader" columns for The Times but these definitely had no attribution by Darwin or anybody eles - in trying to identify them you have to look for his prose style and habit of introducing quotations, especially from Dickens.

The idea of golf writers writing ander pseudonyms happened in newspapers and golf magazines here in Australia too, with names like "P.A.R" and "Niblick".

Neil

Bob_Huntley

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Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #21 on: December 14, 2007, 03:47:04 PM »
Bob:

On the other hand, would you say when the Corinthian Ideal was at its pinnacle gays were totally in the closet, totally out of the closet, or was the closet door somewhat ajar leading them to dream of springing head-first out of the closet even if they preferred not to write about such things as gayness and closets and doors?  ;)


Tom,

In Britain the Corinthian ideal was that sport should not be sullied by money. A very famous English club competed in the Amateur Football leagues, it's membership consisted mostly of Public School Boys(non State schools).

As for gays, there must have been lots of 'em, otherwise how could Oscar Wilde get into so much trouble?. It has been suggested that a very long hitting British Walker Cupper of the twenties and thirties was somewhat light in his brogues.

Bob  

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #22 on: December 14, 2007, 04:17:40 PM »
I had always supposed that the pseudonyms were due in part to the writers' employers not wanting them to use their byline in "lesser" publications ... ie, it was okay to write elsewhere as long as you were anonymous.

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #23 on: December 14, 2007, 04:33:17 PM »
"As for gays, there must have been lots of 'em, otherwise how could Oscar Wilde get into so much trouble?."

Bob:

I think what you must mean is even if there were lots of them few were willing to be remotely public about it as apparently Oscar Wilde was. Either that or Oscar got into the trouble he did by picking the wrong guy's father to go even semi-public about it!   ;)

If one was as outrageous and as smart as Oscar was with the kind of sense of humor he had I guess it was probably inevitable anyway.

But what the hell, Reading Gaol was obviously a good venue for him to be inspired to come up with one of my favorite poems of all time!

TEPaul

Re:Pseudonyms and anonymity in the old days
« Reply #24 on: December 14, 2007, 04:36:07 PM »
Neil:

I think I'm safe in saying that the Americans writing for golf publications used pseudonyms more frequently than on the other side because the USGA was a whole lot more doctrinaire about writing on golf for money than they were at the time on the other side.