[Andy Troeger]

I've been doing some searching on this but haven't found much of note. Are there any hidden gems in West Texas that would be worth a 5 hour (+/-) road trip to play (from Albuquerque).

I've got Rawls in Lubbock and Painted Dunes in El Paso on the radar but especially with Rawls it would be nice to have one other course to visit in the general vicinity. Any ideas?

[Mike Nuzzo]

I'd be curious to see what the Fazio organization did in El Paso at the Butterfield Trail.
There is a web site...

[Andy Troeger]

http://www.butterfieldtrailgolf.com/butterfieldindex.asp?id=172&page=3494

Here's the website. Thanks Mike!

[Matt_Ward]

Andy:

Painted Dunes is a fine Ken Dye layout and, if memory serves, has hosted the first round stage for PGA Tour qualifying a few times.

The layout from what I have heard is really hurting on the turf side -- my last visit there was 4-5 years ago so maybe others can weigh in on what's happening now.

The course has plenty of unique holes and anyone treking through the I-10 corridor it's a definite play to break up all that wonderful scenery that is West Texas.

[David Stamm]

Andy, are you limited to only the West Texas area? If not why not think about Pa Ko or Pinon?

[Andy Troeger]

David,
I live in Albuquerque, so I've played both of those and gone to Colorado and Arizona too. Just looking for some new options. Paa-Ko and Pinon are both very worthwhile places to play in their own right.

Mainly looking for something that might be a bit warmer this winter since ABQ is at 5,000 feet and does get some winter weather (although El Paso does too...not always at the same time though).

[Trey Kemp]

Andy-

I grew up in Amarillo so I have played most of the courses in West Texas Area.  After the Rawls Course I would recommend:

Painted Dunes - El Paso, TX (Ken Dye)
Midland Country Club - Midland, TX (Ralph Plummer)
La Paloma - Amarillo, TX (Jeff Blume)
Butterfield - El Paso, TX (Tom Fazio)
Gaines Country Country Club - Siminole, TX

To me Gaines County is true West Texas golf.  Its not going to make any of the rankings for best courses, but for about $20 it might be the best value in the state.  

Have a good trip and let us know how it goes.

[David Stamm]

David,
I live in Albuquerque, so I've played both of those and gone to Colorado and Arizona too. Just looking for some new options. Paa-Ko and Pinon are both very worthwhile places to play in their own right.

Mainly looking for something that might be a bit warmer this winter since ABQ is at 5,000 feet and does get some winter weather (although El Paso does too...not always at the same time though).

Understood. I'll second Trey's recommendation of Midland CC if you can get access. Both of Odessa CC's aren't bad. The Old is a Bredemus and The Links is a Nugent. Again, if you can get access, they woould make a fun 36 hole day.

[Bart Bradley]

Have you tried the courses in Riudoso, NM...those might be the best choices close to Lubbock....Inn of the Mountain Gods was a lot of fun and a private course, Alto has 9 good holes..

Bart

[David Stamm]

Have you tried the courses in Riudoso, NM...those might be the best choices close to Lubbock....Inn of the Mountain Gods was a lot of fun and a private course, Alto has 9 good holes..

Bart

Bart, I thought IOTMG's was a resort?

[Andy Troeger]

Bart,
Links at Sierra Blanca in Ruidoso is also worth playing there, by our own Jeff Brauer. The back nine is fun, the front is kind of squeezed into a small area and has some funky mounds but is fun to play.

Haven't played Inn of the Mountain Gods yet but want to do so this summer when the new Rainmakers Course opens (RTJ Jr) if I can manage it. Being in the mountains those courses tend to get a fair amount of snow in the winter.

Thanks all for the suggestions!

[Andy Troeger]

Inn of the Mtn Gods is a resort. Alto Lakes is private. Links at Sierra Blanca is also public, Rainmakers private. I want to say there's another new course that's going to be built there shortly but I can't remember why I think I heard that.

Rainmakers looks like it could be pretty good in its own right. I think the website is www.rainmakersusa.com

[David Stamm]

Thanks Andy. I misunderstood which course he was referring to. My bro-in-law goes there to play alot. He's told me we need to go, but I've got plenty of Ted Rob to choose from here.

[Sam Morrow]

While I've played many of the courses in Texas I haven't played much west Texas golf. I've played the 6 hole course in Silver City, the 9 holer in Lamesa (played golf with two very strong blondes from the area) and the Rawls Course. The Rawls Course is probably in my Texas Top 5. Other good things I've heard in West Texas would be Hillcrest in Lubbock, Midland Country Club, Lajitas, Painted Dunes, Butterfield, and I've heard great things about Quicksand in San Angelo.

[Andy Troeger]

Thanks Andy. I misunderstood which course he was referring to. My bro-in-law goes there to play alot. He's told me we need to go, but I've got plenty of Ted Rob to choose from here.

Inn of the Mtn Gods is the only one of the New Mexico top ten public courses I haven't played (all in the last 13 months or so otherwise) although not because I wasn't interested. I've heard good things, but its more in terms of the scenery and the area more than anything related to great architecture. Its probably worth playing, but not sure how far I would travel for the priviledge. Personally though I love the name!

Overall, I knew there had to be more in West Texas than I had heard about. Will have to look up some of these towns to figure where the heck they are in relation to each other

[Sam Morrow]

Thanks Andy. I misunderstood which course he was referring to. My bro-in-law goes there to play alot. He's told me we need to go, but I've got plenty of Ted Rob to choose from here.

Inn of the Mtn Gods is the only one of the New Mexico top ten public courses I haven't played (all in the last 13 months or so otherwise) although not because I wasn't interested. I've heard good things, but its more in terms of the scenery and the area more than anything related to great architecture. Its probably worth playing, but not sure how far I would travel for the priviledge. Personally though I love the name!

Overall, I knew there had to be more in West Texas than I had heard about. Will have to look up some of these towns to figure where the heck they are in relation to each other

You could also head out to Ft. Stockton and Andrews, both towns have little courses that have spawned Tour players.

[Matt_Ward]

Gents:

Midland by Ralph Plummer is quite good -- it's just not as good as Painted Dunes IMHO. Midland is fairly one-dimensional as the land is quite boring but Plummer beefed up a number of holes with good driving lanes that must be negotiated with constant skill.

In regards to Inn of the Mtn Gods I have not been back in a number of years and I understand that additional dollars were pumped into the facility and possibly the course.

When I played there I was seriously underwhelmed by the course. It did look good but just about anything would have given the surrounding scenery.

Places like Black and Paa-Ko are as far ahead of Inn of the Mtn Gods as the air plane is to the automobile.

One last note -- Links at Sierra Blanca is quite fun to play. Much better than I expected and a good few steps ahead of Inn of the Mtn Gods.

[Trey Kemp]

I played at the Inn of the Mountain Gods about 2 years ago and it was okay.  They have renovated the resort and casino which is very nice, but I would not make a special trip to go and play it.

I also played out at Alto and the Links that same weekend and they were both in great shape.  Alto has a very fun back nine, but the front is a little bland.  The Links is my favorite course in the Ruiodoso area.  It was built on an old airport runway so it sits in a valley and has some pretty good views of the surrounding mountains along with some good golf holes.

I look forward to playing Rainmaker next summer and have also heard there is a Fazio course coming soon.  Does anyone have any information on this course?

[Jeff_Brauer]

Kelly,

Good to see you back.....

Odessa CC now controls what was Mission Dorado, a Killian and Nugent design dating to 1981. It has hosted a Nationwide Tour event, and yours truly drew most plans, while Bob Lohman moved down there to implement.  For anyone who goes, the grass bunker on the front right of the first green (as it used to be) was a reason I left.  KN said "we don't do grass bunkers.......

I think they use the original OCC clubhouse, added a range, and turned the 3rd to the first hole for an 18 hole loop.  Probably sold the Mission Dorado range off for condos or something.

Ratliff Ranch is an early Brauer 18, underfunded and struggling for many years. I think they redid irrigation and cart paths last year, but when I saw it, the fw were brought in to match any available sprinklers that were working!

We also added the nine holes to Ken Dyes fine El Paso Painted Dunes.

Then there is the Legendary Tumbleweed Hills......which you can really find most small Texas towns......

BTW, if Andy is waiting until next year, I think my redo of Weeks Park in Wichita Falls will be worth a drive.  And I may have another course in that area the year after that.

[David Stamm]

I think they use the original OCC clubhouse, added a range, and turned the 3rd to the first hole for an 18 hole loop.  Probably sold the Mission Dorado range off for condos or something.

 

There's a brand new clubhouse now Jeff, quite nice actually. The old Mission one was sold off and is being used as medical offices. I believe it's the old 5th that's hole number 1 now, the one right after the par 3 with the carry over water.

[Jay Flemma]

Andy you hit the nail on the head...there's not too much that's particularly close to the Rawls Course!  I'd say they should build a course smack between the Rawls Course and Black Mesa...that way you have a little trail between Rawls and BM without a seven hour drive.  I did that drive last year...it was almost as bad as Seattle to Bandon/Scottsdale to Las Vegas.

[Andy Troeger]

Jay,
If it took you seven hours I think you took a bad route (more like 5-6) but the trail is definitely the Santa Fe/Albuquerque corridor up and down I-25 considering you have Black Mesa, Marty Sanchez, Paa-Ko Ridge, Pueblo de Cochiti, Twin Warrior, Santa Ana, Sandia, and UNM all in that one area. Las Campanas is there too for those that can access it, haven't played it yet myself.

There isn't ANYTHING between Lubbock or Amarillo and ABQ though. Not just talking golf here...its hard to find a gas station!

[Andy Troeger]

Made my trip to Texas the last two days and played Painted Dunes Desert GC (East and West nines--the original 18) designed by Ken Dye and Butterfield Trail designed by Tom Fazio.

Played Painted Dunes yesterday. You could tell it was a Ken Dye course by the greens which were large with many multiple tiers (not as many as Pinon Hills but not altogether different either). Some of them are raised and have a wonderful variety of potential pin placements. The land for the course was pretty flat and featureless, reminded me of Talking Stick North a bit in that regard. It has a lot of potential, but its really taking a beating on the conditioning side. Evidently rabbits of all things have been the culprit. I'm not sure I believe the course is in wonderful shape on a normal basis, but hopefully its normally better than its current status. The design is well worth playing, but its hard to recommend at present.

Butterfield Trail was a pleasant surprise. Fazio moved a lot of earth (per the head pro who was nice enough to join me) and really created an interesting course on what was essentially a blank slate (also pretty flat desert surrounds). There is not a ton of elevation change by the standards of the Mountain Time Zone, but enough to make the course more interesting. The course has some central hazards and well place bunkers that challenge the better players' line without being overly imposing for the average golfer. If in El Paso, Butterfield Trail is the place to play IMO. If Painted Dunes corrects the turf issues the two would make a nice two days of golf.

[Mark Smolens]

We played Painted Dunes three years ago when the mighty Wildcats played in the Sun Bowl, and I thought the course was in pretty good shape (at least compared to the two public courses I had played in Houston that same week).  We didn't get much breeze, but you could certainly see that the wind would be a big factor there.  Hope they can get their act together on the conditioning, but the course was a ghost town when we were there -- and that was when a bunch of out-of-towners were in for a bowl game!

[Andy Troeger]

Mark,
Maybe they are on to something now...the place was PACKED Saturday! At $32 to walk on a Saturday it'd be a great deal if they can get the turf back.

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