News:

This discussion group is best enjoyed using Google Chrome, Firefox or Safari.


Mike_Cirba

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #25 on: November 19, 2007, 07:11:40 PM »
Man, is there any way to get that interview posted permanently above the urinals in the restrooms in Far Hills so that these guys have to read it every day for the next five or so years?

Derek_Duncan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #26 on: November 19, 2007, 07:36:01 PM »
In addition to being arguably the most significant architect of the last 40 years, Pete Dye is also one of the most candid and accessible to golf writers. He's a fantastic interview. In fact, I know I'm not alone in saying that over the years I've heard/read many of these sentiments from him almost verbatim (I thought I was reading an interview I did with him recently), and yet it never gets old to hear.

Good job Jay. I do wish you would have cleared out more room in part one for when he was talking about the cost of building holes. I think there's much important to learn there for the general public regarding the cost of golf and construction. He's getting at something fundamental there, in my opinion.
www.feedtheball.com -- a podcast about golf architecture and design
@feedtheball

Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #27 on: November 19, 2007, 07:50:26 PM »
Jay,
Good interview...
Mike
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Mike Sweeney

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #28 on: November 19, 2007, 08:08:08 PM »
Jay,

Very interesting. I am more intrigued by Pound Ridge as those pictures did not match up to anything in this interview.

Thanks

Mark Smolens

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #29 on: November 19, 2007, 08:34:41 PM »
I had a chance to meet Mr. Dye after a round at Whistling Straits (he played in front of us with Herb Kohler), and waited on the hill and watched us much up the 18th.  We ended up in the bar talking for about an hour about the course, the problems in building it, his love for a place like Prestwick.  This was about 6 years ago I think, but he was clearly just a guy who enjoyed sitting around talking about golf courses and golf.  

Great interview Jay, but it's too bad his views on the modern golf ball, and its effect on golf courses, will have no real impact.

PThomas

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #30 on: November 19, 2007, 08:51:17 PM »
fwiw, in his book Pete says about Radrick Farms that it was "built by a contractor who was unable to implement many of the creative ideas I envisioned.  That experience made us [he and Alice] question where we were headed....I felt we needed to focus on what type of Pete and Alide Dye golf course we wanted to design in the years ahead"
199 played, only Augusta National left to play!

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #31 on: November 19, 2007, 09:46:37 PM »
Wow, that was fun!   ;D

Jay, compared to the answers Mr. Dye gave to Ran in Dec. 2000 here in the GCA.com interview section, it almost seems like Ol Pete needed to purge all he was holding in!   ;) ;D 8)

If a fellow couldn't learn plenty of real world stuff about GCA and how the modern design is effected by B&I and TV perceptions from Dye's comments in Jay's interview, he should take up ping-pong.

Jay, do you get any sense from talking to Pete Dye that he gives a darn about ratings?  

And, do you think he was talking about Bill McBride when he mentioned the guy that lives two minutes from his fine course and puts his clubs and wife on a plane and leaves in season to go play in the howling links of Scotland nearly every year?  As he says, heck no that guy isn't joe Average golfer, he's down right ardent.  ;) ;D 8)
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Tony Ristola

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #32 on: November 20, 2007, 02:55:58 AM »
"Well, most of the golf courses are built by people in the golf course design business... With the pros, it’s a side line...  I don’t think there’s many out there that are into it for real... they have no idea what’s going on, or any understanding."

Does this stuff come as a surprise to the guys that have worked in the field with Pete Dye. Publicly taking the gloves off, or has this come with age? I can't recall him taking on the USGA in this manner; on equipment or maintenance, or mocking the game called signature design.

My guess is most of the vast changes he discusses (technology, maintenance, signature designers) probably achieved their destructive level after most had left to go out on their own.


Jim Nugent

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #33 on: November 20, 2007, 03:45:47 AM »
Great interview, Jay.

Dye said about Harbor Town, "But I built this course, and Jack I remember his biggest input at one time, he said, “why don’t you build the smallest greens in the world?”

If that was Jack's biggest input, is it stretching things to give him co-designer credit?  

Rich Goodale

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #34 on: November 20, 2007, 04:04:22 AM »
Good and informative intereview, Jay.  As Officer Daley says above, not quite up to Ran's Minimalist standards, but good, nonetheless.  Lots of excellent points for constructive discussion.

Jim

If all Jack did was to suggest the small greens, he does deserve credit, IMO.  It is the most unique and intriguing characteristic of Harbourtown and the one which leads some people, including me, to sometimes refer to it as "great."

Rich

Jay Flemma

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #35 on: November 20, 2007, 11:01:46 AM »
Mike S->  I only saw the pictures of Pound Ridge, so I just can't tell.  I'll have to go up and walk the property and look.  The pictures were pretty to look at, but I can't tell just form them.

RJ and the gentlemen who asked if I thought Pete cares about ratings->  if ever there was a gentleman who seemed secure and happy and unaffected,it was Pete.  again, I stress "seemed."  I only met him for four hours and talked for a few on the phone.  Ran asked Pete some excellent questions, it's just that Pete is practical and doesn't sit around typing all day.  i don't think there was a purge thing going on.  I was advised that if I wanted to get deep answers, the best way was to talk to him and record it.  He was a joy to interview...I asked a question, he talked for minutes at a time.

I was most impressed with his exquisite humility and grace as a person.  Do you know he rescued an abused dog and that's the family pet?  "sixty" is her name -  a mutt, not a pure-bred and a well-trained and gentle old dog.  he lives in a modest but warm ranch in Florida.  Plus, how can one not be impressed with the relationship between Pete and Alice...a life long love affair.  I'll post some of that soon, he tells the story of how he met her and some funny courtship anecdotes.  Heck, maybe I should interview Alice some time:)

On the Jack and Pete thing, maybe I should have explored that more.  I dont think Jack was just a "player consultant" but he also wasn;t a tail wagging the dog.  I think the truth is in the middle.  It was '69, so my GUESS is that Jack's star, on the rise, but not the supernova it is now, allowed him room to comment, but not dominate.  I could be wrong and maybe some of you older fellas may know something I dont.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #36 on: November 20, 2007, 02:00:44 PM »
I wonder if that dog isn't a second generation "Sixty".  I heard stories of how the dog was having a ball running around the Whistling Straits site.  Isn't he named after a piece of construction equipment or tractor, with a sixty horse engine?

ONe of the funny lines I heard one of his associates say, was how Pete would come on site at Whistling, enjoy the fire up and smell of the diesel fuel in the morning, have Sixty run around, then make it back to his quarters early enough to watch "Hogan's Heros".   ;) ;D
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #37 on: November 20, 2007, 02:12:35 PM »
Jay asked me to post these...  I was playing in 1998 opening of the Whistling Straits, first ever outing.  I ran into these two love birds there.  I was already pretty beat up and dissevled, Simon Hobday style, by the time I reached 17 tee where Pete was keenly watching how groups were playing the controversial hole.  While we waited for other groups backed up, due to so many going over the edge down to the abyss along the beach Pete gave me a fast primer on how they transformed the previously unremarkable flat lakeside fields.  Thus, I wanged it up.  But as my disclaimer says below my posts...  ::) ;D 8)


No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Mark Smolens

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #38 on: November 20, 2007, 03:10:19 PM »
As a newbie on this site, and not very good at searching past threads (being a largely computer illiterate lawyer not a computer person) I will presume that 17 at the Straits Course has been the subject of discourse here.  Seems to me as a customer, not a designer, that the hole makes much more sense with the big rock on the left side of the green, not the right.  When it's blowing hard to the east, the "average" (event the average ardent) player has little chance of getting the ball on the surface of the green.  Mr. Dye told me I was a pussy when I told him that, but I've hit too many good shots that ended up dead on that friggin hole. . .

Jay Flemma

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #39 on: November 20, 2007, 03:26:00 PM »
Mark, what kind of lawyer are you?

I have to get out to Whistling and I hear good things about Big Fish too.

Thanks for pulling those pix from the Finis Africae, Brother William!  

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #40 on: November 20, 2007, 04:11:33 PM »
Jay,

Any mention of his long delayed new course in New Jersey being built on a sand mine? It's somewhere near Manahawkin.

« Last Edit: November 20, 2007, 04:11:53 PM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Jay Flemma

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #41 on: November 20, 2007, 04:42:43 PM »
Yes there was!!!!  He said that it was the first time he ever got to design on sand.  I'll post that soon...along with his remembrances of Doak and stuff about Alice.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #42 on: November 20, 2007, 05:08:50 PM »
Does anyone know if the plans are dead for Pete donating his time for the design of a course on a Cistercian or Benedictine monestary grounds in Sparta Wisconsin?  Did ol Pete mention anything about donating for indulgences to balance out all the Dyabolical stuff he's done, Jay?  ;) ;D
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Jay Flemma

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #43 on: November 20, 2007, 05:13:37 PM »
Does anyone know if the plans are dead for Pete donating his time for the design of a course on a Cistercian or Benedictine monestary grounds in Sparta Wisconsin?  Did ol Pete mention anything about donating for indulgences to balance out all the Dyabolical stuff he's done, Jay?  ;) ;D

Pete had nothing to say about that, but ol' Jaques of Cohors wanted to require an indulgance of a "mulligan" only upon payment of seven crowns for every double bogey carded in Avignon.

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #44 on: November 20, 2007, 05:15:33 PM »
Does anyone know if the plans are dead for Pete donating his time for the design of a course on a Cistercian or Benedictine monestary grounds in Sparta Wisconsin?  Did ol Pete mention anything about donating for indulgences to balance out all the Dyabolical stuff he's done, Jay?  ;) ;D

Brother Dick (or whatever) --

This is the last I've heard of it -- an Associated Press report from October of 1999:

SPARTA, Wis.  - A monastery planning the longest golf course in Wisconsin has decided to solicit private donations for the $7 million project designed by world-renowned course designer Pete Dye.

Our Lady of Spring Bank Cistercian Abbey, a Roman Catholic community of monks in the Town of Angelo east of Sparta, hopes to build ``The Monastery,'' what would be an 18-hole golf course. The course will support the monastery.

``This legacy will carry long into the new millennium,'' said the Rev. Bernard McCoy, a spokesman for the monks. ``We will carry out charitable causes locally, nationally and internationally with scholarships, education, aid to arts and culture, aid to the poor in various ways, helping out Third World nations and mission lands, build churches, whatever.''

McCoy, a spokesman for the monks, said he hoped to start the project by April 1, 2000, and open by July of 2001.

``It's a short amount of time, but you never know ... with monks something always special seems to happen,'' McCoy said. ``If the money comes in, the bulldozers will start going out, so people can start playing sooner.''

The monks and David Colbert of Sparta announced their original plans for the course on March 30. At that time, McCoy said they hoped to begin moving earth by Aug. 15.

However, there have been alterations to the original plan. McCoy told the La Crosse Tribune on Wednesday, McCoy said that rather than developing a corporation made up of investors, the monks, Dye and Colbert have decided to fund the project through donations.

McCoy said the course will be called ``The Monastery,'' because ``it connotes everything we want it to be - peace, reverence, solitude, beauty, hospitality.''

At 7,475 yards, The Monastery will be the longest course in Wisconsin, featuring five sets of tees with bent grass throughout the 300 acres.

Dye and his assistant, Tim Liddy, took a flight into La Crosse on Tuesday and made their first official visit to the abbey and the golf course property.

``Every few minutes, Pete would get out of the truck, sift the sand, kick a few trees and look at the wildflowers,'' McCoy said. ``It was a perfect time to visit. The colors are at their peak right now.''

Dye, Liddy, McCoy and other monks from the abbey then met to finalize fund-raising plans. They actually began several months ago when Dye, a devout Catholic, agreed to waive his $500,000 design fee as an in-kind gift. The monks hope to attract more donors.

``The direction we are going at this point is to have the whole course built on a donation basis through a fund-raising campaign with the abbey as the sole owner,'' McCoy said.

``We hope people will want to help Pete Dye and the monks invest in a course that keeps giving back to the community.''

Dye has designed many major courses including Blackwolf Run and Whistling Straits in Wisconsin, Sawgrass in Ponte Vedra Beach, Fla., and Harbor Town in Hilton Head, S.C.

McCoy said the abbey will lease the land to the golf course, and although the monks own the land, it will become a separate corporation. He said that because the abbey is non-profit, it can lease the land tax free.

While the price tag for course development and clubhouse construction is $7 million, including Dye's fee, McCoy said he believes it could cost less.

"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #45 on: November 20, 2007, 05:21:48 PM »
Well, if they ever get that course built, I fully expect you and I to dress up in tunic, scapular, and cowls, and go play there.  We'll make quite a sight rolling into town from up in the hills and coulee - you leading me riding on a jackass.  Sheryl in Ogallala will donate the authentic donkey.  Maybe somebody will get murdered there and we can solve it between rounds.... ;) ;D
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Mark Smolens

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #46 on: November 20, 2007, 06:30:26 PM »
Jay, I defend police officers accused of violating the civil rights of various ne'er-do-wells in the Chicago suburbs (alas, the City does not send their many cases to outside counsel).  If you've got an opening for a group in Sheboygan, or even back inland at the River or Meadow/Valleys, I'll try to fill a spot.

Jay Flemma

Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #47 on: November 20, 2007, 06:58:17 PM »
Mark you can join my foursome any time...especially if Brother William comes along!

Hey Brother William!  Summa optimus magister!  Should we inuct Mark into the Franciscans or the Benedictines?  he might want to go with you because "herbs that are good for an old Franciscan are not good for a young Benedictine" but then again "we are famous for our tables and at Melk for our beer!"

By the way, Mark I do entertainment, intellectual property, sports and Internet Law.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #48 on: November 20, 2007, 07:49:27 PM »
Quote
Jay, I defend police officers accused of violating the civil rights of various ne'er-do-wells in the Chicago suburbs...

Wow, it really is a small world!   :o  Bill Steele, (one of our Dixie Cup participants) is an attorney in the Columbus OH area, in the same specialty biz.... and I was a P.O. violating folks civil rights!  ::) gee...  ;) ;D 8)  
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Mark Smolens

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Pete Dye Interview Part 1 and 2
« Reply #49 on: November 20, 2007, 07:56:12 PM »
Of course, with my clients all of the accusations and allegations were without merit! ;D

Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back