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Mike_Cirba

Re:Garden City, Myopia and Chicago Golf Club
« Reply #50 on: August 05, 2007, 10:13:47 AM »
The August 16, 1909 edition of "The American Golfer" (available to search and scan online at www.usga.org) has a bunch of pics of Chicago GC at the time.  

It's not the most natural looking course, that's for sure.  On the other hand, the earliest pictures I've seen of Garden City aren't exactly blended into the landscape seamlessly, either.  Each still had lots of crossing bunkers by 1904 based on what I've been able to tell.

Of course, both courses today have evolved into wonders.

How close is Myopia today to what it was in 1904 in terms of features and hazard placement?



Tom,

I was typing this just before I read yours.

I'm going to play a lost Findlay (the club didn't know who designed the course) in central PA today.   His stuff fascinates me, as well, and I hope to do more than "name courses".  

I'm just still at the "compiling data" and research stage and I certainly don't want to start spouting hypotheticals as fact....at least not yet.  ;)

TEPaul

Re:Garden City, Myopia and Chicago Golf Club
« Reply #51 on: August 05, 2007, 10:34:47 AM »
"How close is Myopia today to what it was in 1904 in terms of features and hazard placement?"

It's as close as we'll find anywhere.

The interesting thing about Myopia is the early nine holes that were reused when Leeds upped the course to 18 just after the turn of the century.

There were some early era cross bunkers on a couple of holes that have not been put back and the reason is they probably shouldn't be on those particular holes that had them. Strategically they wouldn't make much sense today, in my opinion.

My interest in the really early naturalism of Myopia, though, isn't so much the bunkering (and mounds), it's those greens and green sites. So many of them are just very cool natural landforms as are the greens of GCGC.

Michael Christensen

Re:Garden City, Myopia and Chicago Golf Club
« Reply #52 on: August 05, 2007, 05:23:26 PM »
the most fascinating hole, which no longer exists is the old 4th of the long nine.....according to MHC's history book circa 1975, it was "a blind hole playing from ground to the right of the present 9th green, to what is now the 11th green":

there are now trees between those points, unless you go way left....and the right bunker on #11 would have been a front pot bunker back in 1898....unless the 11th green was redone, it would have been a side sloping green from right (high) to left (low)...certainly different than it plays today...

and also interesting...when Myopia went to 18 holes, Leeds added 90 yards to the current #16.....making it a par-4!....."he was criticized for having too many blind shots and restored the hole to its initial dimensions"....I presume the bank going down the hill was fairway, not the whispy fescue it is today, I belive there are also rocks and other hazards on that hill too...I wonder how long that hole was in full operation??

Their 100 yr history is a great read.....has a map of the long nine along with purchase records of the land Myopia acquired......I will try to scan it.

TEPaul

Re:Garden City, Myopia and Chicago Golf Club
« Reply #53 on: August 05, 2007, 09:48:21 PM »
"and also interesting...when Myopia went to 18 holes, Leeds added 90 yards to the current #16.....making it a par-4!....."he was criticized for having too many blind shots and restored the hole to its initial dimensions"....I presume the bank going down the hill was fairway, not the whispy fescue it is today, I belive there are also rocks and other hazards on that hill too...I wonder how long that hole was in full operation??"

Michael:

That old 16th must have been pretty interesting because it appears the concept of it was copied by George Crump for his 12th hole at Pine Valley.

TEPaul

Re:Garden City, Myopia and Chicago Golf Club
« Reply #54 on: August 10, 2007, 09:38:27 AM »
Bob:

As for the club atmosphere at Myopia, I wouldn't think there's much of anything in America as old world as the atmosphere of the club and the clubhouse. Some are close but Myopia probably takes that cake. This is not the kind of clubhouse or club you'll be seeing the membership pump a couple of million dollars into any time in the next three hundred years or so. ;)

(The thing i really loved is as old as that clubhouse is, meaning it could go up in smoke like a box of matches they still allow smoking anywhere in the clubhouse other than in the ladies diningroom).

To preface a review of the course and the holes I should warn that this is not the type of course where one should be concerned about some of the length of the holes and something like a pro's ability to hit L wedges into par 4s or drive some par 4s. This is just a really old golf course (I think it may've been the first really good architecture in America) and it defends itself against scoring in other ways than distance.

Hole #1, 274 yards

It's only 274 yards from the tips but you have to drive it basically straight up hill at first and to a pretty canting right to left hill at that. You can see the flag up on the hill but you need to drive it right to take the cant of the fairway. And you need to get the tee shot pretty much inline with the green. go left and you're in high hay. Drive it right and you'll have a short approach that's probably about as hard as being next to and right of the 10th green at Riviera. The green is really narrow and the bank on the right can kick a ball right across the green and down the hill. The thing I really love about this hole is its green's left side is "false" (balls will roll right off it) and there's about 15 yards of chipping area to the left of the left side of the green meaning balls putted too strong or approaches hit too near it will leave a really hard recovery from quite a difficult distance back up to the narrow green with the chance of the ball coming right back at you. To me this is almost the ultimate in a really old fashioned golf hole (the kind nobody today would probably dare design) that just has a whole lot going for it and obviously a wide scoring spectrum too. A good player could eagle this hole or make a triple on it.

Hole #2, 487 yards

A 487 yard par 5 from a high tee set a ways up on the ridgeline to a flat fairway below with mounds along the right dividing it from the 13th fairway and high hay all along the left. A good player could probably hit a 3 wood to the end of this fairway that ends in rough across the hole with a gateway between mounds about 75 yards short of the green. The green is down a declining approach sort of reminiscent of the 2nd at NGLA. You can barely see the flag from the drive area. This kind of hole and architecture is what makes the "ideal maintenance meld" so cool on a course like this. If a good player had about 200 yards for his second shot he couldn't fly the ball much more than 170 or 175 yards to the approach to stop it on the green. Fly the ball to the green and it'll go right over. The green sits in a natural side to side swale.

Hole #3, 253 yards

This hole is original and it's almost a 250 yard par 3 with a cross bunker about 30 yards short of a gentle two tier green with mounds left. There is no way a course could be built today with the 4th tees as much in the line of fire as they are here.

Hole #4, 392 yards

All in all perhaps my favorite hole because of it's neat natural landform green. For some reason the tee shot looks much longer than it really is. If a longish player pushed his tee shot just a little bit he could hit it right over the mounds behind #7 and kill someone on that green. the fairway arcs right to left beautifully around a water hazard (no water visible) all along the left and the approach is a short iron to a green that lays on natural grade and cants bigtime from right to left and back to front and filters even putts right down into bunkers left and front.

Hole #5, 417 yards

A mostly grass cross hazard covers about 2/3 of the fairway perpindicularly forcing most golfers to right at some mounds. The approach can be pretty long into a green well protected by front right bunkering. A creek crosses the fairway about 75 yards short of the green probably complicating layups from a bad drive.

Hole #6, 260 yards

A driveable par 4 with a internal green ridge that sheds balls off the left and back of the green. A creek crosses the fairway, with a pond right and an arm of the creek guarding the entire left of the second half of the hole. The options are to try to drive it over the creek as close to the green as possible or layup before the creek with about a 6 iron off the tee. Even with a SW its mandatory to get the ball over the green's ridge or it will come right back off the green.

Hole #7, 404 yards

The drive is up to or over a ridge fairway with high hay left and right. If you don't make it to the top of the ridge the approach is blind to a fairly big green that runs gently away from play with mounds behind. The tees on #8 are perilously close to this blind green and this only goes to prove that things are never really as dangerous in golf as they at first seem. As far as I know no Myopians have been killed on the 8th tee by blind approaches to #7. This hole (and #15) had some serious cross bunkers across the hole in the old drive zone. Since this hole has no real elasticity, restoring those bunkers in the context of today's game probably doesn't make much sense.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2007, 09:49:15 AM by TEPaul »

Jeff_Perryman

Re:Garden City, Myopia and Chicago Golf Club
« Reply #55 on: September 06, 2007, 01:03:48 PM »
TE:

Is there a chance you could continue this hole by hole of Myopia.  Very facinating and there's a chance I could put this to use in the near future......