Between Carlsbad and LAX.

[Tom Huckaby]

My knock on ER has more to it than just the course. It's too   much money for what you get and the rounds there take forever. Nowhere did I state that it shouldn't be played   simply because the course itself isn't my cup of tea, so let's clear that up right now. I can name a few courses in a 30 mile radius that are better than ER (appro. acronym by the way  ) without naming the obligatory TP, LC, Avia., Bar. Cr. I believe they have been named above already by myself and others.


And BTW, compared to the Bay Area, we have legitimate reasons to "cry" as you say (Patrick). This whole area is a desolate wasteland in terms of golf, and that's not just because of the courses themselves. Come on Hucks, you know full well what I'm talking about. This is a GCA site. People here are going to recommend good courses (or what they think are good courses). If they are 2 different things as you said, what difference does it make? Hell, play anywhere. Good or bad, they are all overpriced for the most part. If the course doesn't fall in the first category (good arch) then it falls in another, bad. Or at least bad value for the money. When someone asks me where to play around here, I always try to keep in mind that the course for most people is only one part of the equation. But remember where we are right now posting these comments. I would think the course itself is a little higher on the importance list. Call me strange, I can't play just for the sake of playing. My time is too limited.


OK, I'm done busting your balls. Shew, I must've had too much coffee this morning!

David - you missed my point.  If you really care what it is, go read the entire "walkability" thread.

OF COURSE we have to prioritize where to play;  my point is that to base that ON ARCHITECTURE is silly.  Go read the other thread, hopefully it will make sense.

TH

[Patrick Kiser]

David,

I hear you about the wasteland part.

That's one of the reasons I moved up to San Francisco  

I won't rub it in about Harding at under $50 either  

... yet I still come down to visit the folks in Carlsbad and I usually hit Loma Santa Fe (for the short game) or ER because of the proximity to Carlsbad and the $$$.  Haven't had any problems with getting one, pace of play or anything.  Must have been lucky.  These certainly aren't great, but quality / price ... I have to say not terrible either given what's around there.

I mean ... I wasn't going to suggest Oceanside Muni or Fallbrook.  Right?

So ... short of heading up past Pendleton for the aforementioned list ... what would you suggest that would be better and at a reasonable price or around $60 or so.  Nothing over $100.

I'm curious what you think.  I don't pretend to have played everything in SD county, but I'd like to try some new suggestions myself.

Ultimately, only Anthony can clarify what he intended to mean by "good" courses.  Could mean a lot of things to different people.

Second cup coming up...

My knock on ER has more to it than just the course. It's too   much money for what you get and the rounds there take forever. Nowhere did I state that it shouldn't be played   simply because the course itself isn't my cup of tea, so let's clear that up right now. I can name a few courses in a 30 mile radius that are better than ER (appro. acronym by the way  ) without naming the obligatory TP, LC, Avia., Bar. Cr. I believe they have been named above already by myself and others.


And BTW, compared to the Bay Area, we have legitimate reasons to "cry" as you say (Patrick). This whole area is a desolate wasteland in terms of golf, and that's not just because of the courses themselves. Come on Hucks, you know full well what I'm talking about. This is a GCA site. People here are going to recommend good courses (or what they think are good courses). If they are 2 different things as you said, what difference does it make? Hell, play anywhere. Good or bad, they are all overpriced for the most part. If the course doesn't fall in the first category (good arch) then it falls in another, bad. Or at least bad value for the money. When someone asks me where to play around here, I always try to keep in mind that the course for most people is only one part of the equation. But remember where we are right now posting these comments. I would think the course itself is a little higher on the importance list. Call me strange, I can't play just for the sake of playing. My time is too limited.


OK, I'm done busting your balls. Shew, I must've had too much coffee this morning!

[Dennis_Harwood]

I need recommendations people... not threats to have people barred fom GCA. BTW-I have to spend Friday night in Temecula having dinner with a couple of French co-workers... if that changes anyone's opinion of where I should play on Saturday let me know.

The posters attention has been diverted from what you requested--

If you are staying in Temecula, that is far different than Carlsbad--almost an hours drive difference-- It will be hotter but an early tee time should solve that--

Temecula is on the I-15 and hence you are very near a number of inland courses -- Pala Mesa, the SCGA Course(Robert Trent Jones) are both pretty good-- also in the area are Redhawk and Temeku Creek and Temeku Hills (both Ted Robinson).

A little north on the I-15 is Bear Creek(Jack Nicklaus)-- Private and difficult access but a good course-(site of original Skins Game)

In Corona (still going north about 20 mins) you have Eagle Glen (Gary Baird)-- A little quirky for me, but some like it.

Stay on the I-15 toward Ontario and you get to Goose Creek (Scmidt/Curley)

Beyond that is the Orange County/LA basin courses--But that is over a hours drive from where you are sleeping and access may get crowded on a Saturday AM.

If you want to drive to the coast then the courses given above would work-- Be forewarned however that going to LAX via the coast is out of your way, while traving on the I-15 to the 5 or 405 is the straight shot to LAX-

[Pete Lavallee]

Now that we've changed the starting point to Temecula, I would not hesitate to recommend either San Luis Rey Downs or Pala Mesa. SLRD is off the 76 (which goes from the I 15 to I 5) and is a very pleasant course; Stan is right it's famous for the Fri. skins game which Gary McCord played in regularly. Pala Mesa is right on I 15 just a mile or 2 south of Temecula. Again a very pleasant, traditional layout that plays through a river valley on the front and has a hilly back 9. Even Sandy Barrens Jr. would agree with these selections.

[David Stamm]

David,

I hear you about the wasteland part.

That's one of the reasons I moved up to San Francisco  

I won't rub it in about Harding at under $50 either  

... yet I still come down to visit the folks in Carlsbad and I usually hit Loma Santa Fe (for the short game) or ER because of the proximity to Carlsbad and the $$$.  Haven't had any problems with getting one, pace of play or anything.  Must have been lucky.  These certainly aren't great, but quality / price ... I have to say not terrible either given what's around there.

I mean ... I wasn't going to suggest Oceanside Muni or Fallbrook.  Right?

So ... short of heading up past Pendleton for the aforementioned list ... what would you suggest that would be better and at a reasonable price or around $60 or so.  Nothing over $100.

I'm curious what you think.  I don't pretend to have played everything in SD county, but I'd like to try some new suggestions myself.

Ultimately, only Anthony can clarify what he intended to mean by "good" courses.  Could mean a lot of things to different people.

Second cup coming up...

My knock on ER has more to it than just the course. It's too   much money for what you get and the rounds there take forever. Nowhere did I state that it shouldn't be played   simply because the course itself isn't my cup of tea, so let's clear that up right now. I can name a few courses in a 30 mile radius that are better than ER (appro. acronym by the way  ) without naming the obligatory TP, LC, Avia., Bar. Cr. I believe they have been named above already by myself and others.


And BTW, compared to the Bay Area, we have legitimate reasons to "cry" as you say (Patrick). This whole area is a desolate wasteland in terms of golf, and that's not just because of the courses themselves. Come on Hucks, you know full well what I'm talking about. This is a GCA site. People here are going to recommend good courses (or what they think are good courses). If they are 2 different things as you said, what difference does it make? Hell, play anywhere. Good or bad, they are all overpriced for the most part. If the course doesn't fall in the first category (good arch) then it falls in another, bad. Or at least bad value for the money. When someone asks me where to play around here, I always try to keep in mind that the course for most people is only one part of the equation. But remember where we are right now posting these comments. I would think the course itself is a little higher on the importance list. Call me strange, I can't play just for the sake of playing. My time is too limited.


OK, I'm done busting your balls. Shew, I must've had too much coffee this morning!

To go along with Pete, I would recommend Pala Mesa over ER. I would not however recommend San Luis Rey just for the simple fact that the course is in horrible shape right now and has been for a while. I would also recommend Woods Valley, a course that opened within the last 3 years. They are however resodding as we speak and won't have the full 18 opened up until next month. Rancho Bernardo Inn is also a good alternative. Mind you, all these recommendations are relative to the area. However, I would play any of these over ER. I'm not saying ER is horrible, but the course IS run of the mill, they shoehorn people in on weekends (I experienced a 5 3/4 hour round there) and I feel there are others that are better courses that cost at least the same if not cheaper, that's all.

[rjsimper]

Greens at Pala Mesa are a bit spongy right now - bumpy and bouncy...

Of all the courses out in the Temecula/Fallbrook area, I'd say Cross Creek has the best combo of challenge, conditions, and layout.

[David Stamm]

Of all the courses out in the Temecula/Fallbrook area, I'd say Cross Creek has the best combo of challenge, conditions, and layout.

I would tend to agree with this. Now, what the course could've been is a whole different issue.

[Jon Spaulding]

I played Cross Creek against my will a couple weeks ago and the course was in lousy shape. If you can't get on Bear Creek, head to the gas station, fill the tank up and get out of dodge.

[rjsimper]

I played Cross Creek against my will a couple weeks ago and the course was in lousy shape. If you can't get on Bear Creek, head to the gas station, fill the tank up and get out of dodge.

Really - that's surprising....I always used to make the drive out there because the greens were extremely firm/fast, and true...and the turf conditions everywhere else were excellent - I always thought it was a great course to practice on.

[David Stamm]

 If you can't get on Bear Creek, head to the gas station, fill the tank up and get out of dodge.

There you go with that Nicklaus tripe again!

[Lynn_Shackelford]

At one time this was a site for a discussion of architecture.  From Carlsbad to LAX, it is a wasteland for golf architecture.  If you want to play golf there are plenty of informational sites that can recommend courses i.e. greenskeeper.org.

Jon was right, find a quality beach, some are among the best in the world.  And the sights at the beach will cure of wanting to play golf.
Just trying to impart good advice.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Lynn,
Exactly.....

Maybe we could really get everybody ont he same pagfe and have a King's Putter Cup at Tustin Ranch or Oak Creek.....Better yet, get it at Encinitas Ranch. that ought to make Tim and Tom extra happy...because the golf there is so interesting to study--the very reason why the KP even existed in the first place: For all of us to get together and study, play and experience great golf architecture, not promote mediocre blase stuff.

[Mike Golden]

Lynn,
Exactly.....

Maybe we could really get everybody ont he same pagfe and have a King's Putter Cup at Tustin Ranch or Oak Creek.....Better yet, get it at Encinitas Ranch. that ought to make Tim and Tom extra happy...because the golf there is so interesting to study--the very reason why the KP even existed in the first place: For all of us to get together and study, play and experience great golf architecture, not promote mediocre blase stuff.

Tommy and Lynn,

I know I no longer live in SoCal but did Rec Park get moved in the past two years?  Isn't that in between Carlsbad and LAX?  Rec Park is worth it just to see what was there historically plus the 5th(?) hole with its two different green sites, one straight uphill and the alternate drop shot to that tiny green.  Besides, as you know, as the holder of the Barney Cup, it has to be defended on the site of the original victory.

A visitor could also do worse than playing Los Lagos in Costa Mesa or even Mesa Linde, which are both fun, reasonably interesting Billy Bell, Jr. courses.  

And even Oak Creek isn't all that bad if you couple it with the shrimp fajitas and a margarita down the street at El Cholo

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Mike,
Long Beach Rec Park is probably the all-around consensus winner if someone wants some pretty interesting public golf. Mind you that if you get there early enough, you can play in 4 hours, leaving enough time for a trip to In-and-Out at the airport, shortly before one turns in their rent-a-car.

To me, that makes a lot more sense then playing Encinitas Ranch, which maybe the epitome of what uninteresting golf in SoCal is all about. But Tim and Tom love the place.

[Forrest Richardson]

Another of Tommy's favorite layouts is Desmond Muirhead's famous Disneyland Hotel 9-hole par-3....ohhh, but that would require Dr. Peabody and the Way-back Machine.

http://www.toonopedia.com/peabody.htm

[Patrick Kiser]

Ok Anthony,

So what did you end up doing with those 5 hours?

Waking up in Carlsbad this Saturday morning with a red-eye flight out of LA Airport at 10pm that evening... where would you suggest a young man might stay out of trouble (hopefully) for 5 of those hours?

thanks in advance for your suggestions...

[Tommy_Naccarato]

"Drizzle, Drazzle, Drozzle, Drome, Time for this one to come home....."

[Anthony Butler]

I played Cross Creek against my will a couple weeks ago and the course was in lousy shape. If you can't get on Bear Creek, head to the gas station, fill the tank up and get out of dodge.

Really - that's surprising....I always used to make the drive out there because the greens were extremely firm/fast, and true...and the turf conditions everywhere else were excellent - I always thought it was a great course to practice on.

I did end up playing at Cross Creek because a guy from my office got me out for $65 early saturday am so we go hang in Padadena that afternoon. I would second the point about conditions of the course. The fairways were not in good shape and the course had the usual amount of Arthur Hills headscratchers in there. 18 being a typical example. 455 yd par 4 where a 290 yd drive up the middle leaves you with a severe side hill lie in the rough with a 170 yd shot to the green.

BTW-How many holes are there down the ravine next to the Rose Bowl? Has to be at least 36.

[David Stamm]

I played Cross Creek against my will a couple weeks ago and the course was in lousy shape. If you can't get on Bear Creek, head to the gas station, fill the tank up and get out of dodge.

Really - that's surprising....I always used to make the drive out there because the greens were extremely firm/fast, and true...and the turf conditions everywhere else were excellent - I always thought it was a great course to practice on.

I did end up playing at Cross Creek because a guy from my office got me out for $65 early saturday am so we go hang in Padadena that afternoon. I would second the point about conditions of the course. The fairways were not in good shape and the course had the usual amount of Arthur Hills headscratchers in there. 18 being a typical example. 455 yd par 4 where a 290 yd drive up the middle leaves you with a severe side hill lie in the rough with a 170 yd shot to the green.

BTW-How many holes are there down the ravine next to the Rose Bowl? Has to be at least 36.

Anthony, I assume you mean the 2 courses of Brookside. Yes, there are 36 there. Croos Creek is a head scratcher, which is why I hesitate to recommend it. For such a great piece of property, a great chance was certainly not taken advantage of. And you are right, 18 is just plain obnoxious. Not only are you left with a side hill lie, but if the pin is on the right side you can't get to it beacuse of the trees blocking it out. BTW, it must've been hotter than hell up there.