Help please, budget for a trip to the UK

[John_Conley]

I'm toying with the idea of going across the pond in 2008 as a celebration of my 40th.  It has been between 15-20 years since I've been to England, Scotland, and Ireland.  For those that have done it recently, are these assumptions valid?

* Flight - $1,000
* Golf - $100 per day
* Meals - $40 per day
* Lodging - $100 per day
* Car rental ('hire' in English) - $70 per day

If so, a week would be about $3,000 per person.

My guesses are assuming no British Open courses are played, or any of the Big 4 in Ireland.  Lodging is in decent, clean rooms, but certainly not of the Marriott or Westin quality

Can it be done for $3k, or should I work around a budget of $4k or $5k to do it right?

I might be off on this with the Pound fetching over 2 dollars.

[Brent Hutto]

John,

I happen to have budget numbers for my Buda trip in mind since I've been planning it recently. I'm travelling solo but playing golf with the group for most of the rounds. So my numbers for lodging are single-occupancy and I'm paying for a car all by myself. I'm going to give the figures in British Pounds as well as dollars assuming a US$2.10/GBP ratio which hopefully is enough to include the 3% or so credit card surcharge (although maybe not the way things are going).

Flight:
<$700
I found a good deal booking way in advance.

Golf:
GBP90/day for 7 days (US$190)
Mostly 36-hole days and this is skewed by the extortionate fee at Royal Birkdale.

Lodging:
GBP50/day for 8 days (US$105)
Mixture of B&B, hotel and dormy house, all of which were very near GBP50/night.

Car:
GBP27/day for 8 days (US$57)
Small car, automatic, Hertz, does not include petrol

Meals:
GBP30/day for 8 days (US$63)
That's about what I spent last year in England, not including a couple of blowout expensive dinners. In truth, it was probably a bit more than that overall.

I think a total of around GPB150/day (US$315) is quite doable if you play inexpensive courses plus one or two nicer ones and none of the really fancy ones. Then again, if I'm crossing the pond I'm going to splurge at least a round or two which ups the average to more like GPB180/day (US$380). So I think $3,000 ain't gonna happen at current exchange rates but $4,000 for 7 days is easy to achieve and lets you play at least one price-be-damned course during the trip. All this not counting souvenirs, which is where I tend to go seriously off-budget.

[Pete Lavallee]

Hey, no budget for beer?

I usually spent $1000/week for a golfing trip to the UK. That was when the exchange rate was around 1.8; with 2:1 I'de expect it would be a minimum of $1500/week excluding airfare; we usually stay in B&B's. Lots of great courses in England for 50 pounds, which translates to your $100 budget.

[Brent Hutto]

If you stick to GPB30-50 B&B's (which seem easy to find just about everywhere except in London proper) it's going to really come down to what golf courses you end up playing. Probably the exact area influences golf prices considerably.

While there are marvelous <GBP50 courses all over the UK it sure seems to work out that the ones I want to play are way more than that unless you're playing with a member. Last year I found Deal and Walton Heath to offer quite acceptable value-for-money at around GBP90-95 for a day pass. But that is still way more than GBP50, isn't it? This year the Buda guys are paying GBP70-80 for the likes of Alwoodley and Mooretown which aren't exactly on the Open Rota.

My advice is that you will certainly have days where you spend less than $US100 to place an outstanding course. But you'll have more days when you spend $US150-200 to play an even better one. BTW, if you're looking to get your dollar's worth you definitely want a day pass at one course versus trying to get in two different courses on the same day.

[David_Tepper]

John -

Here are what prices (all in pounds!) are currently running in the Scottish Highlands -

Green Fees: Royal Dornoch, Nairn: 75-80 pounds; Brora, Tain, Golspie, Fortrose, Boat of Garten: 30-40 pounds

Lodging: You can find a decent B&B in the Dornoch area for 25-30 pounds per nite per person, which will include a sizeable breakfast.

Meals: Excluding drink, you should be able to have dinner for 15-20 pounds per nite. If you have a big B&B breakfast, lunch could be a bowl of soup and a sandwich for 6-8 pounds.

Car Rental: Check the Avis/Hertz websites. Renting a slightly smaller than mid-size car, which would work comfortably for 2 people, should cost no more than $40 (dollars!) a day. However, a tank of gas will cost over 40 pounds!!!

Visiting the lower profile areas and playing the lesser known courses will save you a LOT of money.
 
Feel free to IM me if you have any questions on visiting the Highlands.

DT

   

[Ken Moum]

My wife and I were in Scotland for two weeks last July, and I think it cost us roughly $10,000 for everything, including 11 rounds of golf for each of us.

We played several inexpensive courses, in fact the only high-dollar one was The Old Course.

Our car (A VW bus) was $1500, split four ways.

The biggest saving was that we stayed in B&Bs almost every night, the longest stay being in Nairn where it was ~60 GBP, including breakfast for the two of us. That meant we only ended up paying for one meal a day. The night we stayed in a hotel, breakfast cost us at least 7-8 GBP, and the hotels were more expensive than the B&Bs.

At St. Andrews our Guest House was 80 GBP.

K

[Daryl David]

Everything you have is underestimated except maybe airfare.  I doubt you could eat at MCD for $40 at day.

Examples:

Smoked chicken caesar salad $12.68 at Howie's (informal cafe)

36 holes at Gullane $253.75

One night at the Dunvegan for 2 $284.20

I would assume about $5k for week if you do all the booking yourself.

[Sean_A]

John

I can tell you exactly what I spent a few weeks ago for 5 days/4 nights of golf at Dornoch(x2), Nairn, Brora and Golspie and this included a weekend.

GOLF            £291
B&B              £160
FOOD & WINE £125
BEER              £60
CAR               £55 (three people sharing including petrol)
FLIGHT & CAB  £100
                 _______
TOTAL           £791

This was considered an expensive trip for us as we usually try to keep it to around £600, but 3 days at championship courses with flights and cars did us in.  I reckon your estimate of $2000 for a week is probably low unless second tier courses are the only ones in mind.  If there is a good mix of courses and nothing too fancy in terms of lodging and food planned, I would say $2500 (not inculding flight) is a better budget.  It can certainly be done cheaper if need be.  

If you need help with devising a cheaper trip let me know.  

Ciao

[David_Tepper]

John Conley -

Further thoughts -

I don't know where is the US you would be flying from, but generally airfares to GB&I from the US are noticeably higher for travel between Memorial Day & Labor Day than before or after.

I would encourage you to think about going in the 2nd half of May (when the gorse is in bloom) or mid-September. The weather should still be agreeable and the courses will be much less crowded. In addition, you could possibly save $200-$300 in air fare.

DT

[Mark_Rowlinson]

We are stupidly expensive in this country at the moment.  I should love to be able to direct you to fabulously cheap guest houses etc, but you will die at the cost of our petrol/gazoline and our public transport.  I could advise on courses which are offering really good value for money on their green fees.  The awful trouble is that they are in the least tourist-attractive areas - Seaton Carew, Seascale etc.  

Don't forget that everyone here expects a tip - 10% is the minimum.  We are told that everyone giving services (taxi drivers, hotel porters, waiters etc) are taxed on the expectation of their tips.  It makes a huge difference to the overall budget.

So, my advice would be that if you want to do the Old Courses, Sunningdales and Royal Lythams of this world it will be an expensive trip - you can hardly stay in a Salvation Army Hostel and play Swinley Forest the next day.  If you don't have the funds, don't be embarrassed.  I can direct you to some of the best value golf in the UK and to some of the best value accommodation.

[John_Conley]

All, thanks for the help.  Someone seems to think $4,000 will do, another suggests $5,000.

Mark, I have the funds so that really isn't the issue.  I'm going to need to have an idea to work out the details.  Spousal approval (she may want to come too), golf buddies (certainly they will want to have an idea of the cost), planning (as mentioned, it may make sense to target a certain month), etc...

I'm usually surprised at the cost of flights when I look into them.  It seems Orlando to Scotland or Ireland is a far cry from the low fares out of New York to London.  Maybe I should fly to England and drive with some golf on the way.

[David_Tepper]

John -

I would suggest looking into flying to London (Heathrow or Gatwick) and then flying to Scotland (Edinburgh, Aberdeen, Inverness, etc.) from there. Flights from Heathrow/Gatwick into Scotland on BMI or Easyjet can be very inexpensive if you book far enough in advance.

Also, don't overlook England (or Wales!) as a golf destination. Devon & Cornwall (a 3-4 hour drive from Heathrow) is a beautiful part of Britain and has a good number of quality courses - St. Endoc, Trevose, Perranporth, West Cornwall, etc., etc. Courses such as Westward Ho!, Saunton and Burham & Berrow are in that area as well.  

DT

[Doug Wright]

John,

Based on my trip in early October 2005, I'd say you could do it for $3,000-$4,000. Maybe on the higher end if you're solo, lower if you're sharing the car and lodging costs with one or more others.

Best to start early with the planning of course. Happy to offer suggestions/share our itinerary at some point if you like.

[Bill Gayne]

John,

If you only go once every 15-20 years than break the budget and allow the additional $2,000 and make a $5,000 trip out of it. Play the big courses and enjoy the pubs and accomodations in town close to the courses.

Doing less and identifying bargains makes great sense if you're planning on returning routinely and will have multiple opportunities to play the championship courses.

If you desire caddies then they need to be a separate line item in the budget.

[John_Conley]

John,

If you only go once every 15-20 years than break the budget and allow the additional $2,000 and make a $5,000 trip out of it. Play the big courses and enjoy the pubs and accomodations in town close to the courses.

Bill, good advice.  Certainly the road more commonly taken by the American.  I have, however, seen Royal County Down, Portmarnock, Notts, Burnham & Burrow, Muirfield, Dornoch, and Saint Andrews in 1989 and had a chance to play Portrush in 1994.  I'm frankly more interested in seeing the Murcars, Cruden Bays, Nairns, Gullanes, and North Berwicks of the world at this point.

Imagine a Brit came to the U.S. and toured our U.S. Open courses.  Generally there is an equal-or-better course within a half-hour that isn't as widely known.

Pebble Beach --> Cypress Point
Winged Foot --> Quaker Ridge
Shinnecock --> National Golf Links
Hazeltine --> Interlachen
Olympia Fields --> Chicago Golf
Olympic --> San Francisco
Torrey Pines --> Barona Creek
Oakland Hills --> CC of Detroit
Pinehurst --> probably the only exception I can think of, unless the same holds at Oak Hill

Anyway, you get my point.  The latter above are certainly, in aggregate, the equal of the former.

It will be far less expensive and much easier to access if I go the route I'm thinking.  So I may miss Turnberry or Troon.  Maybe I do include one of those kind of courses.  I just remember being quite disappointed at Muirfield.  It was ranked #1 in the W O R L D just a few years prior to my visit.  Gullane certainly looks more interesting from the road, so I'd be surprised if I will even rank it #1 in the town.

To everyone, including those that were kind enough to Instant Message me, THANK YOU for all the help.  Certainly $5,000 should cover the high end and $4,000 to $4,500 is an ample range.  $3,500 may be doable if it is worked in on the cheap.  I have no intention of cutting costs for the sake of cutting costs if it dilutes the experience.  That said, I'm not one in need of a costly meal if there is a chipper around and I only really need a clean, safe room.

[Mickey Boland]

My trip in August 2006 cost just under $4000.  Exchange rate was $1.90 at the time.  That included pretty much everything:  airfare, beer, green fees, meals, beer, souvenirs, beer, rental van, etc.  We played:

Carnoustie
Lundin
Crail
The Old Course
Royal Dornoch
Brora
Nairn

Stayed at nice B & B's in both St. Andrews and Dornoch.  Breakfast at the B & B, usually a sandwich at the course, and a nice meal in the evening.  4 of us split the cost of a rental van.  

If you're looking for some trip planning help at a reasonable price, I can recommend Allan Ferguson.  You can find him on the web.  He did a great job for my group.  He also publishes a great book called "Golf in Scotland" which would be a good aid for self-planning.

[Tommy Williamsen]

$3000 is possible.  I think, however, the car may be more expensive than reported.  I always ge the insurance, which ain't cheap.  But it is worth it.  There are a bunch of good courses that are not expensive.  But if you want to play the Royal Birkdales of the world bring plenty of $.

Mark Rowlinson is a great resource.

[Matt MacIver]

My trip May '07 was $5k.  Plan was to spend most of our $ on top tier courses (11 rounds, $2.5k) and stay in very reasonable lodging ($1.6k).  All- in budget was $5k and we came in right on that, maybe slightly higher as of course I under- budgeted trinkets.  

Someone else mentioned caddies, don't forget to budget them: L40-50 = USD $80-100.  We got them 8/11 rounds and it really added up, am happy I did it for all the normal reasons but wow.  

If you're going to play the Gullanes, N Berwicks, Prestwicks I think you can knock up to $1k off.  And I think the top tier courses in ENG are probably 50-60% the cost of golf in either Scotland or Ireland; it's third on US tourists rota and therefore way undervalued.  

[Mark Chaplin]

Mark - Everyone expects a 10% tip?? Taxi drivers, round it upto the next pound. Hotel porters unless you are staying in 5 star hotels they don't really exist if you use their services a pound is fine. Bar staff would be shocked if you offered a tip and waiters are totally optional and certainly not tipped if the restaurant includes service. Britain does not have a tipping culture.

Matt - You are quite right English links are cheaper thn our Scottish and Irish friends.

Don't forget only around 30 courses in GB&I have any real buiness from overseas tourists. Avoid them and your costs plummet. The only reason Troon, Birkdale, Kingsbarns, etc charge what they do is because the Japanese and American golfers pay it.