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A.G._Crockett

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The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« on: June 17, 2007, 09:13:32 PM »
I just received this book for a Fathers Day present, and will start reading tonight.  It's a novel set in the 1400's, and concluding with the edict by James II that banned golf.

Brand new, out in hardcover from Alfred A. Knopf, and the forward is by a guy named Nicklaus who apparently knew the author at some point in the past.

Don't know if anyone else has seen this book, but I hope I enjoy it as much as I do Mr. Cupp's courses.  My review will follow in a few days. :)
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"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

Chris Cupit

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Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2007, 02:27:39 PM »
A.G.

I hope the story makes more sense than the 15th at Druid Hills or the 18th at Hawk's Ridge. :D
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Bill Shamleffer

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Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2007, 03:11:02 PM »
I am currently only two chapters into TOMMY'S HONOR.  From my limited knowledge of Scottish history from 1400 to 1900, it appears that Kevin Cook has made a strong effort to stay accurate with the historical details.  He is not overly sentimental, and the characters do not seem to have any 20th or 21st century characteristics which are contradictory to behavior of the 19th century.

I know nothing about THE EDICT other than the reviews I saw on Amazon.com.  However, I fear that Cupp may have been very loose with his historical details of his story.

I look forward to your review.  If you are able, please try to spend a sentence or two discussing my above noted concerns.

Thank you.


Also, although only two chapters into TOMMY'S HONOR, I am thoroughly enjoying this read.  I know many on this site do not like Mark Frost's books, but I do and I find a similar excitement from this read as I did from Frost's two golf books.  I do think Frost's writing did read as if he was writing a screenplay, which I considered to lesson the quality of his books.  Fortunately, Cook's writing style does read more like a novel than a screenplay.

The easiest way for me to explain Cook's writing is to compare it to David Halberstam's sports books.  Halberstam's books read like a journalist, in that the writing is to the point and not overly flowery.  But his prose is extremely excellent writing.  I will not say that Cook's writing is equal to Halberstam's, but there is a similar flow in the first couple of chapters.
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“The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, but that's the way to bet.”  Damon Runyon

Tim Pitner

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Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2007, 04:03:16 PM »
Can anyone honestly say that there has ever been a great golf-themed novel or movie, other than Caddyshack?  I can't think of any.  Please don't say Tin Cup or Bagger Vance.  
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Ted Kramer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2007, 04:05:31 PM »
Quote from: Tim Pitner on June 22, 2007, 04:03:16 PM
Can anyone honestly say that there has ever been a great golf-themed novel or movie, other than Caddyshack?  I can't think of any.  Please don't say Tin Cup or Bagger Vance.  

I think The Legend of Bagger Vance is a good book.
And I think Golf in the Kingdom is a great book.

-Ted
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Bill Shamleffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2007, 04:13:58 PM »
Ted beat me to "Golf In the Kingdom".  I will also add "The Dogged Victims of Inexorable Fate" by Dan Jenkins and "On the tour with Harry Sprague" by Herbert Warren Wind.  Finally this summer's "The Back Nine" was a very good read.  Finally throw in Rick Reilly's "Missing Links"
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“The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, but that's the way to bet.”  Damon Runyon

Ted Kramer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2007, 04:20:09 PM »
Bud Sweat and Tees was another good read.
I read it before Beemer won the PGA, I was so excited watching him come down the stretch after having read that book . . .

-Ted
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A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2007, 06:08:20 PM »
Quote from: Chris Cupit on June 22, 2007, 02:27:39 PM
A.G.

I hope the story makes more sense than the 15th at Druid Hills or the 18th at Hawk's Ridge. :D

Chris,
I've never seen the 15th at DH, but the 18th at Hawk's Ridge is puzzling, to say the least.  

The book, so far, is very entertaining.
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"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2007, 06:11:38 PM »
Quote from: Tim Pitner on June 22, 2007, 04:03:16 PM
Can anyone honestly say that there has ever been a great golf-themed novel or movie, other than Caddyshack?  I can't think of any.  Please don't say Tin Cup or Bagger Vance.  

I'm not sure what constitutes "great", but there is some possibility that you are going to hurt Rick Shefchik's feelings with this post.  "Amen Corner" is a good golf novel, and a very good first novel.

"Missing Links" is terrific; if you haven't read it, do so.  It won't be assigned in college English, but a lot of good stuff isn't.
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"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

George Pazin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2007, 08:02:42 PM »
I'd guess Tim simply hasn't seen Rick's book, yet. Or perhaps he considers it more a sports thriller, where the golf setting is tertiary.

I'm always amazed anyone enjoyed Golf in the Kingdom - and the fact that it inspired a genre is a negative, not a positive.
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Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Jim Adkisson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2007, 11:18:47 PM »
Missing Links is a must read..."Troon Mcallister"s The Green is also a fun and funny novel...Bagger Vance is a very well done novel...bummer that the movie was a complete waste of time...there also was this guy named Wodehouse who wrote some golf stories....

I love Caddyshack, but Tim, PLEASE think before posting...it's not the only thing out there.
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Tim Pitner

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2007, 12:24:09 PM »
My skepticism of golf-themed novels and movies is mostly based on some of the really sorry golf films I've seen.  I'm not sure I've read a golf novel; they generally don't appeal to me.  I'm sure there are some good ones, including Rick's.  My standards for novels and films is pretty high.  Of course, Caddyshack is not really a great movie, but it has so many memorable one-liners that it's beyond criticism.  
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Rich Goodale

Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2007, 12:39:27 PM »
Give Bob Cupp a break.

Solid historical information about golf is miniscule even when you go back 100-150 years, much less 600+.  He (as I assume is Kevin Cook, and once was Tom MacWood) is doing some passionate speculation, and more power to all of them for that.

Rich
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A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2007, 06:59:14 PM »
Cupp doesn't claim to be recounting history.  He has written a novel with a very cool set of possible (and plausible, IMO) yarns for the beginnings of not only the game itself, but of GCA.  I think it is more than worth a read, but then I like books...
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"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

Ted Kramer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2007, 09:12:41 PM »
Quote from: George Pazin on June 22, 2007, 08:02:42 PM

. .  .

I'm always amazed anyone enjoyed Golf in the Kingdom - and the fact that it inspired a genre is a negative, not a positive.

I'm very surprised at that comment.
If we ever get together for a beer we'll have to discuss this a bit. I certainly don't put it up there with Ayn Rand's novels, but I'm shocked that you find it so bad.

-Ted
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Ray Tennenbaum

Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2007, 11:48:36 AM »
Quote from: Ted Kramer on June 22, 2007, 04:05:31 PM
Quote from: Tim Pitner on June 22, 2007, 04:03:16 PM
Can anyone honestly say that there has ever been a great golf-themed novel or movie, other than Caddyshack?  I can't think of any.  Please don't say Tin Cup or Bagger Vance.  

I think The Legend of Bagger Vance is a good book.
And I think Golf in the Kingdom is a great book.

-Ted

I thought the tv version (was it HBO?) of Dead Solid Perfect was okay, and Randy Quaid's swing is certainly much more watchable than Costner's.
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G Jones

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2007, 12:02:17 PM »
Quote from: A.G._Crockett on June 22, 2007, 06:08:20 PM
Quote from: Chris Cupit on June 22, 2007, 02:27:39 PM
A.G.

I hope the story makes more sense than the 15th at Druid Hills or the 18th at Hawk's Ridge. :D

Chris,
I've never seen the 15th at DH, but the 18th at Hawk's Ridge is puzzling, to say the least.  

The book, so far, is very entertaining.

The 15th at DH is one of the most silly holes I've ever played. Off the back tees it's a really short uphill par 4 that requires a big drive to be threaded between two huge trees, to land on a narrow fairway that is going uphill at about 30 degrees and which throws everything left towards a ravine. Assuming you hit the perfect drive then you have a half sand iron to an easy green... but most likely your drive when into the trees or the river. It's madness.
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Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #17 on: July 12, 2007, 08:00:09 PM »
   I just finished reading The Edict. It is an enjoyable novel, good characters, plot with twists. He gets bogged down with details a few times, but overall that is a minor flaw and he is not the only author to do so. He is wont to borrow words and personalities from the present, again understandable.
   The premise is the historical King James edict banning golf and other sports as it took away from military preparedness.
The book looks at the origins of golf, supposes contests and championships and makes ruling bodies. A finder becomes the precursor of golf course architects. Social maladies today are the same as yesteryear
   Two questions are still unanswered. Does Cupp's feelings about the status of today's game carry over into his writing.
Is the after genealogy possible?
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David Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #18 on: July 12, 2007, 11:02:12 PM »
I am still waiting for The Apology by Bob Cupp for the monstrosity he designed in Southern California called Tierra Rejada.

http://www.tierrarejadagolf.com/
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"Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent." - Judge Holden, Blood Meridian.

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:The Edict, by Bob Cupp
« Reply #19 on: July 13, 2007, 12:05:28 AM »
Call me sappy, but I enjoyed "The Greatest Player Who Never Lived" by Michael Veron. For my money, it's a better read than Bagger Vance and some of those other mystical golf novels. "The Green" is a good catch; the description of the ringer's two hands -- one tanned and leathery, the other dead-fish gray (golf-glove hand) -- has always stayed with me.
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