The danger of the trickle down effect

[Patrick_Mucci]

Examine this picture.

Look at how narrow the fairway is.

Look at the location of the flanking bunkers.

Consider the date this course was designed.

Is this a case of someone watching too many PGA Tournaments and Majors and trying to mimic what they see on TV ?

[A.G._Crockett]

Patrick,
Is there any chance that they let the rough grow to prevent the ball from getting to the bunkers because the bunkers are too penal for the membership?
If not, then it would certainly appear that they've been watching too much TV...

[wsmorrison]

In this case, the left fairway line is significantly closer to the left bunker than the right side which, as you cite, is pinched in quite a bit.  Could it simply be a maintenance budget issue than anything driven by a desire to mimic tour setups on TV or to make the course play easier for the members?  There can be several reasons for this and only someone on staff or in a position of governance at the club would know.

[Mike Sweeney]

Patrick,

Right concept but wrong course to pick on. He runs the fairway all the way to the left side. In that first photo, the mowing pattern makes it look like rough. You can make an argument that the right side should go higher, but there are other issues that the supers can inform us why or why not.

I will say that Eastward Ho! IS the poster child for Paulian maintenance meld and Geoffrey and Noel are probably typing as I type to confirm.



If I have time later, I will post some pics of Newport CC which clearly has a hangover from The Women's Open.

[Kyle Harris]

Pat,

The left side of the fairway almost goes into the fairway bunker left. The lighter portion of the fairway is half as the fairway was mowed "up and back" or "shaded" and not with a checkerboard pattern.

Looks like Sweeney just undercut me... typical. But his picture shows it.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Wayne,

It doesn't matter what the reasons are.

The fact remains that the hole is being maintained in a manner that's at odds with the architecture and the intended playing experience.

[Sean_A]

Patrick,

Right concept but wrong course to pick on. He runs the fairway all the way to the left side. In that first photo, the mowing pattern makes it look like rough. You can make an argument that the right side should go higher, but there are other issues that the supers can inform us why or why not.

I will say that Eastward Ho! IS the poster child for Paulian maintenance meld and Geoffrey and Noel are probably typing as I type to confirm.



If I have time later, I will post some pics of Newport CC which clearly has a hangover from The Women's Open.

Mike

Is that a punchbowl green to the right passed the tree?

Ciao

[Patrick_Mucci]

Mike Sweeney,

I wish you'd start posting non-deceptive pictures.

I'll have to admit that I was greatly relieved to see the second picture.

I'd be curious to know why the right side isn't mowed like the left side.

With courses like Baltusrol, Oakmont, Newport and others narrowing their fairways for Majors, and then leaving them narrowed for member play, how long do you think it will take before the members finally figure out that the narrowed fairways are counter productive to their enjoyment of the game and in conflict with what the architect intended ?

As you know, Newport is one of my favorite golf courses.

But, WIND and narrowed fairways make for a very bad marriage.

[Mike Sweeney]

Wayne,

It doesn't matter what the reasons are.

The fact remains that the hole is being maintained in a manner that's at odds with the architecture and the intended playing experience.

Pat,

When this course opened, the balls on the right hill probably stayed on the hill. Now with grass speeds (as noted by Doug in the other thread) the ball would fall off the right hill to a flat section. By keeping a little rough there, it keeps the rock and roller terrain of The Ho! in play as Fowler intended.

PS. I have to run to a meeting but my next post will say "have you played the course Pat"   when you tell me how my days at school in New England have clouded my judgement!!

[Patrick_Mucci]

Mike Sweeney,

I think Fowler was aware of the terrain, that nothing rolls like a ball, and the effect of the combination of both.  

[wsmorrison]

Hey Kyle, I beat you to it as well (see the third post).  You are either a slow typer this morning or maybe just slow witted.  Yeah, its probably the later.  Stop practicing your Genesis songbook into the wee hours and you might be more alert  

Pat,

In fact, it does matter what the reasons are.  If the reasons are budgetary, it is far less likely to be reversed.  If the reasons are for fairness or other interpretations, then those philosophies can be more changed, though often not so easily.  You can't get blood from a stone, but you can educate and lead a mind shift.

[Kyle Harris]

Yeah Wayne, I see that. If it makes you feel any better, the only reason I read the thread in the first place was because at the time, you were the latest post on the topic. Maybe if your post was more clear and not in that purple haze clogging your brain I would have understood better.  

I know nothing about this hole, but the picture seems to show that the green favors an approach from the left? Is it a par 5 where a shot down the right off the tee is favored?

I need some context here now. Pat has a valid question as to why the fairway isn't cut more to the right and Mike brings up a good point about that knuckle. But how does the hole really play?

[Michael Moore]

Is this a case of someone watching too many PGA Tournaments and Majors . . .

Yes.

[SPDB]

The bunkers in question are not in play for the large
majority of players. A good drive will carry to the bottom
of the hill, or catch the downslope and tumble down to
the flatter portion. The extra cost associated with bringing
the fairway to the right bunker might not be the wisest use
of the budget.

However, this state of affairs might have been occasioned
by a moving of the tees back. Next time I'm there I'll have to
look at the aerial of Chatham Country Club that is in the
clubhouse to see Fowler's original spatial relationship of tee
and the flanking bunkers.