[George Pazin]

Announcers are mostly a personal thing. The only thing that really bugs me about Johnny is when he says things like the rock in the bunker thing that Faldo called him on - he was flat out guessing and treating it like it was fact.

But he certainly knows a #1 golf course when he sees it!

Anyone actually read the link and see where Gerry Dulac, the PG golf guy, said Miller had 1 major championship to his credit? Now a mistake like that from someone who is allegedly a golf specialist is inexcusable, imho.

[Travis Ripley]

Miller is OK, but it's easy to be a genius when you aren't playing.  ask Lanny Wadkins.  i almost fell out of my chair when Lanny said "he'll be lucky to get this inside 10 feet" on Eldrick's famous chip in at the Masters.  i said to myself: "he'll probably make it, now".

I like Faldo.

Jim Nantz thinks he's the Shakespeare of golf when he's the master of maudlin nonsense.  

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Miller is OK, but it's easy to be a genius when you aren't playing.  ask Lanny Wadkins.  i almost fell out of my chair when Lanny said "he'll be lucky to get this inside 10 feet" on Eldrick's famous chip in at the Masters.  i said to myself: "he'll probably make it, now".

I like Faldo.

Jim Nantz thinks he's the Shakespeare of golf when he's the master of maudlin nonsense.  

Travis, Check your IM.

[TEPaul]

"Some will claim that at least he's honest, but this really isn't the case as many of his comments are so far off the mark."

Kalen Braley:

I don't know you at all or your experiences in these things and believe me I mean no disrespect to you but I think this needs to be asked on this discussion section. Would you mind telling me---nay, telling all of us, what it is exactly that leads you to believe you know better than Miller does what the "mark" is with these tournaments, these tournament players and these golf courses played on by them?  

[Justin_Zook]

Totally agree with George.

Johnny isn't a bad announcer by any stretch.  I think he offers a lot of valuable insight and probably works his tail off in terms of researching and studying the venue.  But seriously, Faldo's comment was brilliant, "I thought he just hit it too hard."  A rock?  Come on, Phil is capable of making execution errors around the green, just like any other touring pro.  

Maybe Faldo could be likened to Simon Cowell, and Johnny Miller to Paula Abdul.  

[Rick Shefchik]

Maybe Faldo could be likened to Simon Cowell, and Johnny Miller to Paula Abdul.  

Yikes! Except for the accent, it's Miller who's the Simon Cowell. He understands he's in an entertainment medium and refuses to bore you with pat, meaningless observations (Paula Abdul: "You're a beautiful girl, and you went for it.")

I think Faldo can get there, but he needs a little more of Miller's (and Simon's) fearlessness, and willingness to be booed in the middle of one of his opinions.

And perhaps Faldo needs to prepare a little better. If TEPaul is correct about the pre-broadcast work Miller does at a tournament site, that helps explain his fearlessness. He's done his homework, and has confidence that he's not shooting from the hip. That's Simon Cowell's strength: he utterly believes in his knowledge of the entertainment industry and what will sell.

[Kalen Braley]

TE,

You gave me a good idea for this championship.  I will watch this championship with pen and notepad and take notes of some of the things he says. I'll then post it here and see what everyone thinks about his comments.    

As for my life experiences, the best I could claim is over 25 years of actively watching golf telecasts.  While I don't work in the broadcasting industry, I have had many friends who say I should have.  But I doubt they mean that in a good way.  Probably because I can be as argumentative as almost anyone.  

As to potentially being dis-respected, I don't mind at all, take your shots, my skin is amply thick...

[Tim Pitner]

Jim Nantz thinks he's the Shakespeare of golf when he's the master of maudlin nonsense.  

Travis,

Brilliantly said.  Nantz has single-handedly ruined the Masters for me (much more so than Fazio).  

[Cliff Hamm]

Comments about Nantz are absolutely accurate.  But he was at the dinner with Bush and the Queen  

[Kalen Braley]

As promised above, Saturday Johnny Miller quotes:

"That was an easy putt..." - Stating his disappointment in Phil M after he missed a reported 9 footer that was downhill with a left to right break.

"Thats probably bogie, unless he makes the 12 footer for par" - This was stated after Sean O'hair had only hit his 2nd shot over the green on a par 4.  Sean hadn't he even attempted his 3rd shot, is Johny now a psychic and knows what he'll be left with after his chip on to the green??  He also carried on about what a brutal chip it would be with it being downhill over a hogs back.

"With a nipped little wedge, he should be able to get this one really close" - Incredibly Johnny said this only 5 minutes later as Sean was lining up his chip back to the green for his 3rd shot.  This when just 5 minutes earlier he was carrying on about how difficult the chip was and prophesying he would get it no closer than 12 feet.  Should we call him amnesiac Johhny??

"Players should make birdie from this spot 80% of the time" - This was the biggest whopper of them all.  Once again Sean O'Hair was hitting his 2nd shot into the par 5 11th from 248 yards...yes 248 yards. Just exactly where did Johnny pull this number from?  His backside?  From 248 yards in the fairway to the 11th green where there is a bunker short, right, and long.  Where the green will not accept a draw and missing left ends up in nasty greenside grass hollows.  

So I did a little looking around.

Scenario 1 - Player pulls off the shot and hits the green in 2, 1 under GIR.  According to pgatour.com stats, the average player only hits the Green in Regulation 65%.  While there was no stat for this, hitting the green in less than GIR has got to be well under 50%. Conceding that if the player hits the green, they will get a birdie.  But from that distance into that green, its far less han half the time.

Scenario 2 - Player misses the green in the sand.  Stats sand saves for average pga tour player is 50% for sand saves.

Scenario 3 - Player misses green elsewhere.  Stats for scrambling are 60%.

So where in the hell does Johnny get 80% from?

And just for fun, i took note of how many players he had something negative to say about thier stance, setup, swing or golf shots.  The tally came to 13 players.  I think they only showed 17 players in the whole telecast, or at least for the portion that I was tuned into. I think Johnny was slipping a little bit on his negativity and missed out on 100% here.

All of these examples were just from one telecast, after watching about 2.5 hours of it.  Pile this nonsense crappola up in telecast after telecast after years and years of watching and I'm amazed to this day he still has a job.

To add insult to injury, and thankfully it wasn't Johnny, to go on and on and on about Sean O'Hair's rough past with his father, and then to say they hope the issue is put to bed and that the media will just let it die?  That was just brutal....

Superb broadcast indeed by NBC....

And don't even get me started on the pontificating/"ride my high horse into town" Bob Costas...  

[Brent Hutto]

So where in the hell does Johnny get 80% from?

Kalen,

I'll clue you in. It's live television, on the air in the real time. He just makes it up. He just says his best guess at the moment that the situation arises. That's in his job description.

How many people in the world know more about that situation than Johnny Miller? A dozen? Two dozen? Hell, even if there are a hundred more knowledgable people than Johnny out there they weren't in the booth today.

There isn't time for him to give a fully-qualified lawyer's non-answer to every shot. He can't say something like "Because we're seeing players at the top of their game under perfect conditions and the shot suits their game so well from this spot my best estimate is somewhere around 80%. Now it may be that the average for all such shots is more like 50% but in my opinion it's closer to 80%, although maybe I'm wrong because I'm doing this is real time. But I probably shouldn't say because maybe it's really more like 70-75% instead 80% and I wouldn't want to overstate the case".

So you think Johnny Miller is full of shit. Turn the sound off. Or go listen to a say-nothing announcer on some other channel. You say he slags on 13 of 17 guys' golf swings at some point during the telecast. How about the four guys today whose swings he declared some variant of "I love that swing". Heck, he repeatedly praised Lonard's golf swing and then when he hit a miserable one he turned around and declared it terrible and inexplicable. Johnny really likes what he thinks are good swings and really hates what he thinks are bad ones even when they're hit by the same person.

[EDIT] Inappropriate Ad hominum comment deleted.

[Jim Nugent]

I've always liked Johnny, for the obvious reasons.  He tells it like it is more than just about any other announcer out there.  

Touring pro's apparently disagree with me, though.  In the recent SI poll, 82% of them said they like Faldo as an announcer over Miller.  

[Kalen Braley]

Brad,

I understand its live television and he doesn't have these stats on the tip of his tongue...thats perfectly fine.  So why even mention it at all??  

But this is apart of Johnnys m/o that I've seen him do over and over again.  He says something completely unquantifiable like that, and then rips them when they don't succeed at his unreasonable expectations.

As with baseball, if I had a radio option, I would gladly turn it down, but no such option exists.  

As for why he is the "sanest" man in golf which I've heard several time, I'm still looking for reasons why.  And if negative, rip on everyone, brooding broadcasting is what you look for in your golf announcing, then we'll just have to agree to disagree on Johnny...

[Peter Pallotta]

Kalen
sorry to keep you waiting, and for what's going to be so little. By "sane" I just mean that JM strikes me as one of the most well-balanced people around. (By the way, did you ever see that Golf Channel interview when JM talks about his brother's death? It's remarkable). As I mentioned, I think he fulfills his role as "announcer" perfectly, in part because he understands that he is both expert and entertainer, but also because his healthy perspective on the game helps him realize that there are far worse things in the world than a bad golf shot -- so he can simply call them as he sees them. It seems to me that he is also very good at being in the moment, which to me is a very good thing: after much hard work and preparation (like a true professional) he reacts to the moment and then moves on. I have a feeling -- and it's just a feeling -- that when he's not announcing he forgets all about it and focuses equally well on whatever is in front of him, e.g. being a father or a husband or a friend, and probably fulfills those roles with equal balance and perspective.

Anyway, all just a feeling/opinion....and when all George Pazin really wanted was to discuss Oakmont as the best course in the world!

Peter    

[TEPaul]

Kalen Braley:

Thanks for all your research on Johnny yesterday but personally I don't have any problem at all with anything he said in those quotes you offered.

Maybe you should turn the sound down or off and just watch the tournament. Commentators shouldn't be all that much more than background music anyway----good background music but background music nonetheless.

That's why I liked Frank Gifford on football so much. If you thought about it you realized he was telling the audience a lot but if you didn't think about it his commentary was sort of just subliminal albeit informative.

[Tom Zeni]

Hey, in case you missed this...Pittsburgh. after 22 years was again named the #1 city in America!!!!!

I mean, get with the program. #1 city, #1 golf course. Is it really fair that Pine Valley be #1 forever and you need to be born on the property to play it? Move them down the list and they'll be begging for people to come to New Jersey. Then again, why else would anyone go to New Jersey?

I say give everyone a chance at #1. Move it around. 2007 is our turn. Winged Foot was so last year.

What troubled me about Miller's comments concerning Oakmont is that "HE HASN'T ACTUALLY SEEN IT SINCE IT'S BEEN RENOVATED." The story states that Miller has "studied it."

As for Miller's skills in the broadcast booth. I couldn't tell you who would be better. He's old school and believes in shot making. So that has to be your measuring stick when listening. He's honest. He gives his opinion and stands by it.  Most of the time, he's quite accurate in his shot assessment, including when Faldo stupidly called him on that bunker shot. Totally embarrassing for Nick.

As for Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy (as Venturi called him) he'll personally pour the syrup on your pancakes every morning.

Until I post again, We're #1. We're #1.

[Glenn Spencer]

Johnny Miller...the Bill Walton of golf broadcasters...minus the tie dye, Birkenstocks and Graffix.

Jay,

I feel like I am pretty familiar with both and I am not seeing any connection between the two. Miller is negative and Walton is very positive. Just a little help?

Miller? He can go or stay for all I care. I usually can make up my own mind as to what could potentially happen on the next shot. I have a problem with his analysis though, I honestly believe that professional golfers hit bad shots for reasons that have nothing to do with pressure. Miller absolutely does not.

[Paul Stephenson]

George
I don't want to go off-topic, but for years I've really believed that Johnny Miller is the sanest man in all of golf.

If Johnny says it, I'd listen. Some might suggest that his 63 is behind these comments. IMO, that's not the case.

Peter
 

It's not the 63.  Johnny made a good "cheque" that week.  I don't mind him as an announcer except for his constant obsession with money.  Every time a guy misses a putt down the stretch Johnny has to tell us how much money it cost him.  I don't doubt his accuracy here since he's probably got the winnings sheet in front of him.

I'm glad O'Hair was trying to win the tournament on 17.  My take on Johnny would be that he would have played to the middle and "settled" for the additional $750K that came with a safe second.

Would Johnny be a pay-cheque player in 2007?  At least in his prime he had to win to make a decent cheque.  Was this his motivation...money?

[John Keenan]

I cannot speak for JM on the money issue, but it is fair to say money is a big driver to all of them. It may well be the biggest.  They  are playing for large sums of money. If the game was the only draw stay an Am.

[Justin_Zook]

I don't think Faldo was embarrassed at all about his rebuke.  If he was embarrassed, it was for Johnny Miller.  Phil's shot landed on a downslope and was hit too hard (as it landed almost hole high), that's why it went too far.  

It reminded me of Lanny Wadkins' remark, in the final round of the 2005 Masters, when Tiger's shot on the par 3, 6th:

"The mere vibration of Tiger Woods' ball landing on the green has caused Chris DiMarco's ball to start rolling back off the green."  

Give me a break.  Should we consult the US Geological Survey in Menlo Park, CA to confirm the seismic activity recorded due to Tiger's ball landing on the 6th green in Augusta, GA?  

It's embellishment.  It's unfounded claims of fact which irritate me.  Make your analysis of the swing, talk about the features of the course, but don't make stupid conjectures.  

Look at joy and elation Johnny had with the results of the so-called swing changes.

I look at things from a statistical perspective.  Phil hit 50% of the fairways and didn't do much better with the GIR statistic either.  Granted he played a great round of golf on Sunday, who is to say that is totally attributed to his work with Butch.  Could his ball striking on Sunday be an example of the placebo effect?  

To say that his work with Butch has caused this win is irresponsible.  It may in-fact have, but we don't know that yet.  We will have to wait and see if Phil is consistently better before we start making claims.  

Final thought.  Phil played great; I'm not unhappy that he won.  I really just wish Johnny would choose his words more carefully and try to be more objective about the things he is emotional about.

[Kalen Braley]

Agreed Justin,

Thats a huge irritant when he starts making stuff up on the fly during the telecast.  Just stick to the swing analysis stuff..

As for player playing just for the money, I think its really easy to judge on this one.  How many of us work just for the love and don't care about the money??  We are all motivated by the money and I don't see why these guys should be any different.

While I do think it was heroic that Sean went for it on 17, it wouldn't have made any sense if he was 4-5 shots down with no hope of catching Phil.  After all the 17th hole cost him hundreds of thousands of dollars, thats nothing to snub your nose at, at least not for me....

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