IS WALKING REALLY ENCOURAGED?

[mike_beene]

some people at my club use 4-baggers.I would rather just carry.It's hard to stay in rhythm.You always end up with your bag across the fairway with the club you want.

[Bill_McBride]

deleting a duplicate:-X

[Steve Pozaric]

An observation from the midwest - few public courses allow walking; most are lower end few wise.  One exception on the higher end is Gateway National that charges the same walk or ride.  It has bent grass fairways which means, for public golf it is cart path only (it works as the fairways are always very nice).  Therefore, I figure it is just as fast to walk  - plus it is a pretty easy walk as well.

A friend just joined a private course in the S.W. suburbs and told me that his dues cover greens fees, but when he plays, he either must pay a $10 cart fee (per person) or, get this, a $5 riding fee!  One of the benefits, I guess of being a member of a non-equity club.

Steve P

[Evan Fleisher]

At my club, many of the older members use those motorized three-wheeled club carriers due to the extreme elevation changes...but at least they are walking!

As for the younger (my age group...30-somethings) set, most walk and carry...I love it!  We have very few cart paths around the course, and even though the course is quite short, average pace is 3:15-3:30 for a 4-some.  Alone, my normal pace is 2:30.

I agree with Adam's comments earlier...pay for services rendered, and let me choose my "poison".

[Tim Weiman]

Evan Fleisher:

One of the things which scares me most about golf in America is the preference young people seem to have for carts. When I say young, I mean age 15 -25. There aren't many I've met who could have joined us for that memorable fivesome in Pinehurst.

Down at my local muni, I did my best one day to be a crumpy old man to two teenagers in carts. I barked at them:

"What the hell are you doing in a cart?", foolishly hoping to embarrass them into getting some exercise.

To my utter amazement, one of these kids replied "Casey Martin does it".

All was lost right then and there.

[Jonathan Cummings]

Here's a prediction that will make all 1154 of you run for the hills.

In ten years there will be very few courses in Ireland and Scotland where carts (buggies) aren't available!  Each year I go over more and more courses ask if you want a buggy.  it's just too much of a revenue producer to ignore.  And believe it or not, you would shudder at the number of American golfers showing up at the Old Country courses who would prefer a cart to a caddie!  

JC

[stat man]

Stat-Man:

Are you referencing daily-fee courses in NJ?  Although I no longer live in The Garden State, I did for four years in the mid-90s (and my parents do currently).  My father's course, Canoe Brook CC, requires walking - caddy or tote your own bag - unless you (essentially) have a note from your doctor or at least a VERY good excuse to take a cart.  And Baltusrol has an equally strong (if not stronger) commitment to its caddy program (i.e. walking).  I also used to play the county courses a lot which had NO problem with walking.  Then again this was pre-1998, so I could be wrong.

MB_Lewis: I was referring to the public courses; I know most of the private courses in NJ still allow walking, but the vast majority of the nicer public courses in Central Jersey make it either difficult or impossible to walk (e.g. Royce Brook, where you are "welcome" to walk as long as it is after 4 pm).

[Paul Turner]

I've yet to see battery powered trolleys in the US, which are really popular with older players in the UK.   Are these used at all?

[Scott_Burroughs]

Paul,

Yes, they are used in the U.S.  Most common brand is the Kangaroo Kaddy.  I think they're more popular with "seniors", generally at private clubs.  The more expensvie models have remote controls to steer them around turns.

The TPC courses in the U.S. provide them for rental, usually as the only way to walk.  

[A Clay Man]

I can't wait to see how the greedy bastards deal with "The Segway".

Trail fee? Banning? Path only?

How will these guys screw this one up, or at worst, try to make a buck or 20.

[Will W]

behold, the segway golf trolley

http://www.davemathews.com/fun/segwaygt.html

[Jerry Kluger]

The TPC course I belonged to had allowed electric walking carts when they opened but discontinued them after a couple of years.  For those of you who are considering a three wheeled walking cart spend the few extra dollars and get one with a handbrake which is similar to the one used on a bicycle.  You have to remember that you push them so they go down a hill in front of you which can be difficult without a brake.  My current course was considering charging a walking fee but they backed off, they do not however, allow electric walking carts as the owners are still revenue driven and the electric hand carts make walking a piece of cake.

[Tim Weiman]

Jonathan:

I fear you are correct. The American influence on golf in the UK & Ireland is already too strong. I hear it is making its way to Australia as well.

We should be doing more to emulate what they have overseas, but unfortunately things are moving in the opposite direction.

[A.G._Crockett]

Tim,
     I wouldn't be too quick to blame Americans for Scots/Brits/Irish using carts.  A brief story:
     I am a high school golf coach.  The club where my team practices and plays matches has begun an annual Ryder Cup style match with a club from Scotland.  The first year was there, then this past April, the Scots came here to play.  The club required my players to caddy for these matches as a condition of our use of the course.  Our region tournament was to be on the following Tues., and I was afraid that after double-bagging for two days on Sat. and Sun., they be too wiped out to contend, but we were locked in.
     Well, Sat. a.m. was chilly and windy (VERY Scottish feel) and lo and behold, all but two of the Scots (out of 12) insisted on riding!  These were NOT "young" golfers.  All were between the ages of 35 and 60 and in robust health.  So, off my players went on the back of a cart, with their "caddying" confined to pulling clubs and reading putts.  Far, far more of the locals walked than the Scots for the two days of the matches.
     Moral of the story?

[THuckaby2]

    Moral of the story?

That the grass is always greener on the other side indeed.  Scots rave about Myrtle Beach, lush green grass, carts with GPS, beautiful girls serving drinks on the course... we rave about firm and fast and walking.

Each does so because it's different from his normal game.

Human nature.

TH

[Scott_Burroughs]

While you have a point, Huck, I've been walking and carrying since I started golf, and I don't ever long for cartball.  Those in the U.S. who want cartball grew up or were taught the game or were forced into it and accept it as part of the game.  Those in the U.S. who desire walking and f&f grew up on it and had it taken away.

[THuckaby2]

Of course you don't long for cartball, Scott - you are a right-thinking US golfer and it's too prevalent everywhere here!

I get what you're saying though - the grass isn't any greener for you.  But that's a product of your environment here.

It constantly amazes me how many Scots, Brits, Irish rave about our lushness, carts, etc. and look at us as daft when we praise the conditions over there.  I'd have to guess Mr. Goodale will concur on this (unless he's in one of his contrarian moods, that is!    ).

In any case, of course this is just a huge generalization.  The majority of Scots would likely sooner break their arms than ride, just as there is a huge segment of Americans for whom walking just isn't part of the game.

But for those who care enough to comment, I really think it's true that the grass is greener.

TH

[Evan Fleisher]

Tim,

Agreed on our memorable round in NC, and agreed on your point regarding many of the truly "younger" set (i.e. 15-20somethings).  When I see some of the member's kids driving around in carts, and appear to be in perfect health, it really bugs me.  I too want to scream at them, but fear a retort similar to the one you encountered.

The funny thing is, though...for as many folks that want to emulate the professional golfer in any way possible (swing like them, play like them, have the same equipment, etc.), the one thing they seem to refuse to do is walk and play...JUST LIKE THE PROS DO!  Go figure...

[Scott_Burroughs]

That's also an interesting adjective, "right-thinking".  "Right" means conservative, which often means "traditional", as walking is.  But in today's golf world, the walkers are often the "radicals", "militants", and "against the system" folks at clubs that allow both, and thus would be considered the "leftists" or "liberals"!  

[THuckaby2]

Ok Scott, make it "correct-thinking."  That's more what I had in mind!  Interesting thought though....

TH

[Jeff Goldman]

Jonathan,

Yipes!  What "old country courses" in Ireland/Scotland now have carts?

[Dan Kelly]

Tim Weiman got me thinking when he wrote this -- which, in my experience, sounds exactly right:

"One of the things which scares me most about golf in America is the preference young people seem to have for carts. When I say young, I mean age 15 -25. There aren't many I've met who could have joined us for that memorable fivesome in Pinehurst.

"Down at my local muni, I did my best one day to be a crumpy old man to two teenagers in carts. I barked at them:

" 'What the hell are you doing in a cart?', foolishly hoping to embarrass them into getting some exercise.

"To my utter amazement, one of these kids replied 'Casey Martin does it'.

"All was lost right then and there."

BUT PERHAPS NOT! I have two daughters, ages 11 and 13, who LOVE carts. I've let them know, innumerable times, in no uncertain terms, that golf is meant to be a game played while walking. They know that I walk whenever I'm allowed to. And still they LOVE carts.

Who can blame them, really? When you're 11 or 13 years old, what could be more fun than driving a golf cart -- up hills, down hills, around bends, across country?

That's POWER, man!

So here's what Tim got me thinking: What the cartball courses of this country need are fleets of young cart drivers -- kids too young to drive cars on the highways. Train them to drive the carts for groups of walking golfers. Divide their puny wages among the players. Let them get their cart jollies out of their systems when they're young! Show them, by example, that walking is part of golf.  

Win win win.

[Frank Poncherello]

Nice idea...  but most public courses and munis require a valid Driver's License to take out a cart.  Now how are they going to have underage 10 and 11 year old drivers, and what happens when a juvenile driver runs over a golfer or drives into a lake.

[Dan Kelly]

Frank --

I didn't say it was a workable idea -- just a good one!

So: Lower the age limit for driving golf carts, and require a specified amount of training. Or limit it to kids with valid licenses.

But you do make me wonder: What happens, in our lovely litigious world, when a cart driver (w/ valid license) drives over another golfer (or into a lake)? What happens when the second golfer testifies that the cartball course more than happily served the first golfer a series of alcoholic beverages? Do the words "contributory negligence" enter the picture?

[Jerry Kluger]

I play with my 8 year old son in the afternoon on the weekends and we never ride.  I think that a great think to do when you are walking in a non-competition round is to select a few clubs and leave the rest behind.  By taking two woods and perhaps 4 or 5 irons and a putter you have to improvise alot more and makes your home course a different type of challenge.  You get to see whether you can play a run up shot into some greens as well as whether you can hit a stinger like Tiger.  Trying these shots at the range is one thing but on the course it is entirely different; it also adds more to your arsenal when you have to play one of these shots.