Is it fair to judge an architect on how he presents himself?

[John Kavanaugh]

Of the architects you have met or observed in the media do you see any correlation between how they look or live their personal lives and their work.  Crenshaw is a perfect example.

[Tim Copeland]

I would rather look at how they conduct their personal affairs....at least that has been my experience

[John Kavanaugh]

I would rather look at how they conduct their personal affairs....at least that has been my experience

I try to avoid hiring people who have been divorced for high level jobs but that may not be fair when considering an architect given all the travel.  What do you mean by personal affairs?

[Tim Copeland]

I would rather look at how they conduct their personal affairs....at least that has been my experience

I try to avoid hiring people who have been divorced for high level jobs but that may not be fair when considering an architect given all the travel.  What do you mean by personal affairs?

I mean...do they pay their bills....do they pay their people....do they pay their partners.........ethics......handshake stuff.....old school.  Look someone in the eye and mean what you say.

I guess I am just old fashioned

[Mike Nuzzo]

Yes.  I've met a lot of architects.

What does divorce have to do with proficiency?
It might even show how they handled themselves positively in an adverse situation.

[Marty Bonnar]

Yes.  I've met a lot of architects.

What does divorce have to do with proficiency?
It might even show how they handled themselves positively in an adverse situation.

A guy with an ITALIAN surname HAS to ask a guy with an IRISH surname such a question?

Oy vay, I've suddenly become Jewish! With the 'such a question' comment. Pass me the pernicious knishes and the bagels with lox and cream cheese, Mildred.

Sorry, still punch drunk from the Reverse TOC, em, 'experience'!

 
FBD.

[Phil Benedict]

You certainly shouldn't judge their work by how they present themselves, anymore than you would any creative person. To take two examples, Van Gogh and Mozart were a mess, but it doesn't make their art any less great.

[Tony Ristola]

I wonder how some of the dead old guys would stack up?

[Tom Huckaby]

I think we ought to judge architects by the car they drive.

Have any thoughts on this, Mike?

 

[paul cowley]

.....I don't think you can really judge a persons work on how he presents himself, and this is true of many professions.....but you can sometimes judge a person on how he presents himself....but not always....both the good and the bad people can fool you.

You really need to look at the work and judge it for yourself....on its merits, not on how the person responsible for its creation might act or live.

I'd seperate the two.

[John Kavanaugh]

I wonder how some of the dead old guys would stack up?

I think Donald Ross really looked like a good architect and I would say that most members of Ross courses agree just based on the number of photos of him in their club houses.  French Lick even has a little replica outfit that he used to wear hanging on the wall.

[Neil_Crafter]

...no more fair than judging any lawyer, doctor, milkman, plumber etc that you may meet day to day......that's an awful lot of judging to do each and every day.

[Ian Andrew]

I perfer Van Gogh to all other painters - his personal life has nothing to do with that decision - I like the way his work makes me feel when I take the time to get lost in his paintings.

I restore Walter Travis courses, but don't care for some of the things he did in his personal life. I still like his architecture and spend a great deal of time preserving it.

The two have nothing to do with each other John.

[Kalen Braley]

Call me old fashioned here, but I would be a lot less inclined to judge someone based on thier looks and more inclinded to judge them based on thier resume and what they have done.

Working in the tech industry, judging the book by its cover will get you absolutly nowhere.  One of the smartest and most brilliant ASIC designers I've ever met has no college degree and little certifications or training otherwise.  As for appearance, he looks like a bagger boy from your local supermarket.  But have that guy design an ASIC or FPGA chip for you and he plays 2nd fiddle to almost no one.  I've seen him whip out mathematical formulas and work out complex calculations when confronted by PH'd types that left them walking away embarassed with thier tail between thier legs.

And to the forum troller otherwise known as JK, judging people based on a divorce is a complete joke and doesn't even need counter argument.

[John Kavanaugh]

I perfer Van Gogh to all other painters - his personal life has nothing to do with that decision - I like the way his work makes me feel when I take the time to get lost in his paintings.

I restore Walter Travis courses, but don't care for some of the things he did in his personal life. I still like his architecture and spend a great deal of time preserving it.

The two have nothing to do with each other John.

Ian,

I wonder if you would like or see the pain in Van Gogh paintings if he was an accountant who painted only on Saturday afternoons and led a long and happy life.

In case are not aware your avitar presents an image of you that helps us determine if we think you are a good architect or not.  I consider it a positive image that boosts my opinion of you.  I bet you focus on alot of those things when attempting to get hired and don't just slap a portfolio on the table and say take it or leave it.

As for divorce I would only use it as a piece of a puzzle.  My number one man working for me now is the most loving and best family man I have ever known...I hired him first and only because of his moral virtue and trained him the numbers of the game.  He is clearly the best in the industry today and only doesn't leave me for more money because of his strong sense of loyalty.  note:  I got my job because I popped out of the business owners wifes womb...it is a more common path to success that I would also recommend.

[Voytek Wilczak]

Of the architects you have met or observed in the media do you see any correlation between how they look or live their personal lives and their work.  Crenshaw is a perfect example.

I saw and heard Tom Doak for the first time on the Sebonack DVD.

Tom comes across in these interviews as very intense, intelligent and passionate.

I'd say it correlates well with his work.

[Mike Nuzzo]

Ian,
I thought your blog was how you presented yourself to the public.

I was thinking about my business cards, my envelopes, my hats, my booth display....
I think it speaks to my attention to detail and creative side.

I've listened to some architects speak about items for which they are completely unfamiliar.

Tom,
Simpson used to drive a Rolls to meet with green committees.  Should I have gone with an Aston Martin in stead?  

[JESII]

Of the architects you have met or observed in the media do you see any correlation between how they look or live their personal lives and their work.  Crenshaw is a perfect example.

I'd have a hard time believing a golf course architect is capable of keeping "who they are" out of their work.

Now, if you're talking about judging an architect in the interview stage for a job, you better include presentation as part of the analysis...

[Mike Nuzzo]

I saw an old potential client at a conference recently.
He told me he selected Nicklaus Design.
I congratulated him and said good for him, I bet it was a big decision and Nicklaus certainly brings a lot of exposure.

When he asked me if I thought a golfer would know the difference between a JN signature design and a regular design I told him there was a small faction of golfers who would avoid both.

Mr. Youngs recent announcement might be a little low too.  

[Jim Nugent]

You certainly shouldn't judge their work by how they present themselves, anymore than you would any creative person. To take two examples, Van Gogh and Mozart were a mess, but it doesn't make their art any less great.

Mozart a mess?

[Brad Klein]

Tim Copeland, what you refer to as "personal" is actually professional, namely how they conduct their business.

JK, it's a good thing asking for the kind of things you say you think is relevant is actually illegal to ask about in a job interview. Two of the most heralded (and talented) architects named in this thread happen to have been divorced. It's obviously irrelevant.

Actually, the best guide to how people really are and what they are like to work with is not how they present themselves in formal settings before the media or in job interviews. It's seeing how they treat and work with their colleagues, or better yet, how they treat service staff (waiters and waitresses, bar tenders, taxi drivers) in informal everyday situations.

[Mike_Young]

It think it is FAIR to judge anyone by how they present themselves.....sometimes you will be wrong......but first impressions are usually pretty accurate...in person that is......I have been wrong about internet impressions several times...

[John Kavanaugh]

I said in my first response that divorce may not be relevant to architects because of the travel.  It is more something you might consider when hiring an employee that you would like not to leave right after you have them properly trained.  Not to mention that it can be a bitch to handle taking out the court ordered child support out of each check.

I really like the inclusion of observing how someone treats a taxi driver.  Taxi drivers are easily the rudest service industy people going..I'd love to make one of them eat their blue tooth just once.  note: I wouldn't hire an architect or anyone that wears a blue tooth in public even if it meant he could have both hands free to hold a set of plans.  Blue tooth in car while driving alone is the only acceptable use.

[Mike_Young]

JK,
Right on with the blue tooth thing......

[John Kavanaugh]

One reason I will never be a fan of resort golf is that the first time I ever saw a blue tooth was at the Bandon Resort.  I actually talked back to the guy until he pointed at his ear like I was the douche bag.