Maidstone watering

[TEPaul]

Pete, I know how to tell the difference between dormant and dead grass but that isn't the point about Maidstone putting in a fairway irrigation system. Furthermore one doesn't have to be an agronomist to have an opinion on a fairway irrigation system there. The course has been without one forever and even in the worse of times when it was totally fried and baked it was very cool to play and to look at, in my opinion. One of Maidstone's most important assets has always been its complete variability in a number of ways, and it's always seemed to me like the closest thing to linksland style golf over here.

[James Bennett]

So, Newport and Fishers island don't have fairway irrigation.

You can add one of this year's Buda Cup course to that list as well - Alwoodley in Leeds!  No sprinkler heads in the fairway there for distances (although they do have a 150 yard green-coloured stake in the rough).  And short (perhaps 5 foot) pins as well to add to the confusion.  You can get a yardage book in the pro shop if you wish!

Irrigation can be used to ensure dormant grass doesn't die.  It can also be used to ensure a more consistent playing style (maintenance meld).  Different shades of firmness if you will.  It will be interesting to see how the membership reacts to these changes, and to the challenges that mother nature throws at the club.  Extended droughts can be particularly challenging.

I can recall Royal Adelaide in the late 1970's when irrigation was still conducted by travelling sprinkler.  RA was one of the last to install fairway watering.  They then went through a period once automatic irrigation was installed where the fairways became closer to lush (presumably through more watering) and in more recent times, a better balance (IMO) has been found with a little less water apparent.

James B

[Kalen Braley]

James,

How are you finding the courses in your neck of the woods based on the drought that is going on?  I'll bet they are playing extra fast and firm...

[Don_Mahaffey]

I thought Fishers had a quick coupler system? Certainly not a modern system, but not the same as no fwy irrigation at all. Mr. Beck can set me straight.
As far as TPaul knowing if the grass is dead or not...why if it's deader then a smelt then it aint coming back. If it's still kicking then it'll be OK provided mother nature comes to the rescue.  

[James Bennett]

Kalen

Any course that does not have reliable bores/dams/aquifer storage/stormwater capture schemes is facing challenges.  I know of some in Adelaide that are very firm (hard) and fast (bouncy).  Any course reliant on town water is having increased difficulty in retaining quality turf.  However, most courses have transferred from soft grasses (bents and poa) in their fairways over recent years to couch (often santa anna) - you call it bermuda.  It is more drought tolerant.  However, the roughs are very barren, desert like.  And those areas with significant trees nearby can be quite powdery as the tree roots are removing whatever water is still there.  Greens generally have a bent emphasis - those with predominantly poa are having a more challenging task.

The sub-soils are drying out and will take more than a year to restabilise, so that will be interesting.  Tree failures over the coming year will be interesting to follow.

However, the vast majority of courses have enough water for tees, greens and adjacent surrounds.  And most courses have enough water for fairways.  But not every one, and not every 'great' course has enough water. Some have had to 'tanker in' water for greens.  But a quick downpour (half an inch or so) and things green up pretty quickly everywhere.  It is the subsoil that is waiting for a genuine year of rain.

I expect Ed Getka will be able to comment on the changing face of golf across Melbourne and Adelaide over the next fortnight or so.  It will be different from course to course within a city, and from city to city.

By the way, Adelaide has had a good rain in mid-January, and one in late March.  That is it for this year, despite an early close to rainfall in mid-August last year!

Sorry if the answer is a bit all over the place, but the experience with the drought literally varies from club to club.

James B

[Anthony_Nysse]

TEPAUL,
  In your last post to Mr. Wendt, you make it sound like the whole reason that you're against the fairway irrigation is because "it looked cool to play and look at." I think that Maidstone would benefit more than anyone might know and this would save so many headaches from Robert Williams. I think that you need to give Mr. Williams some credit-He been the superintendent at Maidstone, a perenial Top 100 course, for years, so I'm going to guess that he knows a thing or two about watering and keeping things fast a firm. It's really amazing what supterintendent's know, especially those at Top 100 courses..there are reasons that they are there. Keep in mind the type of membership that they have there-I'm sure that they'd like to play on grass from time to time. We have 1500 irrigation heads and each green is equiped with back to back heads, as most updated courses are. Does this mean that we water every night with these heads? Not-we hand water to prvide an firm, drier surface and only apply water where it's needed. By Maidstone putting an irrigation system in is just another tool for them in a time of crisis...I'm sure that Mr. Williams will not loose sight of the things that Maidstone is known for.
  I personally think that Maidstone is extremely overrated. Take away #8, #9, and #14 and Montauk Downs is the better course. But keep in mind, I look at courses with a much keener eye to argonomy, but it still doesn't take away from the fact that Maidstone is overrated. #1-3 might be the worst opening 3 holes on a Top 100 course....

Tony Nysse
Sr. Asst. Supt.
Long Cove Club
HHI, SC

[Michael_Stachowicz]

Irrigation is just on more tool in the box to manage a course to the membership's vision.  Like all of our tools, it can be used or misused.  This subject, in general, makes the position of superintendent and green committee chair extremely important...one wrong person in there and the water is on all the time and all the best intentions of the people in the present are wipe out by a bad future choice.

[TEPaul]

Anthony:

Everyone has their own opinions on golf course---that's fine, and obviously you have yours on Maidstone, although I certainly don't share it. #1-#3 seem to be pretty bland looking holes for some but I think they can play just wonderful and sure have for me over the years. You mentioned #8 and #14 but oddly forgot to mention #9 that just may be my favorite par 4 in the world. If you don't like that one I suggest you go look again.

[Donnie Beck]

Just beacuse you have an irrigation system doesn't mean you have to use it. I have spoken with Hook on several occasions and I can assure you Maidstone will not become lush. As for Fishers we have no quick couplers but do have irrigation on a few fairways for a variety of reasons. We have a few low lying fairways (13, 14,15 ) that become flooded with salt water a few times a year and need irrigation to leach the salt through the soil profile to keep the grass alive. We also have irrigation on holes 6 and 8 due to the sandy soil and rolling terrain. I would say on average our fwy irrigation is used less that 5 times per season. For the record our yearly water usage for the entire course averages 4-5 million gallons per year.

[Anthony_Nysse]

Tom,
  The extra "8" was ment to be a "9" as I think #9 at Maidstone is world class, without a doubt.

[Steve Curry]

Let'em be!  It could easily be argued that to have good turf quality for the fall, the seeding of the dead spots needs water.  A perfect balance of dry, not dead can be attained and should.
Opening today, latest in my decade long tenure here at BHCC.
Cheers,
Steve


Still Alive and Well!

[Craig Sweet]

Steve is that your pin setter with you?

[TEPaul]

Donnie:

To your knowledge has Fishers ever had whole fairways or a large portion of them die due to lack of irrigation.

Two summers ago you had totally dry conditions for what---a month, six weeks, and the grass came right back again when you got the rain, right?

[Steve Curry]

Craig,

That's him.

Tom,

I'll let Donnie answer your question but, will comment that the weather is more than likely different from Maidstone to Fishers Island not to mention that traffic on dormant turf is probably the greatest detriment.

Steve

[Don_Mahaffey]

As for Fishers we have no quick couplers...

Thanks Donnie,
Thought I’d read it somewhere but I've most likely confused your course with another.
There goes my dream of being your night waterman after I retire (or get retired). Run water at night and fish in the morning...now I've got to find another old gem on the coast to dream about.

[Patrick_Mucci]

On a related note.  Found this link about a course in Florida being challenged because of its 1 million gallon per day water allotment.

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/localnews/content/local_news/epaper/2007/04/10/s1a_GOLFCOURSE_0410.html

That seems to be an awful lot of water.  Is this typical for courses in Florida??

South Florida golf courses are now on water restrictions.
And, they may be ratcheted down further.

It's been said that it would have to rain every day for six or more weeks to break the drought.

It will be interesting to see how the golf courses fare in the coming months.

With water becoming a more precious and expensive commodity, how many clubs are developing long range plans for future water use, especially under possibility of long term restrictive limitations ?

[Patrick_Mucci]

On a related note.  Found this link about a course in Florida being challenged because of its 1 million gallon per day water allotment.

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/localnews/content/local_news/epaper/2007/04/10/s1a_GOLFCOURSE_0410.html

That seems to be an awful lot of water.  Is this typical for courses in Florida??

South Florida golf courses are now on water restrictions.
And, they may be ratcheted down further.

It's been said that it would have to rain every day for six or more weeks to break the drought.

It will be interesting to see how the golf courses fare in the coming months.

With water becoming a more precious and expensive commodity, how many clubs are developing long range plans for future water use, especially under possibility of long term restrictive limitations ?

Kalen,

I was in South Florida recently and what was startling was the fact that I never saw a brown blade of grass, anywhere except on some golf courses.

Every residence, every residential community is as lush and as green as you could imagine.

The use, and waste, of water in South Florida is mind boggling.

You could have rain all day for four straight days and the auto sprinklers will be going full blast at every residential community.

The culprit in Florida, in my opinion, is snow birds from the north who desire, if not demand, lush green conditions for their lawns, landscaping and golf courses.

[Bill Gayne]

In a drought, I don't think a million gallons of water is a whole lot. One inch of rain on an acre requires 27,000 gallons of water. So if you water 80 acres with a million gallons it's less than the equivalent of a half inch a day.

(disclaimer: I'm not a superintendent and have a hard time growing grass in my yard, so if I'm wrong about a half inch not being much hopefully someone will correct me.)

[Mike_Cirba]

Levelling greens at Merion and irrigating Maidstone all in a month.

What's next, permanently narrowing the fairways at Oakmont by moving bunkers that had been there since Father Fownes time and extending Augusta to 7500 tree-lined yards?  Oh wait...
 

I understand the the 3rd horseman of the Apocalypse is already saddling up...

[TEPaul]

".... not to mention that traffic on dormant turf is probably the greatest detriment."

Steve:

Definitely. Carts on a course like Fishers when the fairways are really dry is certainly the worst thing for the turf.

[George Pazin]

Levelling greens at Merion and irrigating Maidstone all in a month.

What's next, permanently narrowing the fairways at Oakmont by moving bunkers that had been there since Father Fownes time and extending Augusta to 7500 tree-lined yards?  Oh wait...
 

I understand the the 3rd horseman of the Apocalypse is already saddling up...

Mike, you'll be relieved to know that the sign for the 4th horseman was related to me a few years ago, from one of my band clients. He said they would get signed to a national label right before that guy came galloping in. His band has since disbanded, so you may just be safe.

Re: South Florida, I have an uncaany ability to bring the rain when I travel, so let me know if you need help ending the drought!

[Ray Tennenbaum]

I must say I think it's quite unfortunate -- then again I'm pretty unclubbable.  seriously though, it has the potential for setting a precedent which Maidstone's neighbors will feel compelled to honor.

one reason I posted the article was because it seemed to skip around characterizing the golf course as having been built upon linksland, especially since observers far more knowledgeable than I have observed that it's the only one truly built on such land to be found over here.  I think Russell Drumm is a pretty good reporter, but when Kevin Smith says the term is "used loosely these days," that doesn't change the fact that it fits Maidstone perfectly.