Real Links Golf is on Fescue's.

[Greg Murphy]

The interior of the north american continent used to be sea. Continental uplift gradually displaced the sea resulting in what is now known as the North American Great Plains. Initially, the resulting landscape was the nearly flat floor of the former sea but wind and water and time went to work, ultimately creating two of the most ideal types of terrain and setting for golf—the first being scenic gorges, valleys and lakes carved by streams fed by mountain and glacial melt water and the second being waves of undulating sand dunes sculpted by wind, more commonly associated with sea side links land.

[Troy Alderson]

Back to fescue and links land,

IMHO, though fescue is the best links turf, but bents can play FF with little input "in the right climate" and "with the right paying customers".

I really do not think that any golf course is pure one grass or another.  Many can be 90%+ one grass or another like in the PNW with poa annua.  Even on a true links across the pond, there are many different grasses dependent upon the microclimate.  Low areas will hold more water, high areas are drier and the grasses adapt.  Every golf course has pockets of bent, poa, fescue, rye, and others as long as the macroclimate is compatible with the turf type.

As superintendent's manage for FF, they will change to the grasses that can adapt to FF.  I will say that links golf is conditions and not necessarily turf type.

Troy

[Greg Murphy]

Troy

A seed seller told me years ago that what we consider fescue fairways in the UK are really primarily "meadow grass", a type of bluegrass. A Wikipedia article on smooth meadow grass says (poa pratensis) "is a species of grass native to Europe, Asia and northern Africa . . . used extensively by grazing livestock like cattle and sheep. . . that has become one of the most popular turf grasses in North America where it has been re-named "Kentucky Bluegrass". This re-naming is not accepted within the species' native area."

Is it possible the UK links are really populated by bluegrass rather than fescue?

Greg

[Tom_Doak]

Greg:

You've lost it in the translation.

There is very little Kentucky bluegrass on most links courses, but on some, there is a lot of annual bluegrass ... poa annua.  Since it seldom sees enough heat stress in the UK to kill it, it can become dominant on some courses; it is even specified as a small part (5% to 15%) of seed mixes on many European courses.  

However, that line that "links courses are not really fescue" is seed salesman b.s.  There is a lot of fescue at most of the great links, and the greenkeepers there try to manage for it, although they are NOT purists who try to keep 100% pure fairways of any species -- they go with the flow.

[Marc Haring]

I would say that UK fairways have a very high meadow grass component but not UK links courses. It’s just too dry and impoverished for it. UK links courses are mainly bent or fescue and as Tom states, they really just go with the flow. I remember hearing about one of the great links courses that hadn’t fed the fairways for about 30 years and they sacked the guy that did.

Here is a close up of one of the fairways for the Troon Open. Looks like mainly bent (and a stoloniferous one at that) to me with a fair fescue component.

[Marc Haring]

Hey Guys.

Here are a couple of pics of my UK course fairways. I’d be interested to here whether you think this is the ideal maintenance meld and would it be acceptable on your side of the pond?

[Greg Murphy]

Tom & others,

In the Canadian Plains, we are more than a thousand miles from the nearest sea (ancients excluded) but we have vast sand hill areas and lots of other terrain naturally suitable for running "links-style" golf but I'm not aware of anyone who has had the guts to go with fescue fairways. Part of the reluctance may be a fear that there is no demand from the clientele. But even assuming there exists a taste for fast and firm golf, there is the fear of turf failure. Temperatures are extreme, 80-90 farenheit are common highs in the summer and there's usually a couple of days each winter that dip to 35 below. It's windy all year and snow cover is light so dessication is a factor not just in the summer, but all winter long as well. Are you aware of success with any particular brand or mix of fescue cultivars in such an environment?

Greg

[Tom_Doak]

Greg:

I believe the climate you describe is very similar to what's in the Sand Hills in Nebraska and Colorado ... maybe a bit cooler on both ends of the scale, but it's pretty harsh there, too.

Sand Hills started with fescue fairways but lost some in severe winters (partly because they have always kept it on the green side during the summers) ... it's a mixture of grasses now.  Wild Horse has bluegrass fairways and fescue approaches, a good compromise ... they went with the bluegrass because of cart use, which is an issue at Sand Hills.  Ballyneal is fescue and no carts, but it's new, so we'll have to see how it holds up.

[Brent Hutto]

Living as I do in the southeastern USA, seeing Marc Haring's photos makes me want to hop on a plane. But Tom Doak puts his finger on the ultimate answer to Marc's question about acceptability over here of UK-style turf...golf carts.

Marc, I assume that the grasses you depict would be quickly obliterated if driven over by numerous golf carts on a daily basis. If that's the case, then regardless of USA golfer's preferences as to playing surface qualities there would only be a tiny fraction (maybe 1%, 2%?) of USA courses willing to try grass that can't take cart traffic.

I'm explicitly not encouraging one of those tiresome "carts vs. walkers" threadjacks here. But I think at the vast majority of public and resort courses as well as a great many private courses in this country everything has to start with the use of carts and work from there.

Speculating for a moment that the day might come in a decade or two or three when UK golf becomes as cart-centric as in North America...

Can you think of anything that could be maintenance practice-wise to allow fine, cool-weather native turf to thrive when being driven upon? Or what would a course like yours have to do if its membership became insistent on the option of riding in two-person powered carts?

[Marc Haring]

Brent.

You know, I really don't think that extensive cart use would be a problem. It's surprising how tough that grass is. Not Bermuda tough but still pretty resistant to wear. I think Tom got it about right when he said they kept it a bit too green at Sandhills. Fescue just shouldn't be that colour or it just gets too weak and leafy and is then very susceptible to winter damage and wear. When I moved to a low nitrogen policy on my greens, the triplex ring just cleared up on its own. The grass got much coarser with a higher lignin (woody material) content and frankly became indestructible.

It's like us, if we pig out on high calorie stuff we may get bigger but we're not going to be in good shape. Keep it lean and half the problems go away.