[Matt_Ward]

The real key w any state ratings is that you need to fully appreciate the local knowledge of those who play the courses on a much more steadier basis than the "drive by" person who just comes by for a periodic visit.

If you scale the process where local people are weighed at say 2/3's of the total it's more likely you will get the necessary changes in terms of what courses are improving and those that simply hang on because of past recognition.

Frankly, I get more enjoyment in hearing about those courses that are not rated highly or even at all -- it is usually these courses that I try to seek out with any visit I make and more often than not -- the info I get is very accurate.

[Doug Siebert]

Iowa's list is crap:

1. Harvester, Ames (No. 52 m)
2. Spirit Hollow, Burlington (m)
3. Amana Colonies, Amana (m)
4. Veenker Memorial, Ames (c)
5. Hunters Ridge, Marion (m)*

#1 is a no brainer that few would argue with, but Spirit Hollow as #2 is ridiculous.  There are two better public courses within 20 minutes of me, neither of which is on the list.

I could go on, but I think Iowa proves Matt's point quite well.  It isn't a golf destination at the top of anyone's list, even for Iowa residents, so the "drive by" ratings are probably worse here than about anywhere.  To Matt's credit, when he did his most recent "drive by" of Iowa a year ago, I encouraged him to stop by on the way and have a look at a nearby course I feel is underrated and worth a look, and he was interested in doing so but unfortunately couldn't make it work in his schedule.

[Tim_Cronin]

Here's my home state:

 Illinois

Terry --

I was in your home state last week, and was wandering around Fort Sheridan.

There seemed to be a plethora of open ground, awaiting a golf course -- and a paucity of evidence that a golf course will result.

Do you know what 's up there?

Dan

Mike Keiser owns the Glen Club, a very difficult (from the back tees) and not very scenic Tom Fazio design that was built in that area.  Thunderhawk and Pine Meadow are in the general area as well.

There's supposed to be course in the offing for Fort Sheridan. I just wondered if you (or anyone) knows where the project stands.

The 1/3/2007 Lake County News-Sun reported the Lake County FPD is "moving forward" with plans to redevelop the original Fort Sheridan course, though no timetable was mentioned. I believe one architect's plans were already rejected. The course was closed for renovation in 2004.

And Kemper Lakes will have to come off the GW Illinois public list. It went all-private (after a transition period) on Monday. So which course moves into the top 10?

[Adam Clayman]

The 1/3/2007 Lake County News-Sun reported the Lake County FPD is "moving forward" with plans to redevelop the original Fort Sheridan course, though no timetable was mentioned. I believe one architect's plans were already rejected. The course was closed for renovation in 2004.

No where is there a better spot for the Old Macdonald idea than here.

[Matt_Ward]

Just curious if those who see certain courses as being overrated in their respective state(s) -- I wonder if those layouts are those that have opened recently (within 3-4 years) ?

Thanks ...

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Matt

In PA, I can't figure out how Ravens Claw(opened in 2005) is in the top 10 public in GW. I've played it twice and prefer Lederach which hopefully will break into PA's top 10 public in GW.

Steve

[Matt_Ward]

Steve:

The example you provided goes a long way to proving my point. The "one-time" out of area player can truly spike the ratings with visits to the newly opened layouts.

Too often those courses that are fairly established -- but far from dinosaur age can be neglected - especially if they have made a determined effort to improve themselves.

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