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ward peyronnin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Great(?) 19 th Holes
« on: December 27, 2006, 04:59:46 PM »


While I will welcome anecdotal or objective responses to what makes a great watering whole that is arguably OT and not really what i am after

I noticed the new Stoneagle Course boasts a tie breaker 19 th hole.

Can there be a great 19th hole?; is it worth the effort?; is this really an affectation demanded by the comfortless, balless developers out there or is it an architectural principle worth considering when time and money allow?

Happy New Year all you 19th holers
Ward P
"Golf is happiness. It's intoxication w/o the hangover; stimulation w/o the pills. It's price is high yet its rewards are richer. Some say its a boys pastime but it builds men. It cleanses the mind/rejuvenates the body. It is these things and many more for those of us who truly love it." M.Norman

Bill_McBride

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Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2006, 05:06:25 PM »
My favorite 19th hole is upstairs at North Berwick.  ;D

ward peyronnin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2006, 05:25:29 PM »
Damn good toasties Bill and you get to watch the guys limp out and in
"Golf is happiness. It's intoxication w/o the hangover; stimulation w/o the pills. It's price is high yet its rewards are richer. Some say its a boys pastime but it builds men. It cleanses the mind/rejuvenates the body. It is these things and many more for those of us who truly love it." M.Norman

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2006, 06:24:18 PM »
I take it you are talking about a golf hole.  The 19th hole at Kinloch plays any where from 150 yards to two hundred yards across a lake to a big green.

Forest Creek has a short par three that has interesting green-site.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2006, 06:59:06 PM »
A 19th hole is a neat idea if there's a natural hole present, and a reason to incorporate such a hole.  

I recall Tom Doak mentioning Stone Eagle's 19th, for example, was "there". In other words, it was a somewhat natural hole worth incorporating into the design of the course that also helped break-up a relatively long trek from the home green to the clubhouse.  

Knowing the developers wanted a unique golf experience, I looked at the possibility of a 19th hole at Sagebrush, in British Columbia, over the past year. There were a couple decent possibilities, before the 18th green was relocated, particularly in light of the trek, up a hill, to the lodge. I thought the 19th hole would provide a "reason" to play up the hill... to get to the lodge.

Anyway...

Scarboro Golf and Country Club has an interesting, and attractive 19th hole. One of Canada's most impressive clubhouses, and a wonderful specimen tree provide an unforgettable backdrop. More interesting, the green is a leftover from the original George Cumming layout at Scarboro. Course re-designer, A.W. Tillinghast (c. mid-1920s), used it for his bye hole; which bridges a gap between the 18th green there, and the clubhouse.

Scarboro's is a tough little 19th hole. It's only about 115 yards or so. But the green is very small, and severely tilted. The green's attached to the practice putting green, too!
jeffmingay.com

ward peyronnin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2006, 07:46:42 PM »
Jeff

Thanks for your focus. Yes I had in mind a golf hole altho I am almost as fond of the liquid kind.

Why shouldn't a first or 18 th serve just as well if properly planned. Is a 19th more of a bonus hole then? and therefore just a little compromised?

Ward
"Golf is happiness. It's intoxication w/o the hangover; stimulation w/o the pills. It's price is high yet its rewards are richer. Some say its a boys pastime but it builds men. It cleanses the mind/rejuvenates the body. It is these things and many more for those of us who truly love it." M.Norman

Kevin Pallier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2006, 08:13:51 PM »
The new 19th hole Mike Clayton put in at Kingston Heath is pretty good and looks like it been there for ages

Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2006, 08:24:15 PM »
ward,

The 19th is defintely a "bonus hole" per se. If a match goes to playoff, I figure the first hole should play as the 19th, not the bye- or bonus-hole.

Remember, too, Dr. Mackenzie's original Augusta National layout featured a 19th, or bye-hole. If my memory is correct, it played up from the 18th green toward the clubhouse; kinda utilizing another trek of sorts, from the home green to the clubhouse.
jeffmingay.com

David Stamm

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great(?) 19 th Holes
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2006, 10:43:28 PM »
3 words.............The Tap Room. ;D ;D ;D
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr