Opinions - The greens at Bandon

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

I really like the playing surfaces at the three Bandon courses. I do hope they can keep the fescue greens relatively poa free. My hats off to the supers and all other involved in the process.

[PThomas]

someone told me at Double Eagle they clean your spikes before you play to keep the poa out...

is this done anywhere else??

[SL_Solow]

I would like to hear from the greenkeepers on Paul's post.  I have been told by more than one "authority" that the spread of poa via spikes is largely a myth and that it naturally invades through wind, insects, birds etc.  What say the resident authorities?

[Bill_McBride]

someone told me at Double Eagle they clean your spikes before you play to keep the poa out...

is this done anywhere else??

U. S. Customs now has people assigned to cleaning the golf shoes of everyone who arrives from abroad with a golf bag.  I think this is for other issues than poa (mad cow?) but maybe it will help with poa too.  

With regard to poa eradication, the Valley Club of Montecito (MacKenzie in Santa Barbara) has an effective if expensive approach - there are one or two crews out on the course every day cutting any poa they find out of the fairways.  

[Paul Carey]

Nantucket Golf Club sprays the golf shoes of guests for Poa.  At least they did when I played about 7 years ago.

[Marc Haring]

I would like to hear from the greenkeepers on Paul's post.  I have been told by more than one "authority" that the spread of poa via spikes is largely a myth and that it naturally invades through wind, insects, birds etc.  What say the resident authorities?

I would say that it is spread a lot more than people think through the actions of golfers. Courses such as Adrian's can keep the poa out for a good period of time but any course that rebuilds a couple of their greens usually finds the poa coming back almost overnight. There is just too much of it on the other greens; it's bound to spread in.

[Adrian_Stiff]

Marc, are there any roughly known numbers how Poa gets in; ie what % is by birds, golfers shoes, wind? From my experience i see a definite pattern of poa ingress from the edges of the greens, anyone else noted this?
I played in Mexico once and the superintendent Eddy Mena worked on the principle of 'dont leave any space', his greens were certainly pure.
I think you, I and most UK greenskeepers are pretty much agreed we cant keep it out in our climate and demand for winter play, so live with a poa mix.
I think in some climates poa can be eliminated, but those climates need to be able to grow creeping bent or bermudas  which with warmth will out perform poa. I suspect US supers will not keep fescues pure simply on the non aggressive basis of fescue.

[Marc Haring]

Adrian

As for the first part; I haven't a clue. Totally agree with all the rest. Ken Mangum from Atlanta Athletic Club told me and a group of others in February, "there are two kinds of greens. Those with poa and those that will have poa"!

[Larry_Keltto]

<<the superintendent Eddy Mena worked on the principle of 'dont leave any space'>>

Adrian, what does this mean?

For a turf layman like me, this is an excellent thread. Thanks to all.

[Adrian_Stiff]

<<the superintendent Eddy Mena worked on the principle of 'dont leave any space'>>

Adrian, what does this mean?

For a turf layman like me, this is an excellent thread. Thanks to all.

Poa being an aggressive grass can often grab that chance of filling a space made by a pitchmark scar, or perhaps where turf can be a bit thinner say, walk off areas or around the hole if the holes are not changed regularly enough. Eddys principle's were, regular hole changing, a high cut but he did not like to make a verti cut. I can't remember his hollow tining policy, but his greens were good, he had a secret formula that involved Daconil to check the poa, I never followed that experiment up.

[Jon Wiggett]

I think in some climates poa can be eliminated, but those climates need to be able to grow creeping bent or bermudas  which with warmth will out perform poa. I suspect US supers will not keep fescues pure simply on the non aggressive basis of fescue.

Adrian, I agree with what you say about poa and the british climate. I also agree with you about how unlikely it is for most US supers in a warmer climate to keep pure stand of fescue. This is due to pressure from the golfer in my opinion.

My experience of fescue in a warmer climate has been very positive. With 40°C+ for a good stretch of the summer I was able to maintain a pure stand wall to wall. It required minimum water, boxing of clippings every where and almost stopping the growth in the height of summer.
At the end of the winter there was some poa creeping in but this soon disappeared with the first week of hot weather.