News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Saguaro @ WeKoPa-another favorable review...
« on: December 16, 2006, 11:10:24 AM »
to a favorable review.From today's Arizona Republic:

Course designers kept We-Ko-Pa's natural beauty

Russ Christ
Special for The Republic
Dec. 16, 2006 12:00 AM

FOUNTAIN HILLS - If Saguaro, the new course at We-Ko-Pa Golf Club, were a woman, she would wear just a hint of eye shadow and have no lifts, nips or tucks.

She'd be almost 100 percent natural - and still beautiful beyond belief.

Almost five years to the day since We-Ko-Pa opened its first golf course - Cholla - the club, near Fountain Hills, unveiled its new Bill Coore- and Ben Crenshaw-designed Saguaro course today. GOLF Magazine already has named it one of the "Top 10 New Courses You Can Play."

Saguaro is proof that course architects don't need to move a lot of dirt to build a terrific layout in the desert. Coore, a 10-year Scottsdale resident, and Crenshaw, a two-time Masters champion, take pride in routing courses with an emphasis on "interest." They eschew dramatic water features, severe, unnatural mounding in fairways and around greens, and strategy that isn't subtle.

Having a great piece of land allowed their talents to shine even more at We-Ko-Pa.

"When we walked over that property, it just looked like golf," Coore said. "It was inviting and simple to walk. It was easy to see how golf can fit here without any massive alterations of the landscape. Golfers will see the property as the architects saw it."

Coore and Crenshaw have successfully employed a "minimalist" design philosophy to build highly acclaimed courses such as Talking Stick Golf Club (North and South courses) in Scottsdale, Sand Hills Golf Club in Nebraska, and Bandon Trails in Bandon, Ore.

"We followed the same guidelines we do with any gifted piece of property," Coore said. "The course is laid out as quietly as possible."

The par-71, 6,912-yard Saguaro is characterized by wide, mostly flat fairways, subtle greens, well-placed bunkers and expansive views of Four Peaks Wilderness Area.

The front nine, a par-36, is built on the northeastern portion of the property and has the longest and most difficult hole - the par-5, 631-yard No. 4. The back nine, a par-35, is configured on the southwestern portion and is much more exposed to wind and weather. It's characterized by changes in elevation and drama as it winds its way up and down saguaro-laden hills.

Notable holes include:


• No. 14. An uphill par-5 that stretches 538 yards and has a split fairway and elevated green.


• No. 15. A par-3 that features a 255-yard drop to a massive 54-foot-long by 36-foot-wide green.


• No. 16. A severely uphill 328-yard par-4 that doglegs to the right to a tiny, elevated green.


• No. 18. A difficult par-4 that stretches 508 yards and easily could play like a par-5 for average golfers.

Untouched by roads or real estate, the long views are as dramatic as they come. The holes travel in different directions, have varied landscapes, beautiful backdrops, and individual character. The majority of the greens, which open in front to allow for run-up shots, can easily accommodate six different hole locations.

Other likable attributes include greens positioned near the teeing grounds (which makes the course walkable), and no water hazards (water is not natural in the desert).

The strength of the course is arguably the last 12 holes, particularly seven through 11, a stretch marked by two short, but completely different par-4s, a slightly uphill par-3 and a reachable par-5:


• No. 7. A par-4, 314-yard hole that demands a semi-blind tee shot over the crest of a hill to a tiny, puzzle-piece green.


• No. 8. A par-5, 515-yarder that twists and turns through a valley and works its way through interesting terrain to a narrow green bunkered on both sides.


• No. 9. At 137 yards, it's the shortest par-3 on the course, but it requires plenty of thought and precision.


• No. 10. A downhill, slightly dogleg-right par-4 that stretches 337 yards. It's characterized by a massive fairway bunker on the right that challenges golfers to carry for a relatively easy approach if the U-shaped green weren't dissected by a small bunker.

Coore believes the four-hole stretch is representative of the course.

"The two par-4s are total opposite holes, not only in direction, but in the scale and latitude they give you to play them," Coore said. "The seventh has a bit a mystery, the 10th has a bit of adventure."

Until April 7, Arizona residents can play Saguaro for $110 or less ($85 until Jan. 18, $75 until Dec. 24.)

« Last Edit: December 21, 2006, 06:46:48 AM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Adam Clayman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2006, 12:25:39 PM »
Thanx, Steve.

I can just hear the typical AZ. golfer....

"No waterfalls? Yucky"

Is there a scoop out there that Joe Passov won't get?
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Brad Klein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2006, 03:02:26 PM »
It's readily walkable, something the management will encourage. Let's see if the clients/guests take them up on it. Wonderful course, with a lot more native contour than Talking Stick-North.

John Kirk

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2006, 03:52:58 PM »
"No. 15. A par-3 that features a 255-yard drop to a massive 54-foot-long by 36-foot-wide green."

The course may be walkable, but that 255 yard drop has got to be tricky.  Hitting a 54 foot by 36 foot green won't be that easy either.

Brad Klein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2006, 03:54:31 PM »
The hole is 255 yards from the back tee, falls maybe 30-35 feet from the back marker to the green center. By the way, 54 X 36 would not be massive; it would be tiny. But it's also wrong. Everything you quoted is wrong.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2006, 03:56:08 PM by Brad Klein »

John Kirk

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2006, 06:19:15 PM »
The hole is 255 yards from the back tee, falls maybe 30-35 feet from the back marker to the green center. By the way, 54 X 36 would not be massive; it would be tiny. But it's also wrong. Everything you quoted is wrong.

Brad, you are making bad assumptions about my intelligence.

Adam Clayman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2006, 10:11:33 PM »
Replace yard for foot and we are talking about a large green.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Brad Klein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2006, 10:52:04 PM »
John Kirk,

I'm actually not assuming anything about YOUR intelligence, just the accuracy of that dopey news article.

What's interesting to me is that Golf Magazine named We-Ko-Pa-Saguaro to their top-new post before anyone on the panel played the course. It was not a panel vote but a personal decision by an editor or two
« Last Edit: December 16, 2006, 10:54:53 PM by Brad Klein »

John Kirk

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2006, 12:31:48 AM »
Sorry for sounding a little snappy there.  I misread your intention.  I do like the way We-Ko-Pa looks in the pictures very much.

bakerg

Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa opens today...
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2006, 04:03:23 PM »
The walk on the par 3 15th didn't seem like it would be very bad at all.  The hole does play downhill but since it is a fairly long par 3 the walk down would be gradual.  

There was maybe three holes that I thought would not be fun walks, but for the most part this course would be an enjoyable walk.  I didn't walk it this time since I was going on very little sleep, but next time around I will definately be carrying my bag.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2006, 04:04:02 PM by Gary Baker »

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa-another favorable review...
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2006, 06:50:00 AM »
Saguaro is the first new public course to open in the Phoenix area in 3 years. Here's a pic of the 18th hole:




Here's another favorable review. This is from John Davis in today's Arizona Republic:

www.azcentral.com/sports/golf/articles/1220wekopagolf1221.html
« Last Edit: December 21, 2006, 06:50:42 AM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Aaron Katz

Re:Saguaro @ WeKoPa-another favorable review...
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2006, 10:35:44 AM »
I love the first review:  "The strength of the course is arguably the last 12 holes."  :)