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Geoffrey_Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Can't be many like this left...
« on: November 30, 2006, 12:59:15 PM »
Anyone have $110MM to spare?  Keep in mind you could probably build 20 courses there...

http://www.siroffices.com/brokerages/santabarbara/details.asp?propertynumber=0112449&quicksearchyn=y&splash=santabarbara

Definitely take the time to watch the online tour of the property.  I'm still wiping the drool off my keyboard.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2006, 01:03:04 PM by Geoffrey_Walsh »

Jimmy Muratt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2006, 01:17:12 PM »
That looks like an amazing piece of land.  It's very reminiscent of Pebble Beach.  Is it even possible though to build a golf course  or any other development on that land?  Would it ever be approved?

The price doesn't seem bad for the location, it works about to be $12,820.51/acre.  

Geoffrey_Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2006, 01:22:07 PM »
Jimmy,

As weird as it sounds, I thought the same thing about the price tag.  For that location it seems more than reasonable.  

Not sure on the zoning/environmental restrictions but there HAS to be a way to build a great course (or ten of them) on that property from what I can see.

JohnV

Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2006, 01:30:08 PM »
Here is the Google link to it:

Rancho El Cojo

The western point of the two is a Coast Guard Reserve.

Geoffrey_Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2006, 01:42:51 PM »
Interesting that the Coast Guard owns part of the peninsula... it would defintely make it more interesting from a routing perspective to include that piece but I have to think you could work around it.  The situation reminds me of the property Morse passed on buying at Pebble which caused them to route the 5th away from the shore.

ed_getka

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2006, 02:07:33 PM »
Geoffrey,
   Given that you are talking about California and I'm sure the Coastal Commission would get involved somewhere along the line, the land acquisition could be the cheap part of the project. It is nice to dream though.
"Perimeter-weighted fairways", The best euphemism for containment mounding I've ever heard.

Geoffrey_Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2006, 02:24:03 PM »
Ed,

In all seriousness, I don't understand why the State of California doesn't buy this and it turn it into a State Park.  Seems like a very unique opportunity and it is a relatively short drive from LA.

Lou_Duran

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2006, 03:23:49 PM »
$5 billion+ projected annual budget deficits might have something to do with CA not ponying up a measly $110MM.  And though it is much easier for a public body to develop, it would still have to deal with the well funded lobby of the no-growth/no-use special interest crowd.  Providing water and utilities to that site alone would be a very costly endeavor.  My recollection on the proposed course in the general area that was in planning for some 20 years before finally giving up was that the water rights would have cost over $3MM to acquire and then over $1MM per year (early 1990 dollars).  I am new to SoCal, but believe me, it is amazing how little the dollar is worth here.  Sometimes confused by the bilingual nature of the place, I mistankingly think that prices are being quoted in pesos.

Tim Copeland

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2006, 05:02:33 PM »
Trump rumored to have offered $500,000,000

Waterfalls and visible cart paths for days
I need a nickname so I can tell all that I know.....

David Stamm

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2006, 05:20:21 PM »
Calling Mike Keiser.......
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2006, 07:28:12 PM »
It isn't sandy (as far as I know) and the raw property costs 2-3 times as much as everything which has been developed at Bandon Dunes so far ... but I'll ask him.

$110 million could also be looked at as 1/9 of a BILLION dollars, which is a lot of money for golf.  It would have to be developed to make the numbers work, and I don't know if large-scale development would be allowed.  And for sure the Coastal Commission would be involved.

Geoffrey_Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2006, 08:12:09 PM »
Lets keep in mind that they are asking 110MM, but who knows how much play there is in that number.  It may also be possible to buy one of the parcels which would make the economics more feasible.

Thanks for passing this along to Mike, Tom.  I'd rather see a tribute to Mackenzie there than a row of townhouses.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2006, 08:12:24 PM by Geoffrey_Walsh »

Tom Jefferson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2006, 09:42:49 PM »
This is OT regarding golf on the Cojo/Bixby Ranch....but in an earlier life, I spent many hours there, and NEVER touched the land.  

In the late 60s, when I was a surfer and living in Goleta/Santa Barbara, we used to launch boats from the pier in Gaviota, just to the south of the fabled "RANCH", motor up the coast a 1/2 hour, and surf the epic, solitary, legendary, and pristine waves of Cojo Point (and other numerous surf breaks at the Ranch).  

We stayed in the water, paddling from and back to the boats anchored off the breaks, while the Ranch guards watched from their trucks on the beach or bluffs.  They were notorious for beating on surfers whenever one ventured on land (as the Ranch was private and highly protected from trespassers), so whenever we lost our boards and had to swim in (this was before leashes) to retrieve them...well...it got interesting!!

Ask any surfer (the older the better) from Ca. about the mysterious and coveted Ranch waves.....those spots were the nirvana of central ca waves. As a golf comparison, think remote and mysterious Sand Hills, or Dornoch, or Enniscrone.

One of the slides shows Cojo Point waves lined up and ripping..just beautiful.

Hard to imagine what type of development might pass at the Bixby Ranch.....and my environmentalist soul says that the best and wisest use might well be to leave it green and untouched.

Just finished off a very rainy November here in Bandon, with "epic, legendary, solitary and pristine golf."...very wet and yes, still F&F.

Tom

ps.......My job during that brief time in Santa Barbara was caddying at the Valley Club and nearby Burnam Wood, gardening on the side.  That, and surfing.
...a simple and easy lifestyle, one long since past!

the pres

Geoffrey_Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2006, 09:51:47 PM »
Tom,

I've never surfed, but even I could picture the beauty of the waves there just reading your post.  Sounds like that simple and easy lifestyle was also a memorable one.

Coincidentally, when I showed the picture of the property to the guys at my office the first thing one of them said was "That's a point break there!".  Of course, my reaction to the same landform was "What a great green site!".  Reminds me of those picture tests where the observer sees the picture he/she wants to see.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2006, 09:55:06 PM by Geoffrey_Walsh »

Tim Copeland

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2006, 10:04:26 PM »
This is all good and everything

But I cant get past that teaser subject line
I need a nickname so I can tell all that I know.....

Tom Jefferson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2006, 10:37:21 PM »
Geoffrey;

Interesting that you saw the land and the green site...I never once looked at anything other than the waves!!  And this from a lifelong and true golf and golf course freak....that is testimony enough regarding my memory of the fabled ranch waves, and how completely those slides took me back to those times.

Regards,
Tom
the pres

Patrick_Mucci

Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #16 on: November 30, 2006, 10:49:57 PM »
Anyone have $110MM to spare?  Keep in mind you could probably build 20 courses there...

http://www.siroffices.com/brokerages/santabarbara/details.asp?propertynumber=0112449&quicksearchyn=y&splash=santabarbara

Definitely take the time to watch the online tour of the property.  I'm still wiping the drool off my keyboard.

Geoffrey,

$ 12,821 an acre is cheap for ocean front property in California.

The critical question is, what's it zoned for ?
And, what's the oposition with respect to development ?
Would anyone ever get a permit ? At what cost ? Over what period of time ?

Mike Pascucci paid about $ 43,000,000 for less that 1/10 of the acreage

With 8,580 acres on the Pacific Coast in California,
$ 110,000,000 seems like a bargain.

Tom Jefferson,

How does an old East Coaster like me know about surfing at Rincon and Volleyball on the beach at Santa Barbara just north of Montecito ?

Must be the girls in Carpenteria I spent time with. ;D

Tom Doak,

If one developed 3-5,000 acres worth of homesites,
$ 110,000,000 would seem cheap.

There have to be complicating factors for the land to be so cheap.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2006, 10:55:44 PM by Patrick_Mucci »

Joe Perches

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #17 on: November 30, 2006, 11:34:56 PM »
There are many complicating factors.
http://www.phototours.com/ptwebsites/cojo/impactsummary.pdf
http://www.phototours.com/ptwebsites/cojo/description.html

In 2005, California paid slightly more per coastline mile for the Hearst Ranch.
http://www.governor.ca.gov/state/govsite/gov_htmlprint.jsp?sFilePath=%2fgovsite%2fspotlight%2f021805_update.htm&sTitle=null&sCatTitle=null&sSubCat=null&iOID=null

Because of Hearst Castle, more Californians were aware of the beauty of the Hearst land.  Because of the extreme privacy of the ownership, and the lack of public access roads through the property, very few people have seen this Point Conception land.

Also, because of its proximity to Vandenberg Air Force base, this Bixby Ranch/Point Conception land is subject to forced evacuation several times per year for rocket launches.

It's decidedly beautiful land.  I think best use would be state parklands, similar use to the Golden Gate Marin Headlands.   I would prefer that no golf course be built there at all.  If one or more are built though, it could be spectacular.

Jim Nugent

Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #18 on: November 30, 2006, 11:43:26 PM »
Calling Mike Keiser.......

Shoot, just call Hammy.  Let's keep this thing in the family...

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #19 on: November 30, 2006, 11:46:15 PM »
The price is falling fast.  Wait and it will be free to a good rancher in no time.  

http://www.luxurylaunches.com/other_stuff/california_ranch_asking_155_million.php
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Jon Spaulding

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2006, 12:51:48 AM »
Echoing what TJ says, the best analogy I can make is that the Ranch is to surfers what Cypress + SF Club + Valley Club (the sum of) is to golfers......don't touch it, heck, don't even point at it...just leave it alone!
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Mike Benham

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2006, 01:04:19 AM »
Here is one of my favorite links for coastal pictures, the Califorina Coastal Records project.  Click up and down the proofsheet to see the coastline:

Cojo Coastline Photos
"... and I liked the guy ..."

Jon Spaulding

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2006, 01:11:12 AM »
Hi Mike, check out the photos of Shelter Cove GL....perhaps the coolest course in CA that no one's ever seen or heard of! I played there in 1995 and hope to get back on my way to Bandon soon.

I was trying to explain SCGL to Dave Stamm a couple weeks ago, and found the website. The photos of Cypress/Pebble area are unbelieveable....and free.
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Kevin_Reilly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #23 on: December 01, 2006, 01:45:32 AM »
The ranch seems about the same size as the Alisal Guest Ranch in Solvang, not too far away.

Tom Jefferson, here is a stocking stuffer must-have for you (Pat Mucci-the-surfer too):

Inside Mavericks Book (just published)
"GOLF COURSES SHOULD BE ENJOYED RATHER THAN RATED" - Tom Watson

Don_Mahaffey

Re:Can't be many like this left...
« Reply #24 on: December 01, 2006, 07:54:13 AM »
Among my generation of So Cal surfers The Ranch held legendary status. Although I never lived in Santa Barbara, a number of my buddies attended UCSB and I made the journey to the ranch with them a few times. There's got to be some wealthy person out there who would the love the solitude and beauty of that remarkable piece of God's earth. I've already forwarded the ad on to one person who I know loves the type of privacy that land would offer. ;)