A Classic Links is Being Brought Back to its Former Glory

[Sean_A]

That is a tag line in the October issue of Golf Course Architecture.  I think this work has been going on for a few years now.  I was wondering how the work at Deal was coming along (assuming it isn't already completed).  I know we have a few members on the board.  What are your thoughts?  According to the article the changes include:

Lengthening the course ~100 yards which will get the yardage closer to the whopping 7300 yards of 1949.  They will do this by adding new tees.

#3 will be 10 yards longer, but more importantly the angle will change because the tee is being moved to the left of the 2nd green.  

#s 7 & 9 will have tees placed on the seawall, adding 30ish  yards each.  

#13 will have a new raised tee some 30 or so yards further back.  This brings the two large bunkers on the right back into play for the flat bellies.  

Some greens are to be enlarged to originalish size to bring some greenside bunkers tighter to the greens.  I think #9 is one hole and there are others, but the article didn't mention them.  

Some bunker work including a new fairway bunker on #9.  

There is a load more bunker work I think, but the article doesn't mention it.  

Encouraging fescues to grow in place of weed grasses.  

The work all sounds excellent and I get the impression that the casual visitor will hardly notice any changes.  Is this true?

Ciao

 

[Adrian_Stiff]

Sean, I think Deal has a possibility of getting back on the Open rota, I think getting these 'lengthening' works could help its case. I do not know Deal well, but from a casual glance it does not quite have the inside room to me, so would fail on that, but I have heard from one source that it is not out of the question. I dont suppose the normal members course will see any dramaric change.

[michael j fay]

Cinaue Ports is a wonderful venue but I remember that they were talking about subterranian problems. Something to do with underground coal mines filling with water and flooding the course, but don't quote me.

If I am not mistaken the reaon that Deal was taken from the rota was the flooding problem.

Although not as dramatic as its neighbor, Royal St. Georges, Deal would be a wonderful venue for an Amateur or a Walker Cup.

The Deal coast does not get the press of the courses in Lancashire or in Scotland but it has numerous great courses to offer. Access is somewhat more difficult but it is worth the effort.

[Noel Freeman]

Sean- you start a thread on Deal and don't even ask Tuco? You should know better

There are 3, not 2 Deal members on the board with Mark Chaplin being the local.  Myself and Larry Keltto are overseas members.

Michael Fay- I've always wondered if you had an inaccuracy on your UK book b/c you describe a match with our old club secretary Colin Hammond but describe him as a pro who plays with hickories and that is Andrew Reynolds.

I digress... As per Deal and aspirations of another Open.  All I can say is the "hearsay" I've heard is that Peter Dawson is very impressed with the course and to my burning ears the club is going to get some big venue in the next 5-7 years IMHO.. Whether it is an Open?? Well, I think we are deserving of one especially if Hoylake can hold it.  No doubt the course is deserving of it, even at its current length Kent locals will tell you Deal is 2 shots more difficult than Sandwich.  With the added length the R&A will certainly like that but many detractors will say Deal doesnt have the room for an Open.  I disagree.  The Seawall is perfect for viewing the outward nine and the inward 9 can have viewing on the road (the club owns) on the beat back home.  Also the course has a ton of acreage beyond the 11th and 12th holes at the far side of the course to put all of the assorted "tented" villages that act as a plague to make money on the modern game.  The club also has access to lease adjacent farm land etc.  Deal is one of the few UK clubs with an adequate range as well.  It isnt US quality but better than 90% of UK clubs.

So an Open?  Maybe, my guess is a Walker Cup but I hope I am wrong.

As to the course changes that Martin Ebert (or Donald Steel) , I'm not wild about all of them but there is a lot of room still to move tees back (1st hole could go back another 50-60 yards!).

#2 will grow from 401 eventually to 436 yards with a tee abutting the fence at the end of the property.  A new bunker would then be placed on the left side of the fairway 30 yards north of the current one.  The greenside bunker will also be moved right

#3 will see a dogleg tee shot now as Sean alludes to and bunkers replaced accordingly on the right (2 of them).  The bunker on the left side of the fairway will be removed. There was some early talk of a seawall tee instead on #3 a few years ago but that died a death.  New tee adds only 10 or 20 yards and a bunch of the other tees will be removed.

I'm not sure if the 5th hole will eventually see a new back tee which would also be moved closer to the adjacent 17th hole.  The thought would be to bring back into play the hollow that used to be carried on that hole until the tee was moved. Not sure if this is going to be taken into account.. Obviously would add more length.. In any event the current 5th tee is abysmal in shape (it is a behemoth) and needs to be changed.

7th hole-- The new seawall tee adds 30 yards and will make this hole a lot more visual.  The drive here is all about finding the fairway through 5 flanking bunkers.. There will be another bunker added on the left.

8th hole--all 9 bunkers revetted

9th hole- again like 7 a new seawall tee adding 25 yards.  The bunker on the leftside of the fairway will be reshaped, it is awkward, in Deal's past this was a center hazard and now it still tempts one to go left (no advantage).. This hole really requires a draw and when the southwesterly is blowing is a very tough hole.

10th hole-- tee to be raised higher.. Additional bunker placed on right side of fairway (that make 2) and shaping to make them visual from tee-- current bunker is blind.   Still one of the great short par 4s in Open golf.

12th-- this is not on the plan but if the club really wants to do something sexy as has been talked about, the original 12th tee which is over the road to Sandwich would be replaced (the club owns the road).. This would make 12 a par 5 again and allow the club to make 16 a par 4.. I'd love to see it.  Right now there is reshaping of the left fairway bunker to snag more balls.. This green is the famous U shaped one.

13th- What a tough hole made tougher. I don't agree with it but a new back tee adding 30-40 yards to make the cross bunkers come into play.. Obviously they forget that the cross bunkers are in play with a strong southwesterly sometimes on your 2nd shot!  Also one of the best greens in British links golf.. Ask Ran!

15th hole- reshaping of greenside left bunker.. I've been in this bastard too many time as the bailout is left on this hole..

16th- Steel/Ebert like this as a short par 5 at 507 yards.. I prefer it as a 460-470 par 4..  The best links hole in golf according to Sir Peter Allen.. I've eagled it and agree!  They are going to add a short left fairway bunker and remove the short left greenside bunker.

17th hole (Vardon's Parlour) has seen the fairway bunkers reshaped.. They are now longer so your ball can reach them but I don't like the shaping work--the membership does though..

You cannot talk about Deal without mentioning the agronomic advances in turf and playing conditions that Greenskeeper Gordon Irvine has brought. Gordon will be leaving Deal but he's trained his replacements and I believe will continue to consult.

Ah Deal, just thinking of it makes me miss it.. Sad to say, our Club Secretary will be leaving for Brancaster shortly and right now my friend David Dobby's club history has been tabled     Deal really needs a club history as all Open venues do.

[henrye]

16th- Steel/Ebert like this as a short par 5 at 507 yards.. I prefer it as a 460-470 par 4..  The best links hole in golf according to Sir Peter Allen.. I've eagled it and agree!  They are going to add a short left fairway bunker and remove the short left greenside bunker.

An Eagle 3 on 16?  That must be a great memory, but I think a change to a par 4 would make it too hard.  To leave a ball on that green from 200 yards out has to be a rare occurrence.

[Noel Freeman]

I have 5 eagles in my career.. 3 at Deal with Russell Talley and Jeff Silverman as witnesses..  No wonder why I joined..

I think if you make #12 a 520 yard par 5 and then make #16 a par 4 it is fair.. It really makes that 2nd shot something you have to consider if you psychologically want to make par..  For the pros it doesnt matter, they will reach in 2 unless the wind is blowing 35mph..

[Mark Chaplin]

Noel - Only last week I missed a 2ft eagle putt on 16, to make matters worse it was in foursomes, so my partner hit the great shot and I screwed up the putting!

The work at Deal is progressing at a steady rate and most of it is being conducted by the greenkeeping team not contractors. This is great as they are learning from Gordon Irvine and skills are being passed on.

I've not heard any realistic talk of an Open returning to Deal. I think the club would like to host another Amateur or the Walker Cup, with 2011 going to Royal Aberdeen the next opportunity is 2015. My view is the 2009 British Ladies Open would be a fitting event for Deal, it is the centenary year of The Open, we are a progressive club who have welcomed ladies for years and our member Karen Stupples won at Sunningdale in such fine style. Any LGU or Weetabix people out there??

Michael - The flooding problem was caused by the sea, the sea wall was hopefully solved that problem. It is interesting you say access is a problem to the Kent coast. The railway station is a $5 cab ride from the course, you can leave your central London hotel and within 2 hours by train be playing on one of 3 adjacent former Open venues in Deal, Princes and RSt.G. I have suggested this as a marketing tool aimed at business travellers to London.

Onto the improvements;

#2 - At 430yds it will be a real challenge to stop a shot on the prevailing wind to a green sloping away from you.

#3 - The new tee will create an interesting line and take the dog walkers and horse riders who walk at the base of the sea wall out of play.

#8 - The revetting work is taking place at the moment on this hole, Gordon is again producing superb work. I'll try and get some photos of his bunker work to post on GCA.

#9 - IMO the tee on the wall could make it a little similar to #11.

#10 - The tee has been built up and is due to be turfed soon.

#12 - Sorry Noel I'm in favour of this hole staying a tough, tough long par 4. As a 5 the second shot landing area would need some work and I believe the hole works better with a medium to long iron feeding into the U shaped green.

#16 - Rated by many as a fine short par 5, again I dessent and say it's a better 5 than 4 for the average player. With a wild green the skill is placing the 2nd shot to give the player their favoured length pitch, or dicing with the hollows and humps around the putting surface when going for it in 2. Playing against the prevailing wind #16 usually plays 525-540yds. I'll compromise with Noel and switch the back tee to 450yds and the "forward" tee to 510yds.

#18 - At 450yds off the new back tee the second shot is to the under rated green complex set 3 feet above the fairway and angled to the fairway. Hints of Foxy at RD?

Any GCA'er who wants to come and see what's going on at Deal pencil in a trip and PM me, I for one am proud of being a member of a decent club and welcome the opportunity to play with fellow golf affectionados.