News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Ran Morrissett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« on: November 07, 2006, 09:26:05 AM »
...under Architecture Timeline and Courses by Country.

2006 was the year of Hoylake.

Not that it had gone anywhere, but its monumentally successful staging of the Open Championship showed a whole new generation of golfers that the supreme place Hoylake has held in world golf for over a century still holds true.

The dry English summer left the Club and the R&A with fast and firm conditions but little rough. Coupled with a dearth of wind, there was concern that the professionals might dissect the course. Fear not. Unlike the U.S. major courses with their slavishly boring set-ups featuring thick rough and absurdly narrow fairways, the golfers were allowed to play golf at Hoylake, as it was the bunkers (rather than the rough) that dictated the play off the tees.  Some players opted for the approach that Ballesteros took at Lytham in 1979 by focusing solely on avoiding the bunkers, regardless of where that took them with their driver, while others favored a more controlled strategy. Viewers were rewarded with numerous full shots that will be recalled for years, as well as one of the game’s all-time demonstrations in controlled course management.  It was Tiger Woods’s supreme confidence in his iron play that allowed him to play irons off so many tees.  For lesser players, such a plan would have failed miserably, as so much pressure was placed on the middle and long irons into the demanding greens.  

On what other courses could we see a difference of 70 yards in the approach shots of the two players in the final pairing in the final round of a major championship when each hit had hit his tee shot exactly as he wanted?  This was the case on the 2nd hole (members’ 18th) with Woods and Garcia at Hoylake. Tellingly, Garcia, who had played driver from the tee, was not able to get closer to the demanding hole location with a wedge than Woods who, after an iron from the tee, had a middle iron into the green.

In this process, the intrinsic merit of Hoylake’s holes shone through. Ted Sturges was staying with me that weekend in Southern Pines and by mid-telecast on Saturday, he asked, “Is this the best non-Old Course course on the Open Championship rota?” Ted is from Indiana so his English is what it is  ;D but the point is an interesting one.

Like Royal County Down, no one person deserves credit for the course of today. The more courses that are built today by architects with 100 or 200 or 300 courses on their resume, the more one appreciates Hoylake for its uniqueness. Its combination of field and dunes holes, internal and external out of bounds and its huge expanse that the wind sweeps across make the course like no other.

Member Alistair Beggs was a huge help on this course profile (all aerials photographs are courtesy of him) and he suggested that I stick with the normal sequencing of the holes and not the Open one. This was welcome news as holes like the 1st and 6th and 8th and 9th etc. have been famous for so long that to refer to a hole like the Punchbowl as the 11th would have been a mess.

In the past two weeks, we have posted course profiles from County Down and Cape Breton Highland Links. Throw in Hoylake and one can’t imagine three courses more disparate, yet each among the very best and each reminding the golfer of absolutely no other course. Of course, after a round at Hoylake, the members and their guests repair to the one of the game’s great clubhouse, with items hanging on every wall that account for someone or something of great doing that has occurred here. One is free to absorb the magnitude of favorite son amateur John Ball’s playing record (eight  :o Amateur Championships and one Open Championship) or reading one of (the late) John Behrend’s seminal research books (GCA.com’s Hoylake profile doesn’t even mention Ball once – what would Behrend think about that :-\). Many a traditionalist will tell you there is no other place he would rather find himself. Indeed, the evening of October 3rd was an unmatched highlight in my golfing life, enjoying the camaraderie of 30 plus members from Hoylake and GolfClubAtlas.com and listening to every word spoke by the legendary figure of Anthony Shone.

Cheers,


« Last Edit: November 07, 2006, 01:25:44 PM by Ben_Dewar »

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2006, 10:52:04 AM »
Another masterpiece.  

BCrosby

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2006, 11:17:16 AM »
Agreed. Well done.


Bob  
« Last Edit: November 07, 2006, 05:12:51 PM by BCrosby »

Andy Scanlon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2006, 11:32:28 AM »
Outstanding profile!
All architects will be a lot more comfortable when the powers that be in golf finally solve the ball problem. If the distance to be gotten with the ball continues to increase, it will be necessary to go to 7,500 and even 8000 yard courses.  
- William Flynn, golf architect, 1927

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2006, 01:15:33 PM »
Excellent Ran and well done for giving a balanced view of Steel's greens.  Yes as a group they are different, but do they really stick out like the proverbial sore thumb as some were claiming?  Overall they added a little to the surprising ammount of variety that I found the course to posess.

Happy days.
Let's make GCA grate again!

Brian Phillips

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2006, 01:41:23 PM »
Ran,

I think this is your best profile to date especially the photos.  I also like the final quote about roses!!

Brian
Bunkers, if they be good bunkers, and bunkers of strong character, refuse to be disregarded, and insist on asserting themselves; they do not mind being avoided, but they decline to be ignored - John Low Concerning Golf

Craig Disher

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2006, 01:52:06 PM »
Ran,
Thank you for another thoroughly enjoyable profile - Alistair's pictures capture the course beautifully.

Since I'm the golfer who is "woefully out of position" on 2, it might be informative to point out that I did manage a 4. My problem was that I was woefully out of position on my drive which was well to the right. A pitch or short bunker shot from the right seemed preferable to a long bunker shot from the left. Given my limited skills, planning for failure is always a good tactic. ;D
« Last Edit: November 07, 2006, 03:28:03 PM by Craig Disher »

Philip Gawith

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2006, 03:14:42 PM »
Many thanks Ran - I think you will be a freeman of Hoylake on the back of this! It will sure put Ron Whitten back in his box. Having read your analysis, it feels even better to be a member. :) I hope the club gives it some prominence as I have no doubt it will help many of the members learn a lot more about their home course!

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2006, 03:29:16 PM »
Ran, you are so correct.  The golf was great, the Hoylake banquet was even better.  That was a wonderful evening.  

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2006, 05:06:21 PM »
Craig Disher is truly a fine gentleman and forgives the fact that it was my second shot on #2 that put him "woefully out of position" in our foursomes match.  As I recall, Craig pitched to ten feet and I holed for our par.  I wish the match from #11-#14 had gone so well!

Outstanding profile, Ran, probably the best at truly capturing the feeling of the course of any I've seen, and many are really good.  Hoylake is like a time capsule, from the cops and flat field holes to the beauties in the dunes.  I too loved the little quirky details like the little ridge of rough across the 7th fairway and the hedge in front of the tee at the 8th.  I will never be able to keep the holes straight as I have never played or seen the original routing.  Will the club return to the original?

I thought the Steel greens were pretty different from each other.  Old #3/current #5 is most similar to the other greens, old #17/current #1 the most different and yes, a bit out of place, same with old #18/current #2.  


ward peyronnin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2006, 05:57:55 PM »
Truly the experience at Hoylake exceeded my already substantial expectations in many ways.

But it wasn't until I read (most) of the 300+ page club history on the way back that it really struck me that we had walked  what must be the second most hallowed ground in golf. For the history and the past as well as current character is ,like the golf course , a package of many wonderful elements that are very worthy of assimilation. I would recommend this for any golf library and I am still trying to find out how to obtain the dvd of this past Open that I forgot to buy in the pro shop; would love the opportunity to analyze that tournament over time.

The GCA review stands up well to these other resources and I appreciate the ability to point people who want to know about Royal Liverpool in Ran's direction cause i alone can't fully do the place justice.

"Golf is happiness. It's intoxication w/o the hangover; stimulation w/o the pills. It's price is high yet its rewards are richer. Some say its a boys pastime but it builds men. It cleanses the mind/rejuvenates the body. It is these things and many more for those of us who truly love it." M.Norman

Alistair Beggs

Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2006, 06:55:50 AM »
Ran

My contribution to this was meagre so I think I can justifiably congratulate you on this effort.  It truly encapsulates the flavour of the place.

To read the positive comments of contributors who accompanied you and those who saw The Championship on TV is very pleasing.

I will do my best to ensure the membership are made aware of your work and I look forward to reading and perhaps responding to queries contributors may have about the links.

Alistair


Philip Gawith

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2006, 08:22:24 AM »
I think the club should publish a link to Ran's profile on its website. And if I was the Sports Editor of the Liverpool Daily Echo (Record?), I would also be very interested to know that one of the great treasures of the region has received such glowing acclaim.....

Andrew Mitchell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Royal Liverpool Golf Club course profile is posted...
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2006, 01:07:10 PM »
Excellent profile Ran.  Is it me or do these seem to get better and better?

The Buda Cup was a fantastic event on a fantastic course.
2014 to date: not actually played anywhere yet!
Still to come: Hollins Hall; Ripon City; Shipley; Perranporth; St Enodoc