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Will E

  • Karma: +0/-0
Skokie comments
« on: September 23, 2002, 06:10:02 PM »
I just played Skokie for the first time. Posting comments before "digesting" a course is not my style, I hope I get a chance to see it a few more times to see if my thoughts change.

1. An incredible adventure- note how you only play two holes in row with the same par on 14 and 15. It may not sound like much, but trust me it is. Par 4 after par 4 can really give me a headache. Switching things up made the course seem easier than it really is.

2. I never saw the course before the redo. From what I can see I'd make this required viewing for all courses considering restoration.

3. Chicago gets a bad rap. I'll put this course up against ANYTHING in Westchester Co., it 's that good.

Remember, I've only seen Skokie once and it was early, the course was wet, but the greens were very fast. I could be way off, suffering from the Huck's Cherry virus. I'm wondering if the course is too tough for the membership. Anyone making par from the back tees on all of the par 3s should get a trophy.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2002, 08:08:52 PM »
Will, is there a particular design feature theme running through the entire course?  Could you describe some of the better holes and what challenges or options they presented to you?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Paul Richards

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2002, 04:03:59 AM »
Shooter:

I am in complete agreement.  The renovation of Skokie has been an incredible success.  

I played the course a few times prior to the renovation, and it was a real mish-mash of designs and concepts.

Ron Prichard has now installed a cohesive theme that plays to the strengths of Donald Ross' intents.

I agree that Skokie has joined the "upper echelon" of courses and will be getting its due.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

Tom MacWood (Guest)

Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2002, 04:12:02 AM »
Paul
Donald Ross? From what I understand Prichard was going for Langford and in my opinion succeeded.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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A_Clay_Man

Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2002, 06:01:17 AM »
Dick- While I too have only played it once, I can say that I did get both the Langford and Ross feel. Langford's mimi Lawsonia cross carries with Ross's grass walls and prominent greens.

As Tom Doak has mentioned, Chicago golf has a similar feel to it. I assume it's the flatness of the terrain but it's also the trees. Skokie is a wonderful place where one can actually feel the old and none of the modern crap that has influenced so many of the tasteless, classless people who apparently get to be greens chairmen. Just not at Skokie  ;D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Matt_Ward

Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2002, 08:47:31 AM »
Shooter:

Agree completely with your take on Skokie. Played the course as part of a 36-hole day with Shoreacreas in the morning and Skokie in the afternoon. Have to say I'm still scratching my head as to why Shorecreas is listed as highly as it is when Skokie is nowhere to be found. :o

Superb course that gives you plenty of looks and is fully capable in testing all types of players. You must know how to "work" the ball because simply relying on sheer power won't cut it. The better player must hit the ball strategically on a number of holes and the layout is still comfortable for the high handicapper.

Why this course isn't listed among the major golf pubs is truly a mystery given the fact a number of others (i.e. Shoreacreas) is rated sooooo mugh higher?

What is also amazing is that Skokie has such a unique routing on such a compact piece of property. First rate stuff indeed!

Kudos to the leadership at the club and to Ron Prichard.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Will E

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #6 on: September 24, 2002, 08:05:22 PM »
Tom,
I doubt that I have the background on Langford that you do. I've only seen a few of his courses in WI. My experience with Ross is more in depth and from what I saw at Skokie this course screams Ross and whispers Langford. I don't see the Raynor style bunkers, sharp edges and wacky greens that I so love at Lawsonia and West Bend.  This is not a knock on Pritchard's fine work, only a comment that it appears to my eye to be more Ross. Maybe that will change as I see it more.

Dave,
I hit a pretty good drive on 8 and then hit what I thought was a really good 5 iron that I though I'd find a few feet from the pin. When I got up to the hole I had actually walked past my ball that had hit 15 ft. short of the pin and rolled back down the hill. It was neat to see the evidence left by the dew stripe. I thought the par 5s were stellar. The second shots in to 3, 11 and 13 are real fun. 18 is really a par 4.
I'm ready to go back, let me know when.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Paul Richards

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2002, 04:19:49 AM »
Tom:

My understanding is that we are both partially correct.  

If I remember a conversation with Ron that I had, it's a Donald Ross renovation with some of the Langford flair.

 :)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

Buck Wolter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2002, 11:40:04 AM »
Not really a Skokie comment but thought the Chicago golfers could give some insight.

I was at a wedding reception at the Glen View Club recently and was intrigued by what I could see of the course. Spent some time wandering the clubhouse and it has quite a history including hosting a US Open. Flynn redesigned the course about 1920 but I didn't see anything about further renovations. A golfer at the reception didn't seem too enthused about the course, 'decent little course' was his quote. Any thoughts as to where Glen View fits in the Chicago Hierarchy?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:09 PM by -1 »
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Those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience -- CS Lewis

MBL

Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2002, 01:39:20 PM »
Regarding Skokie's pedigree:

Tom Bendelow, 1905. Remodeled by Donald Ross, 1915,
by William Langford, 1938 and by Rees Jones, 1984. Restored by Ron Prichard, 2000.

Btw, it was ranked #97 in the Golf Digest '93-'94 rating.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Paul Richards

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2002, 04:15:50 AM »
MB:

Thanks for the pedigree.  

Skokie's ranking in the top 100 in '93-94 was too high.  Skokie
was a decent track, but nowhere near making the top 100.

However, after Prichard, Skokie easily deserves a shot at that ranking.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

Patrick Hitt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #11 on: September 27, 2002, 12:38:45 AM »
Shooter,
I am glad that you enjoyed your round. Skokie is a place that offers different angles on most of its holes, making it a place that one never tires of playing. The Chicago weather often makes it a very different course from day to day.

The challenge of the restoration was to create a unified feel while keeping the scale of the individual architects intact. The Ross course, which significantly changed the Bendelow routing, was very short by the 1930s. When the CCC built the nearby Skokie Lagoons to controll flooding in the area, the club bought the property that now contains the 4th, 11th, 3rd, 12th, and 13th, and hired Langford (who lived in neighboring Winnetka ) to make changes to the course. The holes are almost evenly split between the Ross routing and the Langford / Moreau additions. The bunkering on the Langford / Moreau holes is a bit larger in scale - the bottleneck 4th or the lone bunker on 12 are two good examples. The 7th is unique because it combines a small crowned Ross green with a L / M reroute. Here Pritchard restored the fairway bunkers off the tee in the scale of the other L / M bunkers around the course while leaving the approach  and greeside bunkers in their previous state - low profile Ross. Not to say that every Ross bunker was low profile - some of the Ross fill pads are quite tall due to the poor native soil and drainage - and the greenside bunkers are 4-6 feet below the green - ala the 1st.
I guess my point is that Pritchard attempted to restore a Ross - Langford / Moreau course. I believe he did a nice job in keeping the flavor of both architects where appropriate.

Oh yeah - Everything in Westchester Shooter ? Sounds like you are a little smitten.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:09 PM by -1 »
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angie

Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #12 on: September 27, 2002, 06:11:41 PM »
Quote
Will, is there a particular design feature theme running through the entire course?  Could you describe some of the better holes and what challenges or options they presented to you?

Just want to make sure everyone knows that Skokie can be found in the "Courses by Country" part of this website -- some beautiful pix & lots of information.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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David Wigler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2002, 05:09:31 AM »
Shooter,

"Everything in Westchester county"?  Is there good golf in New York?  The real question is if it is better than everything in Washtenaw County?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04

Paul Richards

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Skokie comments
« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2002, 04:48:40 PM »
David:

Where's "Washtenaw County?"

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG
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