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A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #50 on: September 27, 2006, 09:52:20 PM »
Common Jason,
  Top 5 in the south? I don't like to talk much of Long Cove, but Cusco can't hold a candle to LCC, and were not even a Top 5 in the south. Top 5 in the south would have to include some of the following: The Ocean Course, Augusta, Pinehurst #2, Seminole, TPC, Wade Hampton, Long Cove, Peachtree...I'd even take East Lake, Hawks Ridge...Cusco is in a lower class.
  As for a dozen closer that I'd rather play:
Capital City-Crabapple
East Lake
Hawk's Ridge
Atlanta Athletic Club (both)
TPC of Sugerloaf
Peachtree
Ansley GC
Atlanta CC
GC of Georgia (though not my first choice)
Great Waters @ Reynolds
........ok, Cuscowilla.....

Jason,
  Keep in mind that I'm a bog fan of fair golf where things are in front of the golfer.

Tony Nysse
Sr. Asst. Supt.
Long Cove Club
HHI, SC

 

Tony,
I read you list of a dozen close by, and I weep.  The pain, the pain...
Peachtree, Great Waters, East Lake, Ansley/Settindown are all right there with Cuscowilla as elite golf courses in any listing, though I only know Peachtree by reputation and word of mouth.  But I have NEVER heard anyone suggest that Atlanta CC, Golf Club of Ga., or Sugarloaf are of that level of distinction, and Capital City isn't close!  As to Hawk's Ridge, I still can't decide.

Please go back to Cuscowilla on a beautiful fall day and play again.  I beg you.
 :(
"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

Jason Blasberg

Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #51 on: September 27, 2006, 10:16:48 PM »
Jason,
  I'll put it simply for you-I LIKE TO SEE ALL THE OPTIONS IN FRONT OF ME. I like the fault to be on me if the golf shot isn't what I planned it to be, not some well struck shot that gets rejected because of a burried elephant, rolls down an hill in into the woods...I like to see what I'm hitting at...make sense?

Tony:

While I don't like to speak in metaphors I think abstraction may assist developing your gca thought process.

Golf is not a game that you can control and, the golfing experience, including score, is a direct result of man's interaction with nature, not man's dominion there of.  

Like life, there are good intentions that go awry and missteps nevertheless rewarded.  You should learn about a great golf course every time you play her, and, like life, you should become wiser for the wear.  

If a course's merit is all there "in front of you" it's misguided in its simplicity.  It's simple because it wants the sophistication that requires intimate knowledge of a course to see all its faces.  And its misguided b/c as a simplistic design it takes from you what could have otherwise been a rewarding interactive experience between the will of man and the vagaries of nature.

Under your idea of gca merit you zero out nature and wander aimlessly through fairways of mediocrity filled with the illusion of control and constantly frustrated with the results of your game since all misfortunes were yours to prevent, initially.

From the sounds of it, Tony, you didn't score well at Cusco. b/c it was tough conditions and you didn't know the nooks and crannies there and you walked away frustrated at your inability to control your environment.  That is exactly what she's supposed to do and the only breakdown in the process was that you didn't realize it . . .

Jason

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #52 on: September 27, 2006, 10:44:15 PM »
East Lake?  The mystique is fantastic, the zoyzia isn't, and I'll play 10 rounds at Cuscowilla for three at East Lake.

But I'll have to admit the East Lake caddies were more qualified, and definitely better dressed, than the Cuscowilla caddies.

Anthony_Nysse

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #53 on: September 28, 2006, 05:41:48 AM »
Jason,
  If you'd like to know, I shot a 74 at Cuscowilla on a 45 degree day with a good wind-In fact, if you must know, I birdied 4, 5 and 6 on the front and 12 and 17 on the back. I don't let my golf game get in the way of seeing a courses. Keep in mind Jason..it's opinion and once again, I've never stated that Cusco is poor, it's just not in the league that most would like it to be, especially a proud member like yourself. You showed me your "ACE card" when you told me you were a member.....BIAS even more.
 "You should learn about a great golf course every time you play her, and, like life, you should become wiser for the wear."
 I would have loved to learn, but CUSCO isn't great, simply put. For your sake, I'm sorry that I didn't like Cusco cause it appears I ruined your day.  :-[
  And Bill,
    When I played East Lake, it was on the dormant Zoysia which is an incredible surface and even in the summer, it's nice and tight, has good color, can be mowed very low and it's never an overseeding issue. Beats the hell out of paspalum.

Tony Nysse
Sr. Asst. Supt.
Long Cove Club
HHI, SC
« Last Edit: September 28, 2006, 06:08:50 AM by Anthony_Nysse »
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

Jason Blasberg

Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #54 on: September 28, 2006, 06:04:52 AM »
Tony:

Well at least I got the part right about your being a good player.   ;)

I have no bias in Cuscowilla b/c I'm a member and I likely will only be a member there for a few more years as travelling there is not all that practical.  Just so you know, I played it . . . .knew it was outstanding . . . and then joined it.  My bias is that I think it's unbelievable that Cusco. is not more readily recognized as one of the great Southern courses.  My bias is certainly in favor of that gal and not any relation I have with her!

I understand it's just your opinion but frankly you've stated no legitimate support for your opinion which, in connection with the other courses you've listed, leads me to conclude that we have fastly different ideas about what constitues quality GCA.
Jason
« Last Edit: September 28, 2006, 06:06:10 AM by Jason Blasberg »

Anthony_Nysse

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #55 on: September 28, 2006, 06:07:35 AM »
Jason,
  You said it perfectly. We just have different tastes and that fine. My list above doesn't mean that are actually better courses, just places that I prefer...I still think that we need a home and home!  ;)

Tony Nysse
Sr. Asst. Supt.
Long Cove Club
HHI, SC
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

Jason Blasberg

Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #56 on: September 28, 2006, 10:14:32 AM »
My list above doesn't mean that are actually better courses, just places that I prefer...I still think that we need a home and home!  ;)

Deal!  ;)

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #57 on: September 28, 2006, 10:25:24 AM »
 And Bill,
    When I played East Lake, it was on the dormant Zoysia which is an incredible surface and even in the summer, it's nice and tight, has good color, can be mowed very low and it's never an overseeding issue. Beats the hell out of paspalum.

Tony,  my one and only round at East Lake was on a rainy day and the stuff (zoysia) was mucky and sticky.  I had been at the Tour Championship a few weeks earlier and it appeared to be the same way although it wasn't raining.  I haven't played on zoysia much but didn't care for that example too much.  If it's as good as you describe, why isn't it used more?

Mike Hendren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #58 on: September 28, 2006, 10:32:46 AM »
Top 5 in the South?  Hmmmm.

Calling out Hillbillly Barney:

How do you split ten rounds between Cuscowilla and Lookout Mountain?

Mike
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #59 on: September 28, 2006, 12:11:16 PM »
 And Bill,
    When I played East Lake, it was on the dormant Zoysia which is an incredible surface and even in the summer, it's nice and tight, has good color, can be mowed very low and it's never an overseeding issue. Beats the hell out of paspalum.

Tony,  my one and only round at East Lake was on a rainy day and the stuff (zoysia) was mucky and sticky.  I had been at the Tour Championship a few weeks earlier and it appeared to be the same way although it wasn't raining.  I haven't played on zoysia much but didn't care for that example too much.  If it's as good as you describe, why isn't it used more?

Bill,
Somebody can (and will! :)) correct me if I'm wrong, but I think zoysia isn't used more because it grows too slowly to quickly fill in divots like bermuda does.  It's a great turf to play on, but there can't be many rounds per year.
"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

Anthony_Nysse

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #60 on: September 28, 2006, 03:06:04 PM »
AG,
  Bingo-that's probably the #1 reason along with a little bit about how it doesn't take well to cart traffic and overseeding. Plus with Bermudagrass, you RARELY have to spray it with a fungicaide, where zoysia, in season, needs monthly apps of Prostar, Insignia.....the expensive ones!

Tony Nysse
Sr. Asst. Supt.
Long Cove Club
HHI, SC
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

Doug_Petersan

Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #61 on: September 28, 2006, 04:00:36 PM »
Don't judge all Zoysia on Meyer "Z52" as far as playing qualities.  There are much better ones out now.  We spray our Zoysia once a year with fungicide for Z patch.  We also don't overseed, use 1/4th the Nitrogen of Bermuda, 2/3 the water of Bermuda and it plays great year around.  We also require carts to stay in the fairways year around, have never seen any damage from cart traffic.---Doug Petersan

George Pazin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cuscowilla...what am I missing?
« Reply #62 on: September 28, 2006, 04:41:17 PM »
Jason,
  I'll put it simply for you-I LIKE TO SEE ALL THE OPTIONS IN FRONT OF ME. I like the fault to be on me if the golf shot isn't what I planned it to be, not some well struck shot that gets rejected because of a burried elephant, rolls down an hill in into the woods...I like to see what I'm hitting at...make sense?

Just wanted to go into this statement a bit more -

Do you think Pete Dye falls into this category or definition? Is Long Cove like this?

From what little I've seen of Mr. Dye's work, I can't imagine he'd agree.
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

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