[paul cowley]

Patrick....good question, and I would add another...How did we get to the 14 club limit to begin with?

[Garland Bayley]

Let's see. I suppose I would pick 10 degrees to 58 degrees.
58 - 10 = 48. 48/7 = about 7
58 degree (sand/lob wedge)
51 degree (gap/pitching wedge)
44 degree 9 iron
37 degree 7.5 iron
30 degree 6 iron
23 degree (hybrid)
16 degree (fairway wood)
10 degree driver
putter

[paul cowley]

Very logical Garland, I like that.
It doesn't really matter what the clubs are called as long as the degrees are correct.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Paul Cowley,

Degrees alone won't help.

The length of the club is another factor.

[Garland Bayley]

Patrick,

Naturally the clubs through the hybrid would be stepped in size appropriate to standard club lengths with appropriate modifications for the player. The driver and fairway wood are very standard clubs that can easily be found in the proper lengths. Also, these two would have graphite shafts, whereas the others would be steel shafted.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Garland,

Every other sport seems to regulate the implements used so I would tend to agree with your premise.

I've also felt that the size of the driver clubhead should be restricted.

The question is, how to police the number of clubs in non-tournament events.

My theory is that the handicap system would automatically perform that task over time.

Someone playing with 14 clubs would probably have a lower handicap and as such, when they had to play with a reduced number of clubs, they would be at a disadvantage, which would be their price to pay for non-conformance.

[George Pazin]

...and...It wouldn't change golf course design in the least.

I love the idea...and...I think it would change design, for the better.

Almost by necessity, designers would have to make green complexes simulaneously both more interesting and less dictating.

I have been playing with 8 or 9 clubs for a couple years now, and I definitely find it more enjoyable - and less taxing physically, making it even easier to walk. It does make for some odd club decisions, but that makes the game more interesting to me personally.

[Garland Bayley]

Very logical Garland, I like that.
It doesn't really matter what the clubs are called as long as the degrees are correct.

I suggested to Tom Wishon that he could bring honesty back to golf equipment by marking his component irons with loft instead of the old numbering system that has become meaningless. He respectively replied that was not an area he was interested in innovating in.

[paul cowley]

George ....I am gladdened that we feel similarly.

Personally I think a handicap system could be developed allowing for how many clubs one used to shoot a score , with a person using fewer clubs trumping one who used more.
A new set of skills would be rewarded...as in 'Mr SoSos score of 5 using ten clubs was good, but Mr OhHo's 6, while using a daring six club total, might just sneak it away from Mr SoSo.'

[Ted Kramer]

It would simply be a better game/sport with fewer clubs.
While I like the idea of 9 clubs, if I were in charge I'd go with 7 or 8:

driver
21* hybrid
5 iron
8 iron
pw
60*
putter

or

driver
21*
5 iron
7 iron
9 iron
50*
60*
putter


Unless we went further and made 60* wedges illegal, there is no way that I would leave the LW out of my bag. I wouldn't mind making the loft limit 56* . . .

-Ted

[Ted Kramer]

It would simply be a better game/sport with fewer clubs.
While I like the idea of 9 clubs, if I were in charge I'd go with 7 or 8:

driver
21* hybrid
5 iron
8 iron
pw
60*
putter

or

driver
21*
5 iron
7 iron
9 iron
50*
60*
putter


Unless we went further and made 60* wedges illegal, there is no way that I would leave the LW out of my bag. I wouldn't mind making the loft limit 56* . . .

-Ted

Ted

I have long thought that as a side kick to 8ish clubs there should be a loft range.  Something like 15 degrees to 55 degrees.  

Ciao

Sean

I like your 15*-55* range. But I think I'd prefer no loft limit on the long side, but a serious reduction in clubhead size. There is no good reason why a club larger than the Titleist 975d is legal.

And I also HATE what the new golf balls have done to the sport.
There should be 2 choices in golf balls:
balata and 2 piece rocks. . .
if you want the spin and the feel then you have to give up the distance and vice-versa.

Maybe you could talk me into the Titleist Professional level of performance . . .but I'd really prefer balata.


-Ted

 

[Scott Coan]

The beauty of the game is that you can limit yourself the very next time you play.

We have tried mixing things up amongst our core group of guys (16-20 guys) at my club recently.  A couple weeks ago we had an 8 club limit.  The bags were a heckofa lot lighter on the shoulders and most could think of maybe 1 or 2 shots where they really had to manufacture something.  Everybody scored pretty much what they normally score.

Following that experiment, the next week we initiated the following rule.  Every tee shot (including par 3's) must be hit with the 5 iron.  There were a few grumbles but everybody thought it was a blast.

Most of the scores were higher but 2 or 3 of the guys shot to their handicaps.  One guy thats been slumping shot one of his better games in weeks.  What was particulary interesting was the expectation factor.  Sitting 220 yards out you just wanted to get it on or anywhere near the green and then try to grind out a par.  A lot of times you did and felt great about it.

Contrast that with blasting a drive 300 down the middle and then wafting a fat 9 iron short right.  Then you chunk the chip and walk away with a double.  The mindset was just so completely different.

Power-chipping a 5 iron into a 140 yard par 3 was a bit of fun as well.

[Greg Beaulieu]

...and...It wouldn't change golf course design in the least.

I love the idea...and...I think it would change design, for the better.

Almost by necessity, designers would have to make green complexes simulaneously both more interesting and less dictating.

Why is the number 14 for clubs in the bag so magical? I have no idea, and agree that a reduction would make sense in many ways. In my case, the difference between my 5 and 6 irons is hardly worth mentioning. I also recall that my first dept-store catalog set of clubs was set that came only with 3-5-7-9 irons and 2 woods, along with a putter. Add a wedge or two and it really wouldn't change my game much.

However, my bigger issue relates not to the number of clubs, but the number of holes. I think I understand the history that made 18 holes the standard, but I have long felt that is too many. Too much time to play, too much land needed to build; the list goes on. I would propose 12 to 14 holes as ideal.

Let me slip on my asbestos suit and we can continue this discussion.

[George Pazin]

Greg, if you search the archives, you might find discussion of courses with 12 holes. One of our posters on here started a company that I think was called Prestwick 12 to initiate just such a drive. I'll see if I can find something in the archives.

An interesting sidenote on Sean's range is that 15 degrees might sap a few yards off the drives as well.

My own game would probably benefit most (relatively speaking) if they would simply outlaw woods/metals.

 

BTW, Paul, your post about Mr. SoSo and Mr. OhHo is hilarious, well done.

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