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Kyle Harris

Re:Angels Crossing and Notre Dame
« Reply #25 on: September 20, 2006, 11:14:37 PM »
It appears GCA posters are even more passionate about football than they are golf course design.

Prove it.

T_MacWood

Re:Angels Crossing and Notre Dame
« Reply #26 on: September 20, 2006, 11:19:20 PM »
Kyle
What is Paterno's record against Jim Tressel (going into the game this Saturday)?

2-3

Is he 0-for against Carr? Yikes.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2006, 11:19:56 PM by Tom MacWood »

Kyle Harris

Re:Angels Crossing and Notre Dame
« Reply #27 on: September 20, 2006, 11:27:07 PM »
Kyle
What is Paterno's record against Jim Tressel (going into the game this Saturday)?

2-3

Is he 0-for against Carr? Yikes.

Yeah, we haven't beaten M*chigan since 1996. Including the two year rotation off the schedule.

ed_getka

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Angels Crossing and Notre Dame
« Reply #28 on: September 21, 2006, 12:21:50 PM »
Angels Crossing is easily one of the best new modern courses I have seen. Jim is an absolute delight to spend the day with and hear how this course came about. I will post a new thread in a couple of days when I get caught up on life.
"Perimeter-weighted fairways", The best euphemism for containment mounding I've ever heard.

David Wigler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Angels Crossing and Notre Dame
« Reply #29 on: September 21, 2006, 03:01:01 PM »
Hey Wigler,

Lemme get this straight, PSU plays ONE D-1AA school in the past 100 years and suddenly they're playing patsies? Do you know why PSU had to play Youngstown State? Please look it up before spouting off. Michigan beating up on Vanderbilt and Central Michigan isn't exactly all that great either. Also, joining a conference has made PSU schedule patsy non-conference opponents, since the Big Ten and MAC have an agreement for at least one game for every team against each other per season. At least we got the MAC Champion (Akron) this year.

Also, the fact that Penn State is WINNING bowls is proof that despite the so-called patsy schedule is misleading. Look at which teams PSU was beating in those bowls, and by the way, tOSU is one of them (1980 Fiesta Bowl).

During the 70s and 80s, Penn State played Alabama, Syracuse, Pitt and Notre Dame during the height of their respective programs and consistently won against all of them.

Are you saying that Michigan playing Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa, and Minnesota during the same span is comparable?

Isn't the only reason the game was called "The game" because it was essentially the Big Ten championship game?

BTW, you've won both of your last games against PSU with a little help. Please go back to the 2002 game and tell me why Tony Johnson was ruled OB on that catch inside the 20 with a minute left when he had control of the ball with both feet in bounds. Go back to last year and learn how to properly call time out.

When you do this, I'll send you a Lloyd Carr football package, including a clock that adds two seconds to every hour and a down and distance marker that measures 9 yards in one direction and 11 yards in the other.

Furthermore, if Lloyd Carr is even allowed to come back next year, he can be a year closer to Paterno's 40+ years in PSU's program, and if you guys keep winning, he'll only have 5 more undefeated seasons to make up. How can a team go two consecutive seasons undefeated without even getting a shot at the National Championship? I dunno, but go back to 1969-1970 to find out.

At least Paterno can beat Jim Tressel.


Kyle,

I respect your passion but you are delusional.  Michigan won the games.  I thought Michigan's Bowl Game last year was the worst officiating in history.  It was so bad that the NCAA changed the rules this year and the Sun Belt officials will no longer be doing bowl games involving major conferences.  Know what, the record book still says Nebraska won.  

As for your 70's statement, you were joking right. "During the 70s and 80s, Penn State played Alabama, Syracuse, Pitt and Notre Dame during the height of their respective programs and consistently won against all of them."  I decided to grab 1978 at random since I know that was the year that an undefeated Penn State team almost won a national championship.  Penn States schedule: Temple, Rutgers, Ohio State, SMU, TCU, Kentucky, Syracuse, WVU, Maryland, NC State, Pitt.  They did not schedule Alabama, they got them in the bowl game.  Up until the Bowl game, they had played 2 top 20 AP schools NC State #18 and Maryland #20.  That is far easier than a conference schedule with rivalries.  I would suspect that if I choose another year, the results would be the same.  BTW I know they played Brown at some point and seem to remember games at Cincinnati (Are not both D2) and I am pretty sure they had a yearly series with almost D2 programs Rutgers and Temple.  Here are some interesting stats for you:

The most total wins in college football history (851)
The highest all-time winning percentage (.749)
The highest NCAA home attendance every year but one since 1974
The longest current streak of having over 100,000 at a home game (193 consecutive games)
The longest current bowl game streak (31)
The longest current streak of non-losing seasons (38)
The current longest number of games in Division 1-A since last being shutout (273 games)
The most televised school in college football history (356 televised games)
The largest NCAA crowd to ever attend a football game: 112,118 on November 22, 2003, at Michigan Stadium
The largest delta (points for minus points against) in college football history
The most conference football championships (42)
The most undefeated seasons in Division 1-A football (25)
The highest all-time strength of schedule rating in college football
The longest time since playing a (non WWII-era) non-Division-1A opponent (74 years)
The most winning seasons (109)
One of only two schools with a winning record against every Division 1-A conference, including independent schools such as Notre Dame
The number one sports rivalry: Michigan versus Ohio State, according to ESPN's "Top 10 Greatest Sports Rivalries"

PS - Funny but I thought Paterno had a losing record against Tressel and had never beaten Carr.  Maybe I am wrong.
And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04

Kyle Harris

Re:Angels Crossing and Notre Dame
« Reply #30 on: September 21, 2006, 03:28:08 PM »
Hey Wigler,

Lemme get this straight, PSU plays ONE D-1AA school in the past 100 years and suddenly they're playing patsies? Do you know why PSU had to play Youngstown State? Please look it up before spouting off. Michigan beating up on Vanderbilt and Central Michigan isn't exactly all that great either. Also, joining a conference has made PSU schedule patsy non-conference opponents, since the Big Ten and MAC have an agreement for at least one game for every team against each other per season. At least we got the MAC Champion (Akron) this year.

Also, the fact that Penn State is WINNING bowls is proof that despite the so-called patsy schedule is misleading. Look at which teams PSU was beating in those bowls, and by the way, tOSU is one of them (1980 Fiesta Bowl).

During the 70s and 80s, Penn State played Alabama, Syracuse, Pitt and Notre Dame during the height of their respective programs and consistently won against all of them.

Are you saying that Michigan playing Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa, and Minnesota during the same span is comparable?

Isn't the only reason the game was called "The game" because it was essentially the Big Ten championship game?

BTW, you've won both of your last games against PSU with a little help. Please go back to the 2002 game and tell me why Tony Johnson was ruled OB on that catch inside the 20 with a minute left when he had control of the ball with both feet in bounds. Go back to last year and learn how to properly call time out.

When you do this, I'll send you a Lloyd Carr football package, including a clock that adds two seconds to every hour and a down and distance marker that measures 9 yards in one direction and 11 yards in the other.

Furthermore, if Lloyd Carr is even allowed to come back next year, he can be a year closer to Paterno's 40+ years in PSU's program, and if you guys keep winning, he'll only have 5 more undefeated seasons to make up. How can a team go two consecutive seasons undefeated without even getting a shot at the National Championship? I dunno, but go back to 1969-1970 to find out.

At least Paterno can beat Jim Tressel.


Kyle,

I respect your passion but you are delusional.  Michigan won the games.  I thought Michigan's Bowl Game last year was the worst officiating in history.  It was so bad that the NCAA changed the rules this year and the Sun Belt officials will no longer be doing bowl games involving major conferences.  Know what, the record book still says Nebraska won.  

As for your 70's statement, you were joking right. "During the 70s and 80s, Penn State played Alabama, Syracuse, Pitt and Notre Dame during the height of their respective programs and consistently won against all of them."  I decided to grab 1978 at random since I know that was the year that an undefeated Penn State team almost won a national championship.  Penn States schedule: Temple, Rutgers, Ohio State, SMU, TCU, Kentucky, Syracuse, WVU, Maryland, NC State, Pitt.  They did not schedule Alabama, they got them in the bowl game.  Up until the Bowl game, they had played 2 top 20 AP schools NC State #18 and Maryland #20.  That is far easier than a conference schedule with rivalries.  I would suspect that if I choose another year, the results would be the same.  BTW I know they played Brown at some point and seem to remember games at Cincinnati (Are not both D2) and I am pretty sure they had a yearly series with almost D2 programs Rutgers and Temple.  Here are some interesting stats for you:

The most total wins in college football history (851)
The highest all-time winning percentage (.749)
The highest NCAA home attendance every year but one since 1974
The longest current streak of having over 100,000 at a home game (193 consecutive games)
The longest current bowl game streak (31)
The longest current streak of non-losing seasons (38)
The current longest number of games in Division 1-A since last being shutout (273 games)
The most televised school in college football history (356 televised games)
The largest NCAA crowd to ever attend a football game: 112,118 on November 22, 2003, at Michigan Stadium
The largest delta (points for minus points against) in college football history
The most conference football championships (42)
The most undefeated seasons in Division 1-A football (25)
The highest all-time strength of schedule rating in college football
The longest time since playing a (non WWII-era) non-Division-1A opponent (74 years)
The most winning seasons (109)
One of only two schools with a winning record against every Division 1-A conference, including independent schools such as Notre Dame
The number one sports rivalry: Michigan versus Ohio State, according to ESPN's "Top 10 Greatest Sports Rivalries"

PS - Funny but I thought Paterno had a losing record against Tressel and had never beaten Carr.  Maybe I am wrong.


Dave,

May want to check when Div 1-AA came into being. Cincinatti is a member of the Big East and has never been anything other than Division 1. At the time Penn State played Brown, they were Division 1.

I find you stating that Penn State's schedule that year was "far easier" than a conference schedule is arbitrary to your point and is open for MUCH debate. What were the rankings of the Big Ten schools for that year? Apparently, Ohio State wasn't even ranked since PSU played them and they did not make your list.

Furthermore, Penn State's rivalry with Pitt and WVU at the time was just as intense as most rivalries in the country. Just because they weren't under the auspices of the Big Ten conference does not make them any less storied.

The fact remains that Michigan has won 18 Bowl Games in it's storied career. Now yes, the Big Ten only sent one representative for much of that time, however knowing that Michigan has made 31 straight bowls (stretching back to 1975) and has won 18 in its history that leaves a record of 18-13 since 1975 assuming that Michigan played its first Bowl in 1975.

I am sure they did not.

Paterno's Bowl record stands at 22-11-1.

Michigan also boasts one of five stadiums in the country capable of holding over 100,000 and Penn State only came onto this list in 2001. OSU came onto this list in 1998 or 1999. Not sure of the history of Kyle Field or Neyland Stadium.

It is conceivable that PSU may have a longer streak had Beaver Stadium boasted the capacity of the Ann Arbor hole in the ground earlier, especially during the 80s and 90s.

As for offciating screwjobs, I agree with you re: your bowl last year. But you also should agree with me re: the 2002 PSU/UM game.

David Wigler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Angels Crossing and Notre Dame
« Reply #31 on: September 21, 2006, 04:24:13 PM »
Dave,

...I find you stating that Penn State's schedule that year was "far easier" than a conference schedule is arbitrary to your point and is open for MUCH debate. What were the rankings of the Big Ten schools for that year? Apparently, Ohio State wasn't even ranked since PSU played them and they did not make your list...

The fact remains that Michigan has won 18 Bowl Games in it's storied career. Now yes, the Big Ten only sent one representative for much of that time, however knowing that Michigan has made 31 straight bowls (stretching back to 1975) and has won 18 in its history that leaves a record of 18-13 since 1975 assuming that Michigan played its first Bowl in 1975...

Paterno's Bowl record stands at 22-11-1...

As for offciating screwjobs, I agree with you re: your bowl last year. But you also should agree with me re: the 2002 PSU/UM game.

Kyle,

Michigan's Bowl record is a sore spot for most Michigan grads.  That written, for 80 years, we only played in the Rose Bowl and for another ten, only in major bowls.  There was no padding by winning who-gives-a-crap bowls (I have no idea if PSU did that or not).  Michigan record in the Rose Bowl 8-11.  Michigan in other BCS Bowls 2-2.  Michigan in who-gives-a- crap bowls 8-6.  From 1901 when Michigan won the first Rose Bowl until 1974, when the Big Ten started allowing teams to play in more bowls, Michigans Bowl record was 4-2.  Even after perfect seasons like the back-to-backs in 1947-48, Michigan did not participate in any Bowls.  I am too lazy to look this up but would imagine you would be hard pressed to find a year where there were not three big ten teams rated in the AP poll since 1978.  In 1978, there were three.  

As for officiating, I truly do not remember the circumstances of several years ago.  I vividly remember USC fumbling on the two yard line and neither the ball nor player nor ball crossing the goal line and yet they were awarded a touchdown by Pac-10 officials.  I also remember the phantom holding call by Pac-10 officials.  As I said, that does me no good as the official record shows that Michigan lost both games - although I do get some satisfaction in the Pac-10 finally being exposed for their officiating corruption.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2006, 04:26:19 PM by David Wigler »
And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04