Very OT: An Open Apology to Patrick Mucci

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Tom,
I'll have you know that my Dad, a USC graduate (2 years there and 2 years at LA Harbor City College) was pissed-off at me alst night when he went to show me his new USC sweatshirt he got for his birthday, and I refused to even look at it.

I for one will sleep mighty nice after partying all night on Thanksgiving weekend in November. Victory will be sweet.

[Tom Huckaby]

Another Yahoo story about USC

I wonder what the replacement signals will be?

- The "valet, please bring the Porsche" signal

- The "waiter, here is my Platinum Amex" signal

- The "huh, what is a classroom?" signal

Easy Kevin.  That was pretty funny, I must admit... But your alma mater does remain far from pure, and don't make me keep reminding you of that.

 

BTW as I read that article, I found myself agreeing with USC... good lord can nothing be said in confidence any more?

TH

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom,
I'll have you know that my Dad, a USC graduate (2 years there and 2 years at LA Harbor City College) was pissed-off at me alst night when he went to show me his new USC sweatshirt he got for his birthday, and I refused to even look at it.

I for one will sleep mighty nice after partying all night on Thanksgiving weekend in November. Victory will be sweet.

Tommy:

While I remain proud of you for your strength of conviction - my black sheep brother the ND fan is the same as you re all this - I do continue to question your sanity.  And yes, you may sleep well come November all right... drowing one's sorrows does have the same effect as partying.

 

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Dave,
Sounds like the perfect losing attitude you have developed for years rooting for the Wildcats, who clearly have had Irish-envy for a very long, long time.

Me, I'll still root for the Irish win or lose--mostly win with our better coach, dynamic players, more beautiful campus and even better football colors which seem to grace the uniform with a pride and dignity that reaches throughout the nation. More & Better movies have been made about Notre Dame University too.

RUDY>>>RUDY>>>RUDY>>>RUDY>>>
RUDY>>>RUDY>>>RUDY>>>RUDY>>>

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Arbs,
To me a student athlete should be nothing more then a student athlete, striving to be the best he can be at his yourthful age, building a foundation for a bigger, better life that lay ahead. If he scores touchdowns  and then turns around and finds cures for cancer, well then I find him to be an exceptional human being with a brilliant and promising future. He's setting an example for himself and others, not providing a living for family and friends while in school, ala Reggie Bush.

To turn a blind eye to this, especially when a so-called "student/athlete is driving the expensive pussy wagon to school and practice, well I think the university is questionable in itself. USC has always attracted these kinds of problems, in fact they welcome them. So do their upper alumni.

Schools like Notre Dame and even Northwestern for that matter either don't offer them opportunities due to previous records or simply suspend them from activities all-together. Now I'm not going to be naive and say that ND doesn't get some bad apples, they arne't nearly of the questionable sorts as to hire agents, get their families houses on the margin, etc.

I'll have you note that I didn't attend college, and I speak entirely from the outside looking in. I look back at it now and realize just how great it would have been to go to a four-year school and learn, just to have that opportunity. To hear of those who abuse that opportunity, well it sort of pisses me off, but then again, why am I not surprised?

[Jordan Wall]

I'm just going to clear this up while I can.

As the Huskies are 2-1 as well, they are, as of now, the equal to Notre Dame.

ND move out, lets go WA..
 

[Tom Huckaby]

First of all, maybe it's just me, but what the hell did you guys do to this thread to make it so skinny?  It's appearing on only the left half of the screen for me now.

More importantly, I will note a few things:

1. Winners rarely talk graduation rates.  Funny how they become supremely important directly after a bad loss.  

2.  Tommy, easy on USC.  Sure they are not the role model on this that ND is - see, I can admit that - and my beloved Santa Clara most certainly is - but I believe it's stretching things WAY too far to look at one Reggie Bush situation (which has yet to be proven, btw) and say the school "welcomes" these things.  The vast majority of USC students are there for the education.  A small minority of the athletes are there to use it as a stepping stone to the pros.. just like a lot of other schools.  But to say this means USC welcomes bad apples is taking things way too far.

In any case, Sean remains right on re the stats... they simply cannot be used alone in a vacuum.  Beloved Santa Clara has a relatively low grad rate among athletes... but does that automatically mean we're filled with bad apples and have no desire to educate?  Please.  Anyone remotely familiar with the school knows that isn't true.  Our low rate there is caused by a low number of athletes period combined with a LOT of baseball players who leave early because they get drafted by MLB plus it being damn hard to graduate from SCU in four years period, let alone while also playing a sport.

That example occurs elsewhere too....

TH

[Tom Huckaby]

Perhaps the reason why most Ivy League schools suck at most sports is because they still place an education above a football game.  

Ciao

Sean

You've just encapsulated my annual lament as pertains to my real love and passion, Santa Clara basketball.  Oh how I've yearned from some prop 48 types, just once, to give us some success....

But in the end it's false yearning and whiny bitching.  I'm damn proud of how our school is, as Mucci is about how his is.

The problem remains though that for every Pat and I, happy with great student-athletes, waiting for success when it comes... there are 10,000 impatient alums and fans who don't give a hoot how a kid got there nor what he does while at the school - all that matters are Ws and Ls.

And coaches don't tend to get hired for great graduation rates, as much as schools pay lip service to this....

Nor do TV contracts get given to the Ivies or Santa Clara....

Thus it is how it is in college sports.  And it kind of always has been.

TH

[mikes1160]

Tom Huck: Yes, '73 was one of those rare years of success. We've had ten other consensus national championship years just like that. Charlie will deliver us one in the future.......also, living in the present is fine, but college football is all about history and tradition. For someone who detests ND football, Shivas is sure damn proud of that '95 game - and should be.

One thing you don't get about ND fans: during the Davie/Ty years, we were THRILLED to be 9-3, as were those coaches. Charlie brought along the attitude that this was nothing to aspire to, just as Pete C. has delivered this mantra to the Trojan faithful.

Kevin: I was sitting in section 23 during the PSU game, fairly close to #3. His boy is tall. And Mrs. #3 is still very hot....

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Kevin,
to back it up further, I have a friend that works for a certain company that shall remain nameless--no need to go there. Anyway, Reggie Bush brought in his entire family, friends and posse into the business to take advantage of the free wares which this certain company produces. He did this on a regular basis when he was at USC.

When "Reg" decided he was going to sign with another company to represent them instead (as guided by his management) Reg, entire family, friends and posse continued to come in and insist on free wares. Even though he didn't know that the company knew he was already signed with the competing company. As not to create more of a ruckus, he was allowed items for his own use, but the entire family, friends and posse were denied--rightfully.

The moral of the story is that this is the end result of what the university taught him, as well as previous schooling institutions and most, HIS PARENTS. This is the foundation that the Trojans wished to get involved with just so they can say we're #1.

Well to an extent!

THIS IS A TRUE STORY.

[Patrick_Mucci]

See, I agree it's been far too long since the USC-ND game had real national implications... but hell it's certainly not USC's fault ND has sucked for so long!

One look at USC's record beyond the PC years shows a program that as you say, has "sucked" for so long.  And, it "sucked" against mediocre competition.

As to a game with National implications, where were you last year ?  If USC didn't get very lucky they never make it to the Championship game.

My opinion about the rivalry is this:  over the long haul, the entire history of the college game, it has to be in the top 5 overall, and the single best "inter-sectional."  All other great rivalries are local... USC-ND is unique in the intersectional respect.  And that alone makes it very, very relevant.  That and the history, that is.  But you're right, rivalries do have to be two-way to be truly fun, and ND's lack of ability to compete is putting a serious strain on things in recent years.

Recent years ?, for 10, 11 or was it 12 straight years USC couldn't beat ND.  Talk about ineptness, and, they could prepare for ND by playing a weak schedule, and only in warm climes.

Mucci oughtta love that..... I can see the keys smoking with his ferocity... get out the color brackets!

Bay and howl as you like, you can't tarnish or diminish the special aura that surrounds ND

[Gib_Papazian]

Huckaby hit it on the head . . . . this marks the first time in 10 years we have agreed on ANYTHING.

The USC-ND game is the biggest and most important cross-division rivalry. I know all you provincial SEC, Big Ten types like to think your little regional spats somehow carry as much national gravitas as the Trojans and Irish battling it out, but that is simply a manifestation of the lack of academics and critical thinking endemic to your second tier schools.

Four legs good, two legs better!

The litmus test for "big-osity" in college football is easily determined simply by who calls the game. Keith Jackson is the voice of college football and the great one is always at his best when my Trojans take the field.

I simply do not comprehend why it is somehow okay to snipe at USC, when most other schools are afforded (at leaast) begrudging respect.

George Lucas just coughed up 175 million to build us a new film school, we were named "University of the Year" in 2000, our alumni are leaders in virtually every art, science and business imaginable.

Yet, if I am at a cocktail party with a group of perfect strangers and everyone begins comparing notes on where they went to school, there will be nary a comment until the USC alum pipes up.

"Oh, University of Spoiled Children . . . "  Neener neener neener.

This almost always rolls off the poison tongue of some Stanford Cardinal or smug Cal Bear. . . . . but often from somewhere like Duke or Wisconsin.

Maybe I do not understand why there is always such a strong reaction to the mention of our name.

As for football, perhaps we do not graduate as many as other places because so many leave school to go to the NFL.

We lost/graduated two Heisman Trophy winners in our backfield plus some guy who scored 26 touchdowns last year.

And yet - MacWood's bullshit aside - we are still crusing along. Maybe Booty and the boys don't score 28 points in six plays like the Leinart & Co., but USC has scored 20-plus points in 56 straight games.

I'll admit that Ohio State is better than we are right now, but we don't have seven Heisman's in Heritage Hall because we don't know how to retool.

If we make it to the National Championship game - a longshot with such a young squad - we can beat anybody because we also have the smartest and most enthusiastic coach in college football.

P.S. The Tennessee Tuxedo's are going to be sorry they did not take Leinart when they had the chance. The owner is an idiot. I went to school and hung out with Jeff Fisher, there is no way he and Norm Chow wanted that one-trick pony Vince Young instead of "plug 'n play" Matt Leinart .

Vince Young will wash out as soon as the NFL defensive coordinators figure out he has a wierd release; the DB's will get that one extra step breaking on the ball. The guy beat us last year, fair and square, but he is going to be another Michael Vick . . . . and that is not a prescription for long-term success.
 

[Gib_Papazian]

PS to Tommy,

The university did not "teach" Reggie Bush any such thing. I do not think either one of us was all that pure at the age of 22 . . . . . . think about it for a second Reggie and Leinart (to name just two) were more popular in L.A. than Brad Pitt and George Clooney . . . . I'd like to see how you would have handled celebrity and unlimited pussy.

[ForkaB]

I LOVE this skinny left side/right side format!  Whoever did it, keep it up.

As for the annual ND/SC pissing contest, I have one prediction:

One or both of you is going down this year--to Stanford!  Our 0-3 start is exactly what we need for one or more of our fabled Lilliputian victories in a 3-9 season. That is our Div1 specialite.........

[ForkaB]

PS to Tommy,

The university did not "teach" Reggie Bush any such thing. I do not think either one of us was all that pure at the age of 22 . . . . . . think about it for a second Reggie and Leinart (to name just two) were more popular in L.A. than Brad Pitt and George Clooney . . . . I'd like to see how you would have handled celebrity and unlimited pussy.

Tommy has certainly handled the celebrity bit in the years since the SI cover.  As to the latter bit, who knows?

[T_MacWood]

And yet - MacWood's bullshit aside - we are still crusing along. Maybe Booty and the boys don't score 28 points in six plays like the Leinart & Co., but USC has scored 20-plus points in 56 straight games.

I'll admit that Ohio State is better than we are right now, but we don't have seven Heisman's in Heritage Hall because we don't know how to retool.

If we make it to the National Championship game - a longshot with such a young squad - we can beat anybody because we also have the smartest and most enthusiastic coach in college football.

Gib
Whatever you say Gib.

I really feel sorry for USC and their youth. USC has the most talent in the country, period....and they aren't that young. There defense was young last year...not this year. Their offensive line is not young, their star receivers are starting their third year. Youth at RB is no big deal and the starter (since regaining academic eligibility) was recruited with Bush and White. And Josh Booty has been at USC so long I can't even remember when he came in...Ted Tollner? The only reason there may be some youngsters playing a lot is because the studs from this years #1 consensus recruiting class are better than the studs from the #1 consensus recruiting class from the year before and the year before that. And have you looked at your schedule lately? You guys are lock for the national championship game...hopefully you won't being playing Rutgers or Louisville.

I'll give you most enthusiastic coach...but everybody knows Charlie Weiss is the smartest.

[Patrick_Mucci]

PS to Tommy,

The university did not "teach" Reggie Bush any such thing. I do not think either one of us was all that pure at the age of 22 . . . . . . think about it for a second Reggie and Leinart (to name just two) were more popular in L.A. than Brad Pitt and George Clooney . . . .

I'd like to see how you would have handled celebrity and unlimited pussy.

Gib,

I don't know how I would have handled the celebrity.

But, I do know how I would have handled unlimited pussy !

[Tommy_Naccarato]

But Pat, they condoned it. They let it happen. Could you see ND letting something like that happen? They are a school that will suspend a player for a game for missing a test.

Don't get me wrong, I know every program has some inconsistencies, but USC had allowed their star quarterback, living in a fully-furnished luxuorious downtown loft that cost $3500 a month which the father "paid for" (I would like to know who helped the father) and his receiver shared for free.

Oh, but he just recently paid his half of the rent for that time he was there! Or maybe Paris Hilton helped out? (Leinert's part-time squeeze)

If there isn't an inconsistency there, well it would be naive to think it didn't exist, respectable coach or not.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Pat, I am with you on the last line. Also, Tom is right about the relative age of the USC team this year. Also if the coach is so dang smart then how does he let agents into practice and on the sidelines during games. No one with half a brain would do anything to let that element anywhere near the players especially on the univeristy property. That is the ultimate in lack of institutional control. The coach is just waving a flag and saying it is ok to hang with and take the money from agents.

[Tom Huckaby]

Patrick:

There are students that just graduated from each of these fine institutions last spring who never saw an ND victory over USC.  I kinda feel sad for the ND students - don't you?

As for the rest, I shall only point you to the scoreboard:

47-21.

Four in a row and counting.

Enjoy that life in the past... I know when one gets into the golden years, it's very tempting to do so... I just thought you had more vitality....

 


Tommy - you're way off re Leinart.  His family could afford his digs no problem.  And when a world exists when a star QB can't take in a homesick kid from NJ and make him feel welcome... well... it's a sad world.  Of course that was technically against the rules - as it should be, given the potential for abuse - but I remain proud of Leinart for doing that.  

As for the rest, it remains interesting at how losers point to graduation rates and snipe about rules violations... winners can just point to the scoreboard.  Need some more reminders about that?

 

[Tony_Chapman]

I haven't taken the time to read this thread Huck, but I think it's about football. Sorry, we couldn't put up more of a fight for you out there.

But, I would have taken 14-3 at the half and 21-10 with 12 minutes left before the game, so........

I guess we Huskers are still pining for the five year stretch we were 60-3 (with four national title game appearances and three wins). Now we'd take three losses in a season.

Hopefully we can right the ship against the pesky Troy Trojans (I mean this in all seriousness) this week. At least we have top-notch volleyball.

TC

[Tom Huckaby]

Tony:

Worry not about NE - they are damn tough and will do just fine from this point forward.  Oh, it's not the same as the glory years gone by, but you are going in the right direction.  USC is damn good - loaded - and the Huskers put up a very good fight.  Big 12 title and BCS bid is not out of the question... although TX will be problematic.

USC does play at NE next year, right?  That will be VERY interesting....

TH

[wsmorrison]

Does anybody know a website where you can look up all-time wins and other statistics of different NCCA schools?  I am interested in when football started at the University of Pennsylvania (1878?) and what our record was against Michigan, Notre Dame, etc prior to the start of the Ivy League when all those big schools travelled to Penn for the privilege of getting whooped at Franklin Field  

[Tony_Chapman]

Wayne - A simple google search gave me this:

http://www.archives.upenn.edu/histy/features/sports/football/1800s/teams.html

It appears they started in 1876, but no scoring system was in place until 1878 (as you suggest).

Huck - My neighbor is the sports editor for the daily newspaper here in the USC football media guide they list one of the most important games in USC football was Nebraska, Notre Dame from like 1923. Apparently the USC coach wanted  a national game and travelled by train to Lincoln to get the ball rolling. And, apparently Knute was tired of getting beat by the Bugeaters.

[Tom Huckaby]

Tony - I've been perusing the USC media guide a lot lately... and yes, that is said to be one of the impeti (impetuses?) behind the USC-ND series.   USC really wanted a piece of ND.  

Interesting, the series USC-NE now stands 2-0-1 in favor of USC...

1969 USC 31, NE 21 in Lincoln
1970 USC 21, NE 21 in LA
2006 USC 28, NE 10 in LA.

And yes, 9/15/2007 will have the Trojans journeying to Lincoln again.