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Mike_Sweeney

Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« on: September 06, 2006, 06:58:06 AM »
As quietly reported by Shaq without his usual sarcasm, I thought this was pretty interesting that the PGA is tapping Gil Hanse to fix up TPC Boston.

http://sports.bostonherald.com/golf/view.bg?articleid=155739


“The tour has asked me as a guy who’s been around here for a long time to (help) make some changes,” said Faxon, of Barrington, R.I. “This course will be part of the FedEx Cup and I think they want to try to make it a little more New England style, traditional.
 
    “They picked (architect) Gil Hanse to make the changes. I think he can make some pretty significant changes to the look of the course. It’s not a bad course. I think it plays kind of Florida-like. I think the players like (the course). They need to love it.”


Will drivable par 4's become standard on tour? Is Tim Finchem a lurker? Will Tommy become the PGA Tour Architectural Guru? What next - Shaq for President of the USGA? The Sports Illustrated article never did much, will this be the crossover for hairy bunkers and wild greens ? ;)
« Last Edit: September 06, 2006, 12:48:43 PM by Mike Sweeney »

Mike_Sweeney

Re:Is the PGA Tour coming to Rustic Canyon?
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2006, 12:44:10 PM »
Let me rephrase more seriously. Isn't Gil Hanse being hired by the PGA and being on record for SHORTENING two holes somewhat significant?

Faxon said there will be changes made to all 18 holes with the two biggest the fourth and 16th. The fourth will become a drivable par 4 and the par-3 16th will be shortened.

Obviously someone from the PGA saw Boston Golf Club and was impressed. Isn't this some sign that the message is getting out when they hire Gil Hanse to redo a Palmer course that is still very new?
« Last Edit: September 06, 2006, 12:44:49 PM by Mike Sweeney »

Cliff Hamm

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Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2006, 01:31:38 PM »
Add Tiger to the mix:

   

Providence, R.I., Wednesday September 6, 2006 1:26 p.m. Eastern Standard Time
   
Major plans in works for TPC course

Work will begin soon on another renovation project at the Norton facility, the second in the four years the club has been open.

01:00 AM EDT on Wednesday, September 6, 2006

BY PAUL KENYON
Journal Sports Writer

NORTON, Mass. -- When Tiger Woods defends his Deutsche Bank Championship next Labor Day weekend, the TPC of Boston course that will host the event will be very different than the one Woods won on last weekend.

Work will begin soon, tournament and course officials have disclosed, on another major renovation project at the facility, the second in the four years the club has been open.

The course, designed by Arnold Palmer, underwent considerable modification after it was used by the PGA Tour for the first time in 2003. The changes were made based on suggestions by the players.

This new plan is being done in conjunction with the use of the course, beginning next year, as part of the FedEx Cup playoff system that will be put into effect next year, one that will include a $10-million prize to the winner.

"As we've said all along, if we couldn't have a major, we wanted to be the next-best thing," said Seth Waugh, the CEO of Deutsche Bank America. "We feel now like we'll be part of the mini-majors.

"While we've had maybe five of the top 15 in the world here, next year we hopefully will have 100 of the top 100," Waugh said.

Because the event becomes even more prominent next year and into the future, there will be an even stronger demand that it be a premier layout.

"I think the players like it," said Rhode Island's Brad Faxon. "They need to love it."

Faxon, who has a golf course design business, has been asked to help plan and execute the renovations. The prime architect involved will be Gil Hanse, one of the rising stars in the business. He has received much praise for his work at the Boston Golf Club, which opened in Hingham, Mass., last year and for guiding renovation projects at Kittansett and Merion Country Clubs, among others.

"His style is an older world style, more of a classic, traditional feel," said Eric Baldwin, the tournament director. "What we're trying to do is New Englandize it, if that's a word."

Hanse and Faxon are receiving plenty of help with their plans, which already are well under way. None other than Woods himself has volunteered to help.

"Tiger wants to be involved in this," Waugh said.

"I have my own ideas, yes," Woods said Monday after winning this year's event. "I'm going to try and help out with that, give my opinion, and they can utilize it or not. . . . I am getting into the golf course design business here probably pretty soon. So it's something that I'm very excited about, to be creative and design a piece of property that people will want to go play."

"They're just trying to improve the golf course. It's not a bad golf course; they're just trying to improve it," Baldwin said. "Golf courses always evolve. If you aren't doing anything to your golf course, you're probably not keeping up with the times. I think this is one way to add value to the course."

One goal is to give the course more of a New England feel.

"I think it's going to start to evolve from the completely manicured look," Baldwin said. "Right now, the bunkers are all cut to the top. It all looks clean and sharp, like when you get a brand-new haircut. The plan is to make it more natural."

Fescue, the wavy, light grass that is such a big part of so many New England courses, is planned for several areas, including around the bunkers. As Baldwin describes it, "The bunkers complexes are going to get roughed up a little bit."

Members of Hanse's firm were at the course last week getting opinions and ideas from players. A number of plans already have been formulated.

"We're going to make changes on all 18," Faxon said. Some of the biggest, he said, will be at 4 and 16. The par-4 fourth now is a sharp dogleg right.

"It will be a driveable par-4, a straightaway par-4," Faxon said.

The 16th, a 211-yard par-3 with a large pond that guards the front, will be shortened as part of an attempt to bring the pond more into play.

"It will be a shorter par-3, a 6-, 7-, 8-iron," Faxon said. "We'll use the water. It won't be an island green. It will be a peninsula and then we'll bring (No. 17) in and straighten that hole out."

"Who better than to have a local guy who is a traditionalist, who loves this place, be involved," Waugh said of having Faxon play a major hand in the project.

Having Woods volunteer to help, too, obviously is a bonus. Woods said he is serious about getting into course design.

"I've played all around the world. I've seen so many different types of golf courses," Woods said. "I have my own opinion on the styles, on how the game should be played."

The plans, as they now stand, are not quite what one would expect Woods to do if he had a choice.

"It's interesting. The first plan is that it might actually mean shortening the course," Waugh said of the layout that played to 7,415 yards last week. "It may be the first time in the history of golf that they'll shorten the course.

"Distance does mean that much to these guys," he said. "You can make it 9,000 yards. What you need are wind and rain and a feel for a course."

The work, Baldwin said, "is going to begin sooner rather than later. In the past, they've tried to get as much done as they could before winter sets in. We want it to be ready for next year."

pkenyon@projo.com / (401) 277-7340








Patrick_Mucci

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2006, 01:38:56 PM »
Mike Sweeney,

I'm curious as to why Faxon feels that the PGA Tour pros need to "love" a golf course, and in what context he frames that concept.

John_Conley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2006, 01:50:09 PM »
Yes.

Mike_Cirba

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2006, 11:05:43 PM »
Personally, I think this is really a positive sign, and I'm really happy for Gil.

Faxon's involvement and taste are clearly some of the drivers here, so I'm not sure how "transferrable" the thinking will be to other tour venues.   Also, I wonder given the limitations of the current routing if the event shouldn't be played out at Boston GC in the first place, although they probably aren't interested in hosting.

Jimmy Muratt

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Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2006, 01:05:28 AM »
Having Gil Hanse involved can only be a positive thing for the course and the event.  I anticipate the biggest effect of his changes will be to make the players actually think and contemplate different strategic options.  He'll get in their head a little bit and tempt them with risk/reward shots.  

These guys are so good, the only real defense of the golf course is to tempt their ego and pride.  

Tommy_Naccarato

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2006, 01:50:40 AM »
Gil Hanse, Brad Faxon & Tiger Woods
Bill Coore & Ben Crenshaw
Tom Doak & Jack Nicklaus & Co.

I would say that is significant.

Get ready world, for the coming of the new "Golden Age."

Hopefully a world war or complete failure of the government and financial classes won't screw it up like it did last time.

Scott Witter

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2006, 08:09:58 AM »
My guess is that it will be significant to Gil...isn't that what matters :D

JESII

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2006, 08:18:18 AM »
Is Applebrook, in Malvern PA, a Gil Hanse course?

wsmorrison

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2006, 08:30:31 AM »
Jim,

It is a Hanse course that I've yet to see.  I'll try and get over there today to watch you play and check out the course.

Jim shot a 69 yesterday to share the first round lead of the PA Mid-Am at Applebrook.  Let's all wish him well for the remainder of the tournament.

JESII

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2006, 08:55:33 AM »
Based on that course (and I know, it's only one course) I'd say the visual deception and confusion presented would make it unlikely for the PGA Tour players to love the course.

To answer Mike's question, yes it would seem significant, and yes it seems like things are moving in the right direction as Mr. Naccarato's list indicates. But that does not necessarily mean the guys on TV will love this type of golf.

Joel_Stewart

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Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2006, 01:58:49 PM »
I wonder if they consulted Arnold Palmer/ Ed Seay who are the original architects?

Personally I think Gil is going to shake things up at this course but he is very smooth and understands a much bigger political issue in rebuilding the course for the PGA.  Faxon should just email his ideas to Gil and Gil will make him look like a genuis.

Lastly, did Gil get the job because of his great effort at Boston GC?



Geoffrey Childs

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2006, 02:34:03 PM »
I too am thrilled for Gil and some well deserved recognition.  Boston Golf Club is a real gem.  

To add to some of the excellent comments I would add that Gil builds classic golf courses and his love of courses like Merion is clearly reflected in his work.  However, he also tends to build DIFFICULT golf courses and he does so without extraordinary length.  

Inniscrone - hard
Applebrook- hard
Boston Golf Club - hard
Craighead - hard
Tallgrass - not hard

His greensites protect par very well and he utilizes strategies that require thoughtful play.  I think he is perfect for building a course that tour caliber players MIGHT have trouble scoring.

Mike_Sweeney

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2006, 02:39:31 PM »
Geoffrey and others,

Of his original courses, I have only played TallGrass. Which Gil Hanse original could best host a PGA Tour event today and why?

How about Doak?

How about Coore & Crenshaw?

We can ignore membership priorities for this thread.

In the case of Kelly Moran, my vote would be for Laurel Links. It is a very difficult course and the super has those greens running very fast. It has no real blindness that the Tour players seem to frown upon as mentioned by Sully. I think it would actually be a better Tour course than nearby Friars Head.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2006, 02:52:00 PM by Mike Sweeney »

HamiltonBHearst

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #15 on: September 07, 2006, 02:58:35 PM »


I will make this easy on Tom Huckleby. Sand Hills for Coore and Crenshaw.  What was the question again?

Chris Munoz

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #16 on: September 07, 2006, 04:14:28 PM »
I was just wondering if Gil will change how the bunkers are now and re-format them to his liking, meaning more of links style and showing more fescue lines and etc.
Christian C. Munoz
Assistant Superintendent Corales
PUNTACANA Resort & Club
www.puntacana.com

wsmorrison

Re:Is the hiring of Gil Hanse by the PGA Tour significant?
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2006, 06:42:24 PM »
Just wanted to say that Jim Sullivan, Jr. (JESII) followed up his first round leading 69 with a cool 67 to win the Pennsylvania Mid-Am.  Congratulations, Sully!
« Last Edit: September 07, 2006, 06:42:43 PM by Wayne Morrison »

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