The Best of Jim Engh

[Jay Flemma]

Matt:

I think the best tenth is the 10th at Pradera...it saysmore on 311 yards than  most holes say oin 450...options about and temptation is huge.

[Matt_Ward]

Jay:

The 10th is a fine hole -- but Engh has done better short holes -- in fact -- the 5th at Pradera is one of his best period for that type of yardage.

I'll stick with the 10th at Red Hawk Ridge for now.

[Andy Troeger]

Unfortunately Tullymore is the only Engh course I've played, so while there are many fine holes, I can't really help in the comparative portion of this exercise.

From the images I've seen of his courses out West I can't wait to get out there to try them sometime. The next trip that way though will be Albuquerque, but hopefully Colorado will be in the not too distant future.

[Jay Flemma]

Jim himself and Tim Hartnett both think that 10 and 17 are their faves on the whole course.  After I saw the holes, I agreed.  10 has a pushed up green that repels low approaches into the devilish shaved chipping areas.  From the tee, the beckons like a siren, but the tee shot must carry the bunkers AND negitiate the fairway contours.  The closer you get to the green, the more hurly burly the surrounds.  Otherwise its 5-wood, wedge.  3 or 6...it depends on if you execute.  Risk - reward...much more interesting than 10 at Red Hawk which is prettier, but not as sexy form an architecture standpoint.

[Matt_Ward]

Jay:

The exercise of selecting holes is not to simply cherry-pick one or two but to add AN ENTIRE layout of the best of Engh and make it into a par-72 course with the holes chosen from their precise location on those respective courses.

Jay -- you raise a good point on the overall merits of the par-3 17th at Pradera. On giving that some thoughts -- I would add that hole and drop the one I picked from Redlands Mesa.

I would like to switch the 1st hole selectee to a par-5 because Engh generally likes to start his courses, not all of them mind you, with a par-5.

As I indicated for me that would be either the 1st at Sanctuary or Fossil Trace. That would be my total # of par-5 holes to five, which is generally what one sees when playing an Engh layout.

However, once I add a fifth par-5 I'll need to include one additional par-3 and pull one of the existing par-4 holes that have already been chosen.

Among those par-4 holes are the following:

2nd Pradera
5th Pradera
6th Black Rock
8th Sanctuary
10th Red Hawk Ridge
11th Pradera
14th Redlands Mesa
15th Black Rock
16th Lakota Canyon Ranch

Gents: If there is a par-3 Engh hole that can substitute oneof the above mentioned par-4's I'd love to see it. Not all of the par-4 holes above is rock solid in my mind. I won't say which ones because it will take away from this exercise.

The updated overall listing ...

1st hole -- Snowmass Club (4) 460 yds
HM Sanctuary (5) 604 yds & Fossil Trace (5) 575 yds
2nd hole -- Pradera (4) 432 yds
3rd hole -- Hawktree (3) 164 yds
4th hole -- Lakota Canyon (5) 556 yds
5th hole -- Pradera (4) 356 yds
6th hole -- Black Rock (4) 428 yds
7th hole -- Lakota Canyon Ranch (3) 223 yds
8th hole -- Sanctuary (4) 380 yds
HM Blackstone (4) 456 yds
9th hole -- Blackstone (5) 560 yds

10th hole -- Red Hawk Ridge (4) 440 yds
11th hole -- Pradera (4)  495 yds
12th hole -- Fossil Trace (5)  585 yds
13th hole -- Hawktree (3)  230 yds
14th hole -- Redlands Mesa (4) 390 yds
15th hole -- Black Rock (4)  457 yds
16th hole -- Lakota Canyon Ranch (4)  416 yds
17th hole -- Pradera (3) 224 yds
HM - Lakota Canyon Ranch (3)  219 yds & Redlands Mesa
18th hole -- Pradera (5)  557 yds
HM - Lakota Canyon Ranch (5)  557 yds.

P.S. For those who have played Tullymore are there any par-3 holes which might be selected ?

Thanks ...