[Peter Pratt]

I live in Lansing, MI and played Groesbeck for the 100th or so time yesterday. It has 2 world-class (yes, I mean it) holes on the front nine, the 289-yard opener and the 195-yard 6th, both of which feature heaving, almost linksland-like rolls. They require precise shots, but offer different angles of attack (the first does at least). I've played most of the best courses in Michigan, and I'd put #6 among the very best par 3s.

Any other great holes on less heralded munis or public courses?

[Paul_Lorenzen]

Mohansic in Yorktown, NY (Westchester Co muni designed by Winton in the 30s) has two. The fourth is an uphill gentle dogleft left with an elevated skyline green that plays 440. The 13th is par 3 closely bunkered uphill hole with a 30 foot drop-off to the right, measuring 195 uphill from the whites.

There are several other holes on this course (14 and 15) that are excellent. This is the course that people would drool over if the
County didn't mismanage it to such a large degree.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Peter,

That's a great question.

But, the question is even better in the context of a so-so golf course.

Often, I've been playing a so-so golf course and suddenly, wow, there's this great golf hole.

So you ask yourself. "How did it come about that the architect created so much mediocrity, yet, in its midst, he created greatness ?

And, "why couldn't he create more great holes ?"

[Peter Pratt]

Pat,

You hit on the hidden premise of my question and said it better than I could have. What's interesting about Groesbeck is that the city brought in Jerry Matthews, a solid regional architect based in Lansing, to spruce up what is now the back nine. I think he improved some holes but took the delightful quirkiness out of several holes, including a 300-yarder to a blind, punchbowl green.

Perahps the answer to your question is that these great holes just present themselves so unequivocally to even the least accomplished "architects" that they can't help but find them. The 6th hole at Groesbeck just jumps out at you--a roiling uphill fairway to a green set between 2 huge trees on a wide plateau. Of course, the trees were tiny or nonexistent when the hole was designed in the 20s.

[Brad Tufts]

It does make you wonder how many great holes there are out there on courses that we wouldn't think of going to see.  It's tough to pay a greens fee to endure 15 awful holes to see 3 good or even great ones.

It also seems strange that an architect would have one or two strokes of genius over the span of 18 mediocre holes.  Is it the result of uninteresting land sprinkled with only a few noteworthy features?

After seeing the time and effort put into each and every project by the so-called GCA-favored architects of today, do other more commercial designers see a project with less-than-ideal working conditions (poor land, low budget, demanding developer/owner, cramped space) and more or less mail it in with only a few indications of higher-plane thought?

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