Willie Park

[Jordan Wall]

So I am caddying at Seattle today and unfortunately got to talking.  Fortunately, it was about something worthwhile and productive.  I was speaking to a member about golf courses and there history.  This person has played about everything at the Hamptons, and all over.  He is a member at a course called Woodway.

He tells me Willie Park designed it, and I bring up Maidstone (another Park designed which he had played).
Then he tells me that Olympia Fields, Maidstone, and Woodway are the only courses he ever designed while in the USA.  That it only three courses.

I had thought Willie Park had designed more courses in the USA.
If anybody knows some history about this architect and what he designed/how many he designed that would be cool.

Thanks

[TEPaul]

"Then he tells me that Olympia Fields, Maidstone, and Woodway are the only courses he ever designed while in the USA.  That it only three courses."

That fellow is simply wrong. Park designed over a dozen TIMES that many golf courses in the USA.

Matter of fact Philadelphia just discovered it has a Willie Park Jr designed course---Philmont North, heretofore thought to be designed by William Flynn.  

[JMorgan]

Many more, Jordan.  Berkshire CC in Berks Co., Reading, PA is just one example of a less than well-known WPJr course.    

[Willie_Dow]

It seems to me that Willie laid out a number of nine holers in New England, which were later added to by Ross.  I can think of two, Hoosic in Milton, and New Bedford CC.  Any more ?

[wsmorrison]

There are six more Park, Jr. courses just in his home state.  According to Cornish and Whitten:

Arkansas:  Hot Springs GCC
CT:  CC Farmington, CC of New Canaan, Madison CC, New Haven CC (Matt Burrows), Shuttle Meadow, Tumblebrook and Woodway
FL:  Alton Beach GC
IL:  Olympia Field (N)
Maine:  Castine
MA:  CC of New Bedford (9, Ross 9), Milton-Hoosic
Michigan:  Battle Creek, Flint, Grand Rapids, Meadowbrook, Pine Lake and Red Run
NH:  John Cain, Greate Bay
NY:  Moonbrook, St. Albans
NC:  Grove Park Inn
OH:  Congress Lake, CC of Ashland, East Liverpool, Sylvania and Toledo
PA:  Berkshire, Chartiers, Green Valley (NLE), Indiana, PSU Blue, Philmont (N), Youghiogheny
RI:  Agawam Hunt, Pawtucket
VT:  Shelburne Farms

[Adam_F_Collins]

Also St. Johnsbury in Vermont...

[Kyle Harris]

Jordan,

Go back a bit in the threads and you can see some pictures I posted of Woodway. PSU White is also has nine Willie Park holes (See My Home Course).

Let's not forget Glen Ridge Country Club in Glen Ridge, NJ.

If you'd like, you can print this out, the left two columns are all in North America.



Here's Woodway's 7th Hole from the landing zone.



The 2nd Hole at Glen Ridge.



The attitude you encountered is not new, and just mounts to my frustration over the lack of recognition Park gets in these parts. He truly is one of the top five architects of all time and is SOLELY responsible for bringing well-designed golf inland from the links.

[michael j fay]

CC of Farmington Ct is an Emmett not a Park. There are about seven remaining Emmett holes at Farmington, Park was not there.

[Ryan Farrow]

Jordan, I don't know if you remember me telling you this but I worked at a Willie Park course last summer. Right then you could have shut the man down. Showing him that the 16 year old caddy knows what he is talking about.

[Wayne_Kozun]

Weston G&CC in Toronto, where Arnold Palmer won his first PGA event 51 years ago, is a Willie Park Jr. design.

I believe Calgary G&CC, Ottawa Hunt Club, Royal Quebec, Beaconsfield and Laval sur le lac are other examples of his work in Canada, in addition to the previously mentioned Mt. Bruno.

[Willie_Dow]

Sorry !  But I must ask how many of these courses were originally laid out by Willie as nine holers ?

[T_MacWood]

Willie
I think New Bedford was a nine, I know Ashland, Defiance, Marion, East Liverpool and Penn State were nine. Maybe Indiana, Pa.

[Doug Braunsdorf]

Re: The 2nd at Glen Ridge, Kyle's picture doesn't do justice to the complexity and internal contour of that green.  There have to be 4 or 5 distinct areas within the green where holes can be located.  Even in March, when we toured the course, it was amazing to see how difficult it was to advance the golf ball between different locations on the green, if you were not in the proper part of the green to putt to a certain hole location.  
Seeing that the hole plays at about 135 yards if I recall correctly, it is most certainly a fair proposition, as most golfers would be coming in with short irons or wedges.  

The more Willie Park, Jr., I see, the more respect I have for the strategies woven into his designs, and the more I chomp at the bit to be able to play another Park course.  

I do plan on getting over to Philmont on Thursday after work.  

[Kyle Harris]

Willie
I think New Bedford was a nine, I know Ashland, Defiance, Marion, East Liverpool and Penn State were nine. Maybe Indiana, Pa.

Tom,

Indiana, PA is currently an 18 hole course and based on what I've seen I would imagine they were all built at the same time.

PSU White had nine holes initially, to which Park added 9 and also significantly upgraded the original nine with all new greens and hazards. The only thing Park really left intact was the routing. Unfortunately, these holes have been lost to development so anything at this point is really just speculation.

[JMorgan]

PSU White had nine holes initially, to which Park added 9 and also significantly upgraded the original nine with all new greens and hazards. The only thing Park really left intact was the routing. Unfortunately, these holes have been lost to development so anything at this point is really just speculation.

RD Pryde designed the original nine at PSU White.  He also had a hand in New Haven CC, which Park redesigned after Raynor turned down the job (not enough to work with). NHCC also got a commitment from Ross, but the club later determined that he was "overextended."

[Craig Sweet]

Shelburne Farms in Vermont? Was this course ever built? if so, is it still there today?

[Kyle Harris]

PSU White had nine holes initially, to which Park added 9 and also significantly upgraded the original nine with all new greens and hazards. The only thing Park really left intact was the routing. Unfortunately, these holes have been lost to development so anything at this point is really just speculation.

RD Pryde designed the original nine at PSU White.  He also had a hand in New Haven CC, which Park redesigned after Raynor turned down the job (not enough to work with). NHCC also got a commitment from Ross, but the club later determined that he was "overextended."

Pryde also had assistance from the golf coach at the time, Bob "Pop" Rutherford. Interesting that the only routing change to the Pryde nine was the relocation of a par 3 that probably played much like the second at Glen Ridge or the third at Philmont North.

Could very well turn out to be a Park "smoking gun" Par 3.

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