Comments on Hoylake

[Jeff_Mingay]

The following excerpt is from Bob Weeks' blog, today.

Weeks is editor of SCOREGolf, Canada's national golf magazine. He's also a commentator covering the Open for TSN (The Sports Network) in Canada.

"I got my first look at Royal Liverpool today and it appears dry and dusty. They’ve had an unusual heat wave here for the last little while and that’s baked out the course. It’s actually so hot here that they said the all-time record high for the United Kingdom – 38.5 – cold be equaled in the next few days. It was about 33 or 34 today, but no humidity, which made it nice

That, of course, has affected the course. It’s playing fast and hard, in fact, almost too fast and hard.

Stephen Ames, whom I chatted with after his round today, told me today he was hitting 360-yard drives that just bounded and bounded. He said it’s really almost become a target golf course, more so that what’s called target golf in North America. You have to land you ball on a certain spot to ensure that it bounces the right distance.

Stephen also said that because it’s been so dry, the rough is really wispy but that’s sometimes tougher than when it’s thick. Now you feel as if you have a chance to play a big shot from there, but nine times out of 10, you’re still not going to be able to control the ball, so it will still be a hazard.

The greens are also unusual. Three were re-done by Donald Steele and they’re quite different from the other 15 in that they are rolling and have swales, where the originals are all pretty much flat. There’s also been some talk that the speeds are different and that that might not have been an accident i.e. the course is playing so easy in other ways, this is how they’re going to combat low scoring."

[Adam Clayman]

Jeff, Thanks for the reports.

Michaud's Shinnecock U.S. open comes to mind.
I'm still chuckeling at the assertions that the grass was dead.

Doesn't grass turn purple before it turns brown?

[ForkaB]

Doesn't grass turn purple before it turns brown?

Not in Old Blightly, Adam.  I watched linksland grass turn from green to brown last week, and nary a purple hue was to be seen.
 
Maybe you were confusing heather with grass.  The magic mushrooms can do that to you, ya know....

Rich

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

It is funny how Donald Steele can write like he gets it but his courses and the cahnges he makes to existing courses show he really does not get it at all. He is the Rees Jones of the UK.

[peter_p]

Heard they are putting the tent village in the driving range. Is that going to affect golfers who try to cut the dogleg on #1, now #3?

[Bill_McBride]

Peter:  "INCOMING!!!"  

Check your IM.

[Adam Clayman]

Rihc, You,re right, it's must be Poa that turns a lovely Hendrix haze of purple.

And for the record, I loathe Mushrooms. Unless they are used for design purposes.

[ForkaB]

Clayman44

After I wrote that, I remembered that when brown and in bright sunlight, links grasses develop a purplish sheen or haze, like a ghostly mirage.

And, as a matter of fact, I'd be surprised if Hendrix didn't play golf when he lived in the UK.....

[Tony_Muldoon]

The BBC have an interview with the Greenkeeper. Some excerpts.

"They are perhaps about a foot slower than the R&A (the championship's organisers) would want them next week but that is fine at this stage because we can cut them shorter."
More worrying is the state of the greens if the dry (and drying) weather continues.
 

"The concern is if we get another week of dry, sunny weather we will have to start watering (the greens). You never get the speed back in them then, no matter how short you cut them."
The speed of the greens at Open Championships is always a subject of some contention, particularly with American-based golfers who are used to much faster putting surfaces in the US.
Gilholm agrees that British greens are slower - "about two to two and a half feet slower on the stimp meter" - but says there are practical reasons for this.
"Our greens are slower but they are also firmer. So while putts run faster in the States, their greens are more receptive," he said.
"The other factor is wind. We could not have them as quick as they do at the Masters or US Open because if the ball starts moving on the greens the R&A would be forced to abandon play."
Gilholm, who was second in command at Muirfield in 2002, also admitted there was a different rationale to setting up an Open course to the more traditionally punishing US Open lay-outs.
"We'd rather see birdies than people really struggling," he said.

[BCrosby]

This is going to be good stuff.

Jones once said that one of the things he missed most about links golf was hearing the greens crunch beneath his feet.

Sounds like that's what we may get this year.

Can't wait.

Bob

[ForkaB]

Jones once said that one of the things he missed most about links golf was hearing the greens crunch beneath his feet.

One of the sad thing about soft spikes is that they don't "crunch."

[BCrosby]

"Our greens are slower but they are also firmer. So while putts run faster in the States, their greens are more receptive," - Hoylake Greenskeeper

The guy has it figured out. Why do Americans have such a hard time with the Hoylake maintenance meld? (The TEP copyright is reserved.) I mean, what's not to like?

Slow but firm allows severely contoured greens to be puttable, requires great shot-making to hold anything near pins, makes for healthier grass and lowers maintenance costs.

At Harvard Business School the technical name for that is win/win.

Bob

[Philippe Binette]

Just hope that the greens won't be too fast so if a 40 mph wind shows up, the babies (tour players) will have to go in the clubhouse because the ball would be moving on the greens

[Mike_Cirba]

The firm and fast conditions will be very cool, I'm certain.

However, temps are s'posed to be moderate, and the winds, in the words of Peter Alliss, won't be much more than a "mild zephyr" in the 10mph range.  So, whatever teeth Hoylake has will likely not yield much more than a nibble this week.

[ForkaB]

Bob

You can get UK greens rock hard AND close to typical PGAT speeds (~12), but it takes a lot of agronomic knowledge and skill and a bit of luck.

I've only seen it a handful of times in my 25-30 years of playing links golf, but when it happens "win/win" does not do it justice.  It is ecstasy (the state of mind, not the drug), and Phillippe is right--95% of the pros would absolutely hate it.

It could be that Hoylake is playing it a bit cautious this year, but I'll reserve judgement until after I see for myself tomorrow.

[Adam Clayman]

Has the open always been played at this time of year?

Was it later in August back in the day?

[Eric Franzen]

Has the open always been played at this time of year?

Was it later in August back in the day?

The first Open was played on the 17th of October. The third one in mid-September.

[Paul_Turner]

Has noboby said how ugly it is?

[David_Tepper]

Paul Turner -

I have read a number of articles & heard several interviews that have commented how unattractive the course is visually. I don't recall anyone using the word ugly however.

Listen to the Kessler/Klein interview linked on this board.

DT

[Greg Holland]

From espn.com, Tiger may not use his driver.

"The golf course is definitely fast," said Woods, a two-time winner and the defending champion. "It's hard. It's a little bit slower the last couple of days because obviously they're putting some water on it, trying to keep it alive. But overall it's going to be a fantastic challenge this week to play a golf course this fast. We don't get a chance to do this very often, but when we do, it sure brings back shot making and creativity back in the game."

Something Woods loves.

"It's not like you can go out there and hit a marginal shot and expect it to be OK," he said. "You come in with the wrong spin in the fairways or even on the greens, you're going to pay a consequence of that."

Many players have struggled getting shots to stick on the par-3 sixth and ninth greens.

"It's going to be really hard to get it close," Woods said. "A lot of good shots here downwind are going to be 20, 30, 40 feet away."

[George Pazin]

"Our greens are slower but they are also firmer. So while putts run faster in the States, their greens are more receptive," - Hoylake Greenskeeper

The guy has it figured out. Why do Americans have such a hard time with the Hoylake maintenance meld? (The TEP copyright is reserved.) I mean, what's not to like?

Slow but firm allows severely contoured greens to be puttable, requires great shot-making to hold anything near pins, makes for healthier grass and lowers maintenance costs.

At Harvard Business School the technical name for that is win/win.

Bob

Bob -

I've said it before, but I'll say it again:

Golfers don't want to play a harder course, they want others to think they are playing a hard course. Your average golfer struggles with anything, so he probably can't tell the difference between firm and fast and soft and fast, or at least views them as comparable.

Low handicappers, but not top amateur or pro level, like to show off their skills to the rest of us, but they don't want to be embarassed by firm, truly difficult conditions that require real shotmaking.

Like most things in life, it's all about being a second hander.

[Paul_Turner]

One thing about Hoylake...because it's mainly so flat, the course can be lightening fast and not become fluky.

[Tony_Muldoon]

WOw no need to stay home tommorrow, check this out.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/golf/default.stm


The BBC will provide live broadband streaming of this year's Open at Royal Liverpool for the first time.
The service, a simulcast of the BBC's live terrestrial broadcast and digital interactive feeds, will be available on the sport site.

[Tom Huckaby]

Tony - muchas gracias for pointing that out... I know what one window will be doing tomorrow morning...

 

[Tony_Muldoon]

Tom, we'll miss you here on GCA

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