Which less than great course should Ran profile?

[Tom Huckaby]

OK, here's one.  Man that Ran sure is a sourpuss.  From Moonah Course at National Golf Club, Australia:


While this was another Prairie Dunes or Sand Hills situation in that numerous holes could be found, invariably any routing would yield a less than ideal hole or two, given such wild topography. (See 14 at Ballybunion, or 4 at The European Club or 2 at County Sligo as examples of holes you just have to put up with).

 

[Tim Pitner]

Take your pick from Ran's Bandon Dunes review...

"Will the first course at Bandon Dunes stand up to the scrutiny in the way that Pebble Beach and Cypress Point have for decades? No."

"Bandon's design weakness lies in the way the bunkers and surrounds often aren't fully and compellingly integrated together."

"...the authors must question the clumsy routing."

"Regardless, Kidd continues to refine Bandon Dunes (ironically, perhaps a sign that it wasn't as good as everyone initially thought)."

I always thought the "clumsy routing" line was a bit unfair.  I think Ran was referring to the transitions between 1 and 2, 6 and 7, 8 and 9 and maybe 12 and 13.  While these aren't seamless, I don't see how they're much different from the transitions between 8 and 9, 12 and 13, and 13 and 14 at Pacific Dunes, which escape any criticism.  Kidd has re-worked 6 and 17 and perhaps other holes too (and now No. 1 for different reasons) so that criticism seems fair.  

[Tom Huckaby]

Tim - remember, Ran wrote that in 2002, well before there WAS a Pacific Dunes.

[Tim Pitner]

Tom,

I played Pacific Dunes in 2001.  And, my point really was that he seemed to be looking for something to criticize at Bandon Dunes and took a different approach at Pacific Dunes.  I could be wrong, but that's how I read his reviews.    

[Tom Huckaby]

Tim - understood - I just thought you were critiquing the BD review on its own, looking for comparison to PD - which of course couldn't have happened when the BD review was written.

You do make a good point... but one I won't touch with a 29 and a half foot pole, as it's a little too "hot-button" for my tastes.  Read that to mean I've fought over it WAY too many times previously in here.

 

[Tim Pitner]

Tom,

I think I understand what you mean.  Technical point--I think Pacific Dunes opened in 2000; it was open for general play when I was there in 2001.  I think Ran's review of Pacific Dunes was also in 2002.

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom,

I think I understand what you mean.  Technical point--I think Pacific Dunes opened in 2000; it was open for general play when I was there in 2001.  I think Ran's review of Pacific Dunes was also in 2002.

AHA!
Then I am patently full of shit.  Man time does fly.  Ok, Ran has no excuses for this.

TH, lofting that softball up there for someone to smack and use for a quote....

[Tim Leahy]

How about a review of Torrey Pines South prior to the Open scheduled there. On this site, this course always seems to start much debate and I'm sure we would all like to read Ran's review prior to the Open. Since he has already done Bethpage Black, I think Torrey would be a worthy comparison.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Your a year off in your dates.

Pacific Dunes opened for resort play in June of 2001. Some of us were fortunate to attend Tom Doak's Archipalooza event in March of that year, and we got to play the course, as it was still growing-in, but still very playable, and of course forever memorable.

It is my opinion that Ran's reviews that are the glue that hold this website and discussion group together. Their informative, insightful and 99% of the time, highly accurate from what one can expect when seeing a course for themselves before and after many times of playing it. His reviews don't rely on any  numbering system, which is also a fresh take on things.

If you really want to dig deep at a negative, look at the San Francisco Golf Club review.

You won't find it!

And that my friends should be the reason why John Kavanaugh should be sending me that copy of Robert Bain's Clans & Tartans of Scotland!

[Kenny Lee Puckett]

Fernandina Beach Municipal Golf Course - All three 9's.

 

JWK