Big green green fans...

[John Kavanaugh]

Are they a sign of either lazy or unfunded architecture.  I really have to question how a course can be considered great when you have big green green fans in the field of play..

[JESII]

Are you talking about circulation fans?

[John Kavanaugh]

Yes...I have only seen green ones...Like that makes them not there.

[JESII]

I wouldn't call it lazy or unfunded. In fact I see them on Fazio courses plenty.

[John Kavanaugh]

If they can be replaced with Sub-Air I would say the course is unfunded.  If the course can be designed in a manner that promotes natural circulation I would say it is not lazy.  I don't have a problem with second tier courses using big green green fans....Just like pre-fab clubhouses they have their place in golf.

[John Kavanaugh]

Are they a sign of either lazy or unfunded architecture.  I really have to question how a course can be considered great when you have big green green fans in the field of play..

John,

You are a good guy and I know you are posting this to get things riled up, but that is one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.

What would Kapalua be without big greens??  Would small greens on a course full of swirling, crazy winds really fit?  No!  What about ultra long course..You do not wanna have 3000 sq. ft. greens on a course that is 7500 yards long.  Obviously there are courses where small greens may fit, such as Harbour Town.  But, if you want to think big greens make lazy architecture, go ahead.

Oh my God...I wish you were old enough to remember Rose Ann A Danna Danna..

[JohnV]

I've seen it at a number of courses.  Perhaps if it is one or two green where the air circulation isn't quite as good as at others its ok.  If they are on almost every green, I'd say they might be trying to grow the wrong grass for the region.

[JohnV]

Oh my God...I wish you were old enough to remember Rose Ann A Danna Danna..

I thought the exact same thing.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

John,
I just recently played this Rees Jones course called Adulusia, where they had these Big Green Green Fans on each Big Green Green. They had them so they could ciruclate the hot air which this time of year seems to innundate the Coachella Valley.

I will also add that not only were the Big Green Greens awfully good for Rees Jones greens, and since I was wearing a green shirt that day, and since I'm a big guy, those fans also cooled my Big Green Body.

Signed,
Tommy Naccarato
Fort Lee, New Jersey

[Peter_Herreid]

John (or any of the St. Louis contigent)--

Last time (2003) I was at Bellerive, there were a number of these fans about.  Do you happen to know if their recent renovations incude the sub-air system, and are the fans still in use?

Thanks

[Jim Johnson]

I agree John.

I recall seeing photos on this site a few days back of a course with them; probably somewhere in the Coachella.

They looked awful...totally out-of-place.

JJ

[Steve Wilson]

Rather than Roseann Roseandana (sp?), it's Emily Littella of Flea Erection fame that Jordan needs to be acquainted with.

[John Kirk]

Shoal Creek has big brown green fans.

"What's all this talk about saving our national race horses?"

[Sean Leary]

Isn't the Big Green Fan the official  "Sub Air System" for the Hillbilly Tour? Mr. Hendren, can you please confirm....

[Bill_McBride]

The worst I've seen is at a very good private course in Ponte Vedra, Florida, Plantation Golf Club.  They made a commitment to bent grass ( ) in NE Florida some years ago, and the price they pay is three or four smaller oscillating fans on each green that go all spring, summer and fall.  This is somewhat unnerving as (1) they look like R2D2 and you keep looking for Princess Leia and Han Solo in the bunkers, and (2) they are always sort of in the way of wayward shots as all are in the rear and sides of the greens.

A nice Tifdwarf would putt almost as well and never a problem with circulation in that climate unless in a tree-shaded area.

[Joe Hancock]

Bill Squared has it summed up quite nicely.

Jordan, thank you for the side trip!

John K,

I don't think it's laziness or underfundedness (new word!) or even ego. I think it's a matter of lack of backbone by experts who don't dare go against percieved owner wishes (keep as many trees...etc.) When trees or wrong grasses are going to be an issue..and they always will...the right people have to take a stand and say something about it at the appropriate time.

Joe

[Nick Pozaric]

So you are saying a course should put sub-air systems in place to take care of greens for one month a year instead of putting fans in the place of them?  And saying if they dont do that they are lazy or unfunded?  I have heard a few stories of courses with sub-air still having big time greens issues and people saying the greens were "lost" even with those systems in place.  Sub-air is a wonderful invention but you have to decide where to draw the line on whether you need them or not.  There is a very nice Fazio course in TN that has some of the biggest fans I have ever seen surrounding several of the greens complexes,  I would hardly say they are lazy and definately not underfunded

[JohnV]

Colonial in Fort Worth has a lot of them.  They are trying to keep bent grass greens alive in Texas.

[Jim Johnson]

One of Tommy's photos from Andalusia which he posted awhile back...



Just plain weird looking. Where's R2D2?

JJ

[JR Potts]

Dubsdread has a big green fan on #16?  

Pardon my ignorance, but other than removing trees, is there an alternative to fans?  If so, what?

[James Bennett]

I saw two (and only two) such fans on my recent trip, and I have to say I understood immediately why they were used at this particular site.

Merion West, on the drop-shot par 3 of about 130 yards (I think it has been called a famous par 4 by some ), about the 6th hole I think.  Then the short par 4 about 280 yards (the 7th?).  These two greens are set in a low lying valley with no potential for circulation of air in the Philadelphia humidity.  One green has trees, the other doesn't.  Fans seem to be a great solution to try and counter what must be a rampant breeding ground for turf disease in a Philadelphia summer.

And they were big green, built-in fans.

James B

[John Kavanaugh]

I saw two (and only two) such fans on my recent trip, and I have to say I understood immediately why they were used at this particular site.

Merion West, on the drop-shot par 3 of about 130 yards (I think it has been called a famous par 4 by some ), about the 6th hole I think.  Then the short par 4 about 280 yards (the 7th?).  These two greens are set in a low lying valley with no potential for circulation of air in the Philadelphia humidity.  One green has trees, the other doesn't.  Fans seem to be a great solution to try and counter what must be a rampant breeding ground for turf disease in a Philadelphia summer.

And they were big green, built-in fans.

James B

Merion...Say it ain't so.  What other big names might surprise me...I wonder if big green fans could have prevented the building of alternate greens at Pine Valley.  Their circulation must be way down since opening day...

I will admit that at least until this morning I considered big green green fans a deal breaker.

[Mike Hendren]

Isn't the Big Green Fan the official  "Sub Air System" for the Hillbilly Tour? Mr. Hendren, can you please confirm....

Sean,

We actually paint them fluorescent orange so the deer hunters don't accidently shoot them from the window of their pickups.

Mike

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Isn't the Big Green Fan the official  "Sub Air System" for the Hillbilly Tour? Mr. Hendren, can you please confirm....

Sean,

We actually paint them fluorescent orange so the deer hunters don't accidently shoot them from the window of their pickups.

Mike

Mike,
You hillbillies should be putting those fans to better use in your outhouses!

[John_Cullum]

We actually paint them fluorescent orange so the deer hunters don't accidently shoot them from the window of their pickups.

I hate it when that happens.