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David Mulle

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Central Hazards
« on: June 16, 2006, 03:28:39 AM »
Last weekend I was in Arizona playing Apache Stronghold and the Talking Stick courses.  I loved Talking Stick North and Apache and they got me thinking about central hazards.

I do not think that there are many other architectural features that provide the same variety of strategic choices to all levels of players.  I am a mid-handicapper and I was playing with a low-handicapper.  Even though we ended up following different strategies, the central hazards consistently influenced each of our decisions of the tee.  

That was not the case with the doglegs.  For example, at Apache's 15th hole, the only real option I had was to hit three wood to the turn.  My playing partner decided to cut the corner with the driver.  He loved the hole but I did not find the hole as interesting as many of the other shots I confronted on the trip.  

Since one of the major challenges architects face is designing courses that appeal to golfers of different levels, is there a reason that we don't see more central hazards?   I am particularly surprised that central hazards aren't utilized more since I think they are one of the key factors that make the Old Course so interesting to all levels of golfers.

MikeJones

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Central Hazards
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2006, 07:31:49 AM »
Central hazards are great but are still heavily dependent on the distance they are from the tee. For example if it was in a position where you couldn't carry it but your low handicap friend could, he could just ignore it, blast it over and continue on his merry way. You on the other hand would have to make a decision about whether to play short or to the side of it.

Diagonal hazards generally offer a similar challenge to players no matter what their distance capability and for this reason are probably used more often.

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Central Hazards
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2006, 07:52:32 AM »
David

I'm sure many here would like your comments on the current conditions at Apache Stronghold. Let us know. Thanks.

Steve
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
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Richard Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Central Hazards
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2006, 09:37:39 AM »
Mike,
longer hitters generally have an advantage on doglegs in that depending on how far from the tee the dogleg is, then they either can reach the dogleg or only need an iron as opposed to a driver.
Long hitters are always going to have an advantage whatever the hazard as long as they hit it straight.If they don't it just goes further into the crap.
I agree with David in that there are too few central hazards.
Could this be people think that if they hit the middle of the fairway they shouldn't be punished as it isn't fair. If you know its there don't hit it at the bloody thing. There is nothing unfair about that.

David Mulle

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Central Hazards
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2006, 10:14:04 AM »
Mike,
    I agree with your comments about diagonal hazards.  I did not include them in my post because (1) diagonal hazards seem to be utilized with more frequency than central hazards and my question was tied to the lack of central hazards on most courses and (2) it seems to me that an architect is limited in the number of times that they can use a diagonal hazards.  If every hole had a diagonal hazard the course would seem repetitive.  But an architect could use central hazards on many of the holes and still maintain variety.  

Steve,
    The conditioning at Apache Stronghold was very frustrating.  It was the sloooowest and softest course I can ever remember playing.  The greens and the areas around the greens were severely overwatered.  There were at least three occassions when I was short of the green in the middle of the fairway and it was a borderline  call about whether I was in casual water.  I loved the layout and the whole time I was playing Talking Stick I was wishing that I could have played Apache Stronghold in similar conditions.

Yannick Pilon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Central Hazards
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2006, 04:13:05 PM »
Two of the reasons I feel central hazards are not used as much as they should are:

1.  There are too many golfers who still think that when they hit a perfect drive down the middle of the fairway, they should not be rewarded by a bunker shot! Yes, I know, its stupid.  But that's been my experience....

2. The need for more space to accomodate the feature makes it tough to use for an architect, unless he is working with a piece of land with ample room to spare.

I, for one, would like to see and use the feature more often....  But I am working on that for one of our next projects in Quebec....
www.yannickpilongolf.com - Golf Course Architecture, Quebec, Canada

David Mulle

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Central Hazards
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2006, 05:25:05 PM »
Yannick,
Thanks.  The extra space required is something that I would not have thought of but it makes perfect sense.