Winged Foot 1974 - Setting Up

[Neil Regan]

From the USGA magazine.

   The legend is largely true, that the Open was played on a course very similar to everyday play.
Except, of course, for the 6-inch grass.
   GCA folks please note: some well known Tillinghast bunkers are actually not.

  Look closely at the aerials. Significant shrunken green-space can be clearly. Yet this shrinkage dated to c1932.
How lucky and good was the club, that the lost areas were not destroyed, merely grassed longer.

Some of these areas have been restored in recent years, and will provide some of next week's best pins.
Look especially at #14. More on that soon.

[Phil_the_Author]

Hi Neil,

I'm almost as excited as you are about the upcoming Open and am looking forward to seeing how the USGA uses and the players adapt to the "refound greens."

I know, if other don't, that you have personally invested a great deal of time researching this and seeing the recovery come to pass. It is not as simple a thing as cutting some grass shorter and making it a green.

I will never forget that afternoon in the clubhouse where you first shared the dramatic 2 photos of teh 18th green, one with and one without the golf cart. A blind person could see the dramatic difference. I would love for you to post those on here for others to see as well.

I am also deeply interested in seeing how the setup and especially the choice of pin positions will challenge the players. I know that you must be especially pleased at the green speeds that the USGA is looking to maintain and hold to as these will certainly allow for many an intriguing hole site.

I'm looking forward to saying hello next week.

[Neil Regan]

I will never forget that afternoon in the clubhouse where you first shared the dramatic 2 photos of the 18th green, one with and one without the golf cart.
A blind person could see the dramatic difference.
I would love for you to post those on here for others to see as well.

Phil,

  Here it is. The picture from 2004 is distorted a bit by the zoom, but not deceptively.

[John Chilver-Stainer]

A very revealing article – quoting :

…. And on the fifth a bunker was built in front of the green to end the possibility of bouncing a shot on.. « This was one of the weak holes, » (George) Fazio says, «  you could bounce the ball in. » …


I don’t suppose the bunker will make much difference to the cross haired precision pros but that’s ended the bump and run shot for the rest of the ordinary mortals. Maybe they should let the semirough grow round the front of the greens as well to really make sure the balls don’t bounce on !!

The 2 pictures really reveal the alterations to the course playability by the new maintenance practises. The now probably trendy golfers in their knickerbockers from 1928 are all putting on large smooth surfaces where the collar has been cut back into the hills to allow the ball to works it's way back in.

The 2004 picture has someone who was caught with a marginal shot in the semi rough, and has his lob wedge out chipping it on with much less  "running" surface to work with.

It would be interesting to see the same picture for the US Open set up 2006.

[Gene Greco]

Neil:

   Are these just a sample of the photos you allowed the Greens Committee to "stumble" across prior to many of their meetings???

Loved seeing them with you in Doug La Rue Smith's office prior to any of the changes.

Pretty dramatic stuff - and ultimately very effective.

[John Chilver-Stainer]

Neil

The 1928 picture is full of dated trends apart from the knickerbockers and the flat caps.
I was trying to find the pin position and saw a tall sign in the background with Nr. 18 on it – but it can’t be the « pin » as one of the caddy appears to be holding a stick with a wicker basket mounted on it. Would the tall sign be indicating the direction for a blind approach  - it would appear to be offline though?

[Chris Moore]

Man those green photos are revealing.  Help a dumb Tennessee/Louisiana boy who has never seen a golf course in the Northeast:  Has the old green at No. 18 been restored to that tremendous size and delicious character, or are we going to see the smaller, less dramatic version?

[Mike_Sweeney]

Has the old green at No. 18 been restored to that tremendous size and delicious character, or are we going to see the smaller, less dramatic version?

It will be somewhere in between. The lasts photo I have is
of the Amateur, and it was expanded since then.
Perhaps Neil can post and updated one?

For Mayday:

In the NYT's today, Phil Mickelson is quoted talking about WINGED FOOTS 10 DOG LEGS, "You have to carve your tee shots with the angle of the hole. That's what makes it (Winged Foot) very challenging."

[John Foley]

Neil,

Grreat pics & articel!!!!

Could the old 18 green be maintained at current US Open speeds?

[mike_malone]

 Mike Sweeney,

    I sure hope you aren't basing your opinions on anything Phil Mickelson is saying . I thought his discussion of whether he will use one or two drivers was more interesting.( My wife gets the Times!) .If there were truly classic doglegs  at WFW I think he would be going with two drivers, no question.

[Geoffrey Childs]

Neil

Your tireless efforts on behalf or Winged Foot are so apparent.

The greens expansions took what were among the handful of best greens in golf and made them exponentially better.

I hope your future meetings regarding the reclaiming of green space on some of the other holes like #2 east are successful
 and you don't have to deal with too many members who think it will make the course too easy (as we heard the other day)  

[Phil_the_Author]

Bill, you asked, "Can we find a really old (1926ish?) aerial of the WF complex?"

The August 1929 issue of Golf Illustrated gave a very comprehensive coverage of both the Open and Winged Foot itself. It also included aerial photographs of every single hole (these were in the New York times as well) with dotted lines showing every shot played by Espinoza and Jones during the Monday playoff.

I can't manage to upload them onto the site ao I'll email the issue to you and see if maybe you can do it.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Mike Sweeney,

    I sure hope you aren't basing your opinions on anything Phil Mickelson is saying . I thought his discussion of whether he will use one or two drivers was more interesting.

If there were truly classic doglegs at WFW I think he would be going with two drivers, no question.

Mayday,

What's the difference between a "classic dogleg", a "Winged Foot" dogleg, and a "regular or standard" dogleg ?

[Mike_Cirba]

Neil,

That comparison showing the green shrinkage on 18 is one of the most dramatic, instructional, and enlightening things I've ever seen to illustrate the too-common malady, and I would think this type of graphic depiction could help restorationists in other clubs to prove a point.

If this type of severe shrinkage can happen at a golf-rich club like Winged Foot, then it certainly can happen anywere.  Not only that but it is a wonderful depiction of how interesting and in some cases severe some of the classic course greens were, even at the obviously higher cut.  Makes one wonder why they'd want to putt on a faster, flatter green by comparison.

Nicely done!  

[Troy Alderson]

Neil,

Grreat pics & articel!!!!

Could the old 18 green be maintained at current US Open speeds?

First, I think the old 18 green could be maintained at current speeds.  The pin does not have to be around the extreme slopes.  With the money Winged Foot has, you would think they could expand the greens back out with an aggressive aeration and sand topdressing program.

Second, the old 18 green appears to blend into the surrounding turf cuts.  There do not appear to be delineations between what is the green, approach, and fairway.  I see that a lot with older pictures of golf courses.

Troy