[Glenn Spencer]

Everyone is talking about distance and I think it is a large problem myself. What have the classics done to themselves since say, the Nicklaus era, 59 and beyond? I would like anyone that has exact yardages from this era to show them, from any good golf course, not just Major Sites. Also, the yardages from today. The courses are adding yardage for some reason, let's see it on paper and see if it doesn't shock some people into thinking differently about distance.

[peter_mcknight]

I don't have the exact card of the course for Baltusrol for 1967, but it played at 7015 yards par 70.  I do have the one for 1980 when it played at 7076 yards par 70.

1967--7015 yards, par 70
1980--7076 yards, par 70
1993--7152 yards, par 70
2000--7116 yards, par 70 (US Amateur)
2005--7392 yards, par 70

1980 Card of the Course:
465/377/438/194/388/470/470/374/205
454/428/193/393/409/430/216/630/542

2005 Card of the Course
478/379/503/194/423/482/505/380/212
460/440/218/424/430/430/230/650/554


Winged Foot's yardage history is as follows:

1959--6881 yards, par 70
1974--6961 yards, par 70
1984--6930 yards, par 70
1997--6987 yards, par 70 (USPGA)
2004--7266 yards, par 70 (US Amateur)
2006--7264 yards, par 70

1974 Card of the Course
446/411/216/460/515/324/166/442/466
190/382/535/212/435/417/452/444/448

2006 Card of the Course
450/453/216/469/515/321/162/475/514
188/396/640/214/458/416/478/449/450

[Glenn Spencer]

Thanks Peter! In each case, the courses have gained about 400 yards. Most of the gains coming from something that was played after 1999. The Upper course hosted the Amateur in 2000 at Baltusrol, so everything has gained yardage. These are inland courses, Pebble Beach does not seem to need to add yardage, The Ocean Course is hard to follow, but I know they never use the absolute back tees. Even 'tricky' Olympic has been forced to add yardage for an upcoming tournament. The proof is in the pudding, the major yardage additions have all come from 99 on. Does anyone have anything on Oakmont from 62 as compared to the next US Open yardage. I bet that would be huge gain or even the 03 Amateur yardage.

[Jay Flemma]

My winged foot open preview piece is up at www.cybergolf.com.  Thanks to Matt Ward for some expert analysis.  In short, Tiger may have an advantage with the "graded rough."   Some people I know think the winning score may be fairly close to the aggregate scoring record for an Open...as much as -6 to -7 (273-274).

[Patrick_Mucci]

Peter McKnight,

Where did you get the 1967 Baltusrol yardages from ?

Didn't # 1 and # 7 play from tees in front of the par 5 tees ?

And, didn't the same thing happen at WFW on the 9th hole where the par 4 tees were well forward of the par 5 tees ?

On # 16 I think the tees were within 10-20 yards of each other.

I think your yardages may be off.

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