Changes To Kingsley Club

[Jlyon]

I had the pleasure of playing two rounds at Kingsley over the Easter weekend.  The greens wintered in great shape.  Dan Lucas and his team have been busy beavers this winter.  They removed all of the trees between the 10th and 18th fairways and two new bunkers have been shaped into the right side landing zone just barely into the fairway at 250 yards.  On 11, most of the trees between 11 and 17/18 and all of the trees behind the green have been removed.  All of the saplings to the left of the 12 fairway and most of the trees behind 12 have been removed.  The trees between the 14th green and 15 tee have been removed and a new bunker now exists just behind the 14th green.   The trees on the left and right side of the 17th fairway have been greatly reduced.  Two new bunkers have been shaped into the right side on 18 at about 240yds.

The tree removal and new bunkers look fantastic.  The only bunker that I am uncertain about is the new one behind the 14th green.  I'll wait until the sand is added to pass final judgement.  With the changes, 10/11/18 look and feel much more like the much praised front 9 with minimal changes to each of the hole designs.   The wind will now be much more of a factor on 10, 11, 17, 18.    

[RSLivingston_III]

[ed_getka]

WOW!!!! Thanks for posting. I can't wait to get out there in September. Was any regrading done on #18 fairway? It looks a little different in the photo above, or that may just be the foreshortening effect.

[Joe Hancock]

John,

You don't like the position of the bunker on #14, or the looks, or is it something else?

Mike shaped the bunker in on 14 last fall, then Mingay and I were bored a few weeks ago so we met up at Kingsley (Nice to meet  you finally, Jeff!) and had a chunking party. We took patches of fescue from the area between 10 and 18 and chunked in the bunker, and I can't wait to see how rugged that will look once it grows out a bit.

As far as the other work....the biggest impact will be in the transition from front nine to back nine, IMO. Standing on the tenth tee (there's a new back tee on 10 as well ) you don't have that "where did these trees come from" feeling any more. It's wide open with nasty little strategic bunkers being the focal point of you tee shot planning. Elevan has a much more open feel as well.

The trees behind 17 green are now gone, and gives the green an almost "skyline" feel from the lower part of the fairway. It will be an even more confounding approach shot than it already was.

18 looks completely open now. The tree line on the left was greatly reduced and, once again, some new nasty bunkers will be the primary strategic element. I think many players will foolishly play more to the right now with the trees gone. We'll see!

Once again, I think the biggest impact of these changes is in the transitional feel when you come from 9 to 10, and then again on 17 and 18. If you felt before that you were playing "typical tree lined Northern Michigan golf" on the back nine, that feeling has all but disappeared and the course flows much better in maintaining the emotions and playing elements of the front nine.

And I agree.....good job Dan and fellows up at Kingsley!

Joe

[Ken Fry]

If you felt before that you were playing "typical tree lined Northern Michigan golf" on the back nine, that feeling has all but disappeared and the course flows much better in maintaining the emotions and playing elements of the front nine.
Joe

Even without the tree removal, I thought there was nothing at Kingsley that gave the impression of "typical Northern Michigan golf."  The course is so good and parellels the same feeling at Crystal Downs of the open front side and more tree lined back.

Thanks for posting the picture of #18.  If anyone has photos showing the rest of the tree removal, please get them up.  I can't wait to get back to see the changes.

Joe,

You were bored a few weeks ago so you drive up to Kingsley to lay sod??  You're a sick man....

Ken

[ed_getka]

I want summer to be over with NOW. More pix please. One of the best courses of the modern era sounds to have gotten better.

[RJ_Daley]

John, are you saying that the new bunkers on 18 will be in that high corner, sort of below the flag pole and that line of carts in the lot?  It looks like there is grading and preparation there and also nearer the tee up the right with a couple of smallish bunkers near that dirt path.  Thus, there will be a bit of a knoll plateau of FW short of the 240 bunkers, but more of a blind shot going at the green from the right.  How far is it to the green from up there on that knoll?  Looks like about 175-80ish.  Can a shot bound into the green from there - landing short left and take a bounce on the slope to the right into the green?

It really seems like a bold decision to scrap the trees, but as stated above, it moves away from the tree lined corridor feel, which I like and is in keeping with much of the front 9.  I'll bet Dan will really shine that hillside up with Michigan prairie native.

[Jlyon]

Ed, I have a lot of fun memories playing recovery shots from behind the 14th green.  Adding the bunker will be very different.   I used to be able to die the ball along the slope behind the green and let it trickle onto the right level.  A new learning experience or possibly another don't go there bunker like behind the par 5 seventh.  I love how the 15th tee looks as you are coming down the 14th fairway and I really like the front nine feel (being able to see other groups hit approach shots on adjacent greens).  From the 18th tee you can now see 10, 11, and 17 approach shots.  Also from the 15 tee you can now see the do or die results of a long second shot into the par 5 14th.  The sod work on the new bunkers (5 new ones on the back nine) is impressive.

[ed_getka]

John,
   What are you doing hitting shots OVER greens? Bunkers behind #7 and #14 certainly qualify as hazards with the way those greens will be working away from you.

[Jlyon]

RJ, you are exactly correct they are just below the flagpole in the picture.  It did not look like much earth was moved except to excavate the bunkers.  There used to be a briar patch near one of the bunkers so I will not be sorry to see that go.   I believe that the bunker shots will be in the 130-140 range.  I find that the right side of 18 is the best angle to play to the front of the green allowing you to hit the ball into the front left slope short of the green then roll on; hitting to the center or back is very difficult from that angle.  The left side blind shot into the center or back is the best angle to attach the back/center of 18.  I will not have a good idea of how difficult the lip will be to deal with until filled with sand.

Also if you notice from Ralph's picture, the left side of 18 has been cleared (no more briar patches).  Dan Lucas told me that there used to be a small gravel vein there that was excavated by prior owners and they are trying to figure out how to make it fit in with the topography.

[Jlyon]

Ed, when dan forgets to mow the lush fairway on 14,  and small amount of grass   gets between my 4 iron and the ball from 210yds then I tend to fly over the green .

[RSLivingston_III]

[ed_getka]

Thanks for the picture Ralph. From the angle you show it almost makes #18 approach look like an easy shot. Of course we know that isn't true. It will be interesting to hear if golfers unfamiliar with the course will try to play further right off the tee on #18. Unless you get hit the ball Phil M/Tiger height into the green, a lot of shots will end up in the left bunker coming from the right side.
   
John,
    Don't go blaming Dan for your 210yd 4irons? If I hit my 4iron 210 yards I don't care where it ends up!

[RSLivingston_III]

One more....

[RSLivingston_III]

Last one,

[Joe Hancock]

OK Ralph.....

I gotta put ya on the spot, since you obviously saw all the work!

What do you think?

Joe

[ed_getka]

Any plans afoot to build the clubhouse?

[RSLivingston_III]

Joe,
Can't wait until June(?) to see it fairly well grown-in.
For me, the right side is the better side to come into the 10th green. The new bunkering will add much to the importance of my driving accuracy. The wind will be a much bigger factor.
11 green is wonderful sitting out there in the open. The visibilty of the land contours, I think, add to the intimidation of the shot.
The tree clearing on the left of 12 helps with the visual of playing down through a valley. There might be more saved shots now.
The bunker behind 14 will be an interesting challenge if you are too aggressive into the green. I really love the visual coming over the ridge after my second and seeing this string of bunkers running along the right side and finishing behind.
17 with all the clearing is very stunning. The left bunkers on the tee shot sit out on that ridge now. The clearing in the valley shows more of the land form. It will also help when sitting out on the back porch of the cabins to see that fairway and watch players coming into the green. The clearing around the green really helps give it a platte look from down in the valley. I think it does mess with your depth perception on that third shot.
18, the wind is a bigger factor. The bunkers on the right will be exciting for the longer hitters. The clearing out of the left side is an improvement.
Glad Mike could get these revisions done to bring the back 9 closer to his original vision.
One thing I think they might add, a groomed path from the cabins to the first tee. I mentioned how much I liked getting up early, throwing my bag over my shoulder and wandering through the scruff to get there to get in a quick 9 before anyone else.
The path to Nirvava?

Ed,
How important do you think it is to have something more elaborate there?
I know they want to do one, but I also know they would rather build more cabins first. When there, I tend to function from out of the cabin. The clubhouse/proshop is in play for me about the way the proshop at Crystal Downs is, and the cabins are like the cottages.

Although I did hear a comment from the owner that with the clearing between 10 & 18 the view of the clubhouse from the 18th tee is... not quite what he wants.
I expect to hear more about this, later this year.

[ed_getka]

Ralph,
   Clubhouse is not important to me at all. I was just curious. The pro shop just looks a little out of place on that high spot. I think I would prefer it over on that high spot to the left of #9 above the parking lot up against the trees. That might not even be possible, as I am too absorbed by the course when I am there to worry about buildings.

[Joe Hancock]

One of the most important motivators for all the change was agronomics. Shade (therefore, moisture) is a friend of poa, and poa can outcompete the fine fescue in the shade.

Thanks, Ralph, for pointing out what you perceive to be the benefits of the tree removal. I think there's quite a few opinions that a new clubhouse would add to the facility, in an atmosphere kind of way.

Joe

[RSLivingston_III]

Sorry Joe, a minor brain fart from me, I just thought the agronomy reasons were a given in this group.

Ed, I wasn't asking to be critical, I am honestly curious how it rates in importance against the other revisions in the facility in most players minds. I know my perceptions are a bit different from most...

[ed_getka]

Ralph,
   I didn't think you were trying to be critical at all. As far as facilities are concerned all I ask for is 18 holes and an honor box and that would be just fine by me.

[Mike_DeVries]

John - thanks for the notes on the work at Kingsley.  
Ralph - thanks for posting the pictures.

There are 3 new bunkers on #10 and 3 new bunkers on #18.  The ones on 10 are spaced farther apart, with the short one higher up the hill on the ridge, the middle one a smaller pot at the distance of many drives, and the furthest one a large bunker that juts into the fairway and will catch many of the longer drives.  The cluster of 3 on 18 is all in the same group and work as one big complex - there will be more fairway on the right and the maintained rough will be moved out accordingly to simplify the mowing pattern.  No grading has been done in the fairway and the options of right vs. left and angles to the green are all still there and work very well (believe it or not, RJ, but not all the drives go down to the valley on the left   - which is a good angle to the middle and back, as (John?) stated).

I am really pleased with the look of the holes -- the ridge is a lot bigger than most will think -- and I really like the transition from front to back, which has been a common comment from some.  The look from the entrance drive as you make the turn above the range tee is great -- sets the tone for what Kingsley is all about right from the start.  Most importantly, Dan will have lots of light, air, and exposure to grow the best grass possible in all the areas of tree removal.

Look forward to hearing comments as people get out to see it.

Cheers!

Mike

[Andy Troeger]

I had the chance to play Kingsley for the first time this Sunday, 36H with Dan and Mike. For anyone who has the opportunity to make the trip there, it is well worthwhile and a wonderful treat.  

Since I had not played before the changes, my comments can only reflect what's there now. The new bunkers to the right of #10 are very well placed. I managed to hit two drives on within 2 feet of each other...in the new bunker (still GUR thankfully for me!).

The transition from the front to back (and then back to front again) is very well done. Having some trees on back nine I think does more to add variety to the holes and course than anything, and I did not see any disruption to the flow from one hole to another.

The pin was in the front on #14, so the new bunker was not as much of a concern as the slope to the left and the bunker right. I gave it a go both times around, and ended up right in front the first time not knowing what hazards surrounded the green, and in some long rough well right of everything the 2nd time once I'd seen everything  

One of the highlights of the day certainly had to be the first six holes of the second round, where I made an eagle  , birdie  , par  , bogey  , double  , and an X   (not in that order!)

[RJ_Daley]

Gee. take the eagle out of it, and I'd say you play just like me...