How long does it take to build a golf course?

[Mark Arata]

This is just for my own curiosity, but making an assumption that you have a piece of land that is zoned correctly and has no spotted owls or epa problems, how long does it take to build a golf course from the drawing board to the first day of play?

I am making the seemingly obvious (to me anyway) assumption that this might drastically differ from architect to architect, and also by what part of the world the course is built in, but I am just trying to get a ballpark idea of how long it takes. Thanks in advance for any replies.

[Brad Klein]

Crucial variable isn't the architect; it's the location, as climate has a lot to do with it, as does the character of the site. Up north, if you are unemcumbered by further regulatory permits and can start free and clear, you'd begin work in March and have some grass in the ground by Oct. 1, inc. most greens, with play starting the next summer. That assues no major blasting, tree removal is easy, wind and adverse weather don't impede, you have plenty of money, contractor is ideal, and suppliers have adeqaute stores of lab-tested materials on hand. It's a very optimistic schedule. In the south you'd have a better shot, but there's no average anything.

[Mark Arata]

Thanks Brad, I sort of knew that there were all kinds of variables that I didnt mention, I just wanted to have some sort of a point of reference. Thanks for your reply.

[Joe Hancock]

Throwing out the preliminaries as a variable, we built the Mines GC in 5 months plus one week.....that was from the day the first tree fell to the last day of seeding. It was 9 months after that day that the course officially opened.

That's in Michigan, so that includes 5 months of non-grass growing weather at minimum.

Joe

[Bill_McBride]

I would have to guess that permitting issues are the controlling factor just like we face in commercial construction.  It can be brutal, particularly when there are environmental issues or "anti-development" biases.

When we do a substantial project, design and permitting typically take as long as actual hard construction.  This can be very frustrating to our clients.

I imagine it could be worse in golf course design, permitting and construction.

[Brad Klein]

And don't think that permitting is a simple red light/green light/go sort of thing. Even when approvals are secured, there's a lot of onsite inspection, control, monitoring and so on that influencs every step of the way.

Notunsual: Wintonbury Hills in Ct. took 8 1/2 years from start to finish, including site change. Construction actually began March 2003 and we played five fully grassed holes by Nov. 2003, with full course opening in June 2004.

[Forrest Richardson]

From drawing board to planting...14 months is the quickest I have ever seen. We are about to do that here in Arizona, but I will admit that there were eight months of talking before the drawings.

[Dick Kirkpatrick]

It was exactly 14 months from first earth moved to the day of opening at Copetown Woods, here in the great frozen north.
Geographically and climatically the same as norther Michigan.

[Tom_Doak]

Mark:

A senior golf architect whom I shall not name once referred to the length of his projects as "three to five" [years], as in a prison sentence ...

That was from first contact to opening day.

In my own experience, it's been everything from 16 months [the Old course at Stonewall, on which much preliminary planning work was done prior to my becoming involved] to eight years at Riverfront.  And, of course, some projects last until infinity because they never get the funds together.

[paul cowley]

...we, Love Golf design, started a total re-do of Forest Oaks CC, in Greensboro, NC, the first week of Dec 2002....in preparation for holding the rescheduled PGA Tour event , the GGO, the following mid Oct.......by August, when we finished grassing our last fairway, we had received 82" of rain and were officially the wettest place on the east coast during that period........and, as a consequence, the Tour failed and was merged with the Futures, but only to decline further.
....I have heard there is some talk of a possible merger with the NHL and the Hooters but no, the show did go on as scheduled ...

[Mark Arata]

Great stuff, thanks for the info

I had sort of figured in my own mind that it would take about 30-36 months from start to finish. Seems like if you have a lot of earth to move, that is about right, but if you dont, it can be done in a much shorter time, depending on growing conditions, the nature of the land involved, etc.

Brad had stated earlier that the architect involved wouldnt have much effect on the time line, I was wondering why that is so, wouldnt a designer who build more along the lines of stadium style courses have a longer timeline than one who was more minimalist in nature? (providing all things were equal at the start, which I gather is quite a reach )

[ed_getka]

Mark,
  Keep in mind that Joe's example of the Mines GC had Joe out there virtually every day, along with Mike and the owner who were out there in the dirt. The guy who developed this project wanted the course done fast and it was cool to see him out there working and getting his hands dirty, and even cooler to see him out there with his extended family showing them around with obvious pride. I look forward to playing the finished product this fall when I get out that way.

[Tom_Doak]

Mark:  The heavy earthmoving doesn't add that much to a project -- a couple of months maybe, on a course the size of The Rawls Course in Texas.  Whether the site has to be cleared of trees probably has more effect on the construction time.

I figure the average "construction time" for creative input is more like 4-6 months, although in some climates those months can come either side of winter.

[Jim Thompson]

HOW MUCH DO YOU WANT TO PAY???

[Jeff_Brauer]

Mark,

Speaking just of construction time, and using "Big Time" Contractors like I usually do, I find construction to be 7-9 months on my typical project.  

You have to consider "working months" as Tom said, so in Minnesota (where they can work May until October we had a fall start, with only a month of clearing, all of the next summer (six months) and then a few months to finish the next summer (May until the last plant date of August 15) or about 11 actual working months, spread over almost 22 months of construction time.

In the south, we time the projects to a June1 planting start (it takes about six weeks, or until July 15) and start construction in October, figuring that we will lose a month or two in the winter to rains.  Some of it depends on what phase construction is - if clearing and earthmoving are done by winter rains, sometimes irrigation and drainage can continue, albeit at reduced pace, throughout the winter, reducing "lost time."

A few things have always amazed me about golf construction -

 How much work the big boys get done with about a dozen people in the shaping and irrigation phase (by planting there are dozens more folks working to finish the course) and how much faster they have gotten.

 How much hand work is required to finish a course of 160 Acres or so.

 How the 80-20 rule applies (as it does when we are getting plans out) - We think we are almost done, and the last 20% seems to drag on much more than it should.  I guess the primary reason is that rain requires total redo of finish work.

[Mark Arata]

This has all been very informative, thanks for all the input.

I seem to have been way off on my guess of 30-36 months, seems like you all are saying that the actual construction time is a 1/4 of that, which is really facsinating to me for some reason.

Thanks again.