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Andy Doyle

Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« on: January 20, 2006, 10:32:12 PM »
I try to do my homework before posting here, but I've been trying to sort through a bunch of posts in the archives, and I'm confused as hell.  I'm going to Hawaii in September for the first time and want to make the most out of this trip from a golf perspective, but would also like to return home without facing the prospect of divorce papers.

Here's the scenario:  Part business trip, part vacation with non-golfing spouse.  We will be in Honolulu for a professional meeting for 4 days.  My responsibilities at this meeting are limited, so I can probably slip away for 2 rounds if they are not too far from the city.  Where would you play?

After this meeting we plan to stay in Hawaii for 4 extra days for pure vacation.  My wife usually lets me do the planning, so as long as there is enough to keep her happy (gorgeous scenery, beautiful beaches, spas, hiking, sightseeing, etc.) I can fit in 2 or 3 rounds. What resort best fits these spouse-pleasing, must-play golfing requirements?

So, in a nutshell - where would you play within reasonable distance of Honolulu (2 rounds).  And, what would be your optimal 4 day plan outside of Honolulu for golf and marital survival?

TIA,

Andy

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2006, 10:41:41 PM »
Andy:  Your wife will like pretty much any Hawaiian resort.  If she wants to hike, Kauai is the right island; if she wants to lay on the beach, Maui or the Big Island are better.

I think Kapalua's Plantation Course (Maui) is the best course in the islands; never been to Makena but it looks beautiful in photos as well.  After that I'd vote for the courses in Kauai (Princeville or Kiele or Poipu) over the resort courses on the Big Island (Mauna Kea and Mauna Lani), but others will disagree.

Can't help you with Honolulu, I've never played on Oahu.

Andy Doyle

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2006, 11:14:55 PM »
Tom:

Thanks for your insight.  Definitely interested in Kapalua Plantation.  The images from this site and the tour coverage there put it right at the top of my list.  I am fascinated by the sheer scope of that course.  If Kapalua is a really wife-friendly resort, I woudn't mind staying there and playing multiple rounds.

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ChipOat

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2006, 11:15:57 PM »
Matt Ward will disagree with me, but Oahu CC is 15 minutes from downtown (you can take a taxi) and probably the best course on really hilly property I've ever played.  It's private but a phone call to the Pro Shop from the Mainland before your trip should get you on.

The others on Oahu are a 30-45 minute drive - I'll open the file and get back.

There's a GCA poster named Phil Wood who's lived on Oahu for 30+ years if you can find him on the DG list.

As for resorts, Tom Doak is right about Maui.  Lanai is gorgeous (the Lodge is ultra-romantic - stay there), the golf is pretty good (2 courses - 1 Norman and 1 Nicklaus) and the beach is fine by the Inn at Manele Bay.  You won't need a car as there's only 1 road and shuttle buses run between the Inn, the Lodge and the airport all day and all night.  There are at least 4 all-world resorts on the Kona Coast of the Big Island: Mauna Kea, Mauna Lani, Four Seasons and at least 1 other plus a large Hilton with 2 good courses and a dolphin pool.  A car is a good idea if you go that route.

I'd vote for Lanai as the best "a deux" option.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2006, 11:23:16 PM by chipoat »

Joel_Stewart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2006, 12:39:48 AM »
Taking your wife on a business trip is tough but you can succeed if you plan your trip correctly.   First, stay in a nice hotel so she has plenty to do and is comfortable while you are away.  For Honolulu try the Halekulani which is the best hotel on Oahu.  If thats out of the question, try the Kahala Mandarin.

On the first or second night, take her to a great restaurant.  I would take her to La Mer at the Halekulani hotel which is over $100 per person but will be a meal she will remember for the rest of her life.   Also try Alan Wongs which is not in the hotel area but is really interesting Hawaiian food.

Golf on Oahu is limited in quality but not quantity.  I would play either Royal Kunia which is close to the airport, Ko'olau which is famous for being tough (is suffering from poor conditioning) or Pete Dyes Luana Hills which is in a jungle.   The rest of the courses on Oahu are flat resort courses with nothing interesting.  Of course there is Waialae CC which hosts the Sony and is directly across from the Kahala Mandarin hotel which I mentioned above.  If you can find a member it would make your life much easier.  You may want to call the pro and see if he can work something out or the hotel to see if they can help you.   Its a Seth Raynor course, at least in name.

As for other islands, it depends on what you want to do as well as your wife.   Chip is correct about Lanai, although both hotels are now Four Seasons but I believe they have some packages.  Personally I would go to Kauai and play Princeville and then the Nicklaus course at the Marriott.

Maui would be my last choice of the 3.  

Evan Fleisher

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2006, 09:05:59 AM »
Agree with the above feedback...Maui might be your best bet for the spousal-happiness quotient.  A stay at Kapalua would work just fine, and they have three courses to choose from right there and the Makena and Wailea complexes are within an hour's drive.

As for Oahu, if you have access to private courses I might suggest Mid-Pacific Country Club, which is also supposed to be a Raynor, but not sure how much of it is still there.  Otherwise, Luana Hills might be a good call, but both courses are like 40+ minutes from Honolulu.

Have a GREAT trip! ...I doubt you will be disappointed by ANY courses or resorts you choose.
Born Rochester, MN. Grew up Miami, FL. Live Cleveland, OH. Handicap 13.2. Have 26 & 23 year old girls and wife of 29 years. I'm a Senior Supply Chain Business Analyst for Vitamix. Diehard walker, but tolerate cart riders! Love to travel, always have my sticks with me. Mollydooker for life!

Raymond

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2006, 03:32:24 PM »
If I could only stay in one Hawaiian resort before my Maker calls me home it would be Manele Bay on Lanai. The accomodations and service are extraordinary.The restaurants are excellent, my wife loved the spa, and I truely enjoyed the Nicklaus course (not so much the Norman). ]
The beach area is outstanding. The Spinner dolphins came into the bay a number of times and being able to swim in their midst was an unforgettable experience. We've been twice now and I can't wait to get back.

If you have 4 days maybe split 2 each between Maui (Kapalua) and Lanai (Manele Bay). That would be relatively easy.

Don Dinkmeyer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2006, 04:33:51 PM »
Another vote for Kauai - the nicklaus at marriott is Kiele. Princeville (imho) is very difficult for the 14hcp i am and satisfactions are rare. But i can say i've been there and done that (three times, and i am counting!). Puakea on Kauai is 10 minutes from Kiele and would also be reasonable.

Kauai also has the Waimea canyon. If you go, go before sunset and then go PAST the 3 turnouts for the canyon. There are a couple of great spots up there for sunset.

Brad Klein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2006, 05:06:21 PM »
Get leid.

ChipOat

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2006, 09:37:36 PM »
The problem with Princeville is that it rains a lot on that side of Kauai.  The other side of the island is a lot safer for spousal sunbathing.

Joel:

I didn't know that the 2 Lanai hotels are now Four Seasons.  Did Dole sell the properties or just turn the management contract over to the FS company?

Andy Doyle

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2006, 10:44:23 PM »
Get leid.

Yes, I was hoping to get deflowered... :o

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Joel_Stewart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2006, 12:26:07 AM »
I didn't know that the 2 Lanai hotels are now Four Seasons.  Did Dole sell the properties or just turn the management contract over to the FS company?

I believe its just a long term management contract. They closed the hotels in fall of last year and did some cosmetic stuff before "rebranding" them.  I believe they reopened in November as Four Seasons.   You can check the web site, www.fourseasons.com

rjsimper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2006, 08:00:57 PM »
While in Honolulu, you are going to be more limited to "novelty golf" rather than good golf, but two I would consider for sheer fun/intrigue/the stories you can tell are Luana Hills and Ko'olau, the latter of which is the highest slope rated course in the country.

Luana Hills (Formerly Royal Hawaiian Golf Club) is actually a composite course pieced together out of two nines originally created for 2 unique 18 hole layouts.  Because of this, the front, while featuring several very nice holes, gives little clue as to what's in store for the back - a fun, tight, scenic layout that really screams "Hawaii" - if you're looking for the best Redan in Hawaii, you won't find it here, but if you want to feel like you are playing golf in a rainforest, take some spectacular pictures, and soak it all in, then Luana Hills is a great (and lesser known) choice.  

I played it three times0 my memory tells me that it was roughly an hour from Honolulu, so not nearly as far as the Turtle Bay's on the island.

Ko'olau is in the same area, and is like the big angry older brother of Luana Hills from what I saw.

But yes, for golf purposes, Kauai and Maui have Oahu beat, but that does not mean you can't have a blast in your time in Honolulu as well.


Andy_Lipschultz

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2006, 10:33:19 PM »
Surf.

I;m assuming you do not (as this is your first Hawaii visit) and the best beginner wave in the world and the birthplace of surfing, is Waikiki. You'll be shocked at how easy it is to get up on this wave.

Go right outside the Royal Hawaiian Hotel (the pink one), look to your left and you'll see a shack offering rentals and lessons. You'll probably get one of the legendary Hawaiian beach boys (now in their 60s) who'll hook you up.


Brian Noser

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2006, 10:52:25 AM »
Andy,

I will say this cause I have only been there onece and i do not know to much about HI. But I played the Plantation course and it was great I had a great time I also reccomend that if you go to Maui. I also had a great time ant another inland course called the Dunes at Maui Lani. I do not know what all the others will say about it but I had a great time playing it. It was a pleasent surprise and one of the cheaper ones on the island if I recall.

Grant Davey

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2006, 08:53:14 AM »
Andy,
I agree with the other Andy,  go surfing!! It's the Mecca and it will change your life.
Grant

Brad Tufts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2006, 10:06:52 AM »
As the opposite of a HI virgin, I can give my opinions on the courses I've played:

Kaanapali North - Overpriced course behind the Marriott b/t Kapalua and Lahaina.  I've played this course twice, as it is within walking distance of the hotel, but it feels like Florida, the course is surrounded by houses, and there is only one green located near the beach (and next to a public access pt. no less).  Not to mention I it was $135 last time i played for this less than ideal situation.  I heard rumors of someone doing the course over though....

Kapalua Plantation - Not much to add what has been said on here, the best course in Hawaii currently (sorry Nanea, barely anyone sees you).  It's a big ticket course ($250+) but totally worth it.

Kauai Lagoons Kiele - A nice Nicklaus design that plays along the bay next to the Kauai Marriott, a few good holes, a healthy number of blah, resorty holes.  Apparently this course will soon be changed, possibly for the better.  The 13th is a great par 3 playing over the edge of the cliff, and the oft-photographed 16th is a short par four that is loved/hated due to its great views of the bay and lack of fairway.

Kauai Lagoons Mokihana - A solid yet unspectacular secondary course, less challenging in flashy than its sister.  Some holes are almost alarmingly close to the Lihue airport runway.

Kona CC Alii Course - The Montainside sister of the more well-known Ocean Course.  This course is short and hilly, playing among lava outcroppings.  The most known holes is the "sunset hole," a downhill par 3 near the end offering views of the coastline.  If you were to choose this club, I'd probably play the seaside Ocean course.

Poipu Bay GC - Site of the Grand Slam, wind is a huge factor.  The course plays as a semi-benign resort course until the final 5 holes.  14 plays straight uphill to the top of the course before the final 4 tumble downhill to the clubhouse, combining great ocean views with the ancient hawaiian heiau ruins.

Princeville - I wasn't a huge fan of this course.  Several holes were challenging and strategic, while more were too penal and just not fun.  The course probably has the hardest opening tee shot I can think of, and several others that border on ridiculous.  The rainforest in the interior of the course is beautiful, but you really can lose your ball (without even the option of a search) on about 90%+ of full shots here.

Pukalani - This course is on the slopes of Haleakela on Maui, and the climate is different about 2000 ft. above the valley floor.  The course is one the locals would recommend, cheap and fun.  I wouldn't recommend those looking for architecture visit Pukalani, but it is different than the resort courses along the coast.  There are some beautiful views from the course, as well as a par three over a ravine that offers the option of playing to a second green at the bottom if one doesnt want to make the carry.

Dunes at Maui Lani - Another local favorite, a cheaper option to the resorts.  There are parts of the course that have the Australian look to me (I haven't been there, but it appears slightly arid and firm and fast).  They bill it as a links course, which is not true at all.  There are a couple of great holes, and a few stinkers mixed in.

Wailea Gold - site (or former site) of the Senior Skins Game, the course is beautiful and finely manicured.  It has views of Molokini, where many snorkling trips go, and provides a good challenge.  I have not seen the other two layouts here, but I wouldn't think they'd be better than the Gold.

Wailua Muni - The course has gotten more press from hosting the publinx and being reviewed by Whitten a couple years ago.  It has become more crowded with tourists looking for the "hidden gem" that will not set them back $150 like the resorts, and the course is not exactly the next Bethpage.  Despite all of this, it is a fun course for about $50, that gives a good feel of Hawaiian golf before mass tourism.

One other thing to note, there is a deal we once used called the "Kauai Challenge" that combined rounds at Kiele, Poipu, and Princeville for something like $325 pp (in 2003).  Not a bad deal considering individual rounds at highest price would add up to something like $425-450 pp.

Happy Hunting!!
« Last Edit: January 24, 2006, 10:07:48 AM by Brad Tufts »
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Jerry Kluger

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2006, 11:48:11 AM »
Andy: I was in Hawaii this past summer and went to Kauai and Maui and my feeling is that the one golf course that is a must play is the Plantation although I caution you to play it early as play can be very slow in the afternoon.  Everything after that is a step down and not a big deal if you miss it.  The best thing about the Plantation is that the resort is really nice and so is the surrounding area as there are many places to eat and there is great water sports.  The Bay Course isn't much but at least it is a second option.  What is surprising is how long it can take you to get from point A to point B on both of the islands and you really don't want to waste your time driving around.  We did drive over to the mountain on Maui and hike into the crater but you have to do it early in the morning as sometimes the fog rolls in - BTW- we didn't do the bike ride and to me the hike into the crater is much more interesting than a bike ride.

The Dunes at Maui Lani is a nice course although a bit too up and down for me and about 35 to 40 minutes away and I wouldn't waste my time with the courses at Kannapali.  

JSlonis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2006, 03:31:00 PM »
Andy,

Per you request: :)

My wife and I stayed at the Ritz Carlton Kapalua last year(April 2005) and had a absolutely wonderful week.  Unfortunately for me, the Plantation Course closed the day we arrived for its renovation.  I was able to practice most days and played one round on the Village course.  For a vacation round, the Village course was nice.  While not world class in the golf architeture realm, the views and ambiance were hard to beat.  My wife was very happy to lay at the pool while I fed my habit.  As for outside activities other than golf, your options are plentiful.  We went snorkeling a few times, took a bike trip down from the Mt Haleakala Volcano summit(One of the coolest things I've ever done) it was spectacular.  Also, took a 1/2 day trip for snorkeling/whale watching, another unbeleivable experience.  The more I write about our trip, the more I'm thinking I just might go back there this year. ;D

The Ritz at Kapalua is a beautiful hotel, and there are many delicious retaurants within a short drive to Lahaina.  

If you end up going to Kapalua, send me  a PM and I'll give you some more info.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2006, 03:42:19 PM by JSlonis »

redanman

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2006, 03:41:01 PM »
Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?


I'd go somewhere else to play golf, not Hawaii.

You did ask.....

Andy Doyle

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2006, 03:42:25 PM »
Thanks everyone for the great advice.  Quickly narrowing this down to Maui and Kapalua.

Thanks,

Andy

Andy Doyle

Re:Hawaii Virgin - what would you do?
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2006, 03:45:33 PM »
I'd go somewhere else to play golf, not Hawaii.

Ouch.  This is definitely an island vacation with my spouse, not a golf vacation.  But I'll be dammed if I'll go all the way to Hawaii and not play at least 1 or 2 of these awesome looking courses.

Andy

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