Oak Hill East: Why no respect?

[michael j fay]

Oak Hill East has three Fazio holes and one RTJ hole. But that is only if you consider # 5 a hole at all.

In defense of the course I will say that there are numerous good holes that are not necessarily all that memorable. The 7-9 holes are quite good, # 14 is a classic, # 16 is very good.

The reason for no respect is the lack of continuity. Number 5 and number 6 are really out of character as is # 15. # 17 is a brutish par 4 in Championship play but only because it is a par five in reality. The driving area is much too small for a hole it's size.

My personal favorite Ross course in Rochester is Irondequoit which abuts the Oak Hill property. It is not a Championship Golf course but quite pleasant and challenging.

The West Course at Oak Hill is very good and closer to the original than East although the heavy handed touch of RTJ is rather evident.

Monroe and Brook Lea are good golf courses and should be included on any itinerary for Rochester. Country Club of Rochester has been whittled down over the years by numerous Architects and lacks any real identity.

[mark chalfant]

Michael thanks for your input.What are some othe nicer holes at Oak Hill West?

hows the terrain at Irondequoit; memorable holes

[Matt_Ward]

The continuity issue is a sound one concerning Oak Hill / East .

Regarding other NY State architectural gems one can easily include the likes of:

Piping Rock
The Creek
Crag Burn

People who defend Oak Hill / East should not be offended that others do not rate the course thaaaaat high -- the competitive architectural bar for The Empire State is the highest in the land for private golf clubs / courses and candidly a number of lesser known clubs are quite unique in what they offer from a design perspective but unfortunately do not merit much fanfare because of a lack of a desire to host major events of the type Oak Hill has been more than happy to have visit.

[michael j fay]

Matt:

I have no notes on Irondequoit but the terrain is very similar to that of both the course at Oak Hill.

The continuity of the Irondequoit course was outstanding. The theme continues from first tee through the eighteenth green. It is somewhat prototypical of Ross courses which is interesting considering that the front and back were built some 30 years apart. I suppose one of the reasons I liked it so much is that the greens appeared not to have been messed with.

I would also nominate Teugega in Rome New York as one of the better courses in the State. As for upstate I like CC of Buffalo as much as any.

Hard to compete in the Empire State. Between the exquisite courses on Long Island (including Fishers Island) and the greats in Westchester County there is a hard road to get in the top ten.

Personally my favorites in New York are:

Shinnecock, National, Quaker Ridge, Winged Foot (West) and
Fishers. I once played all five of these in one week. I was worn out but immensely impressed.

[Matt_Ward]

Michael:

You're so right.

NY State has the best overall private club collection in the nation. The issue is that often times the hype of NYC an its surrounding environs often doesn't match up to the hype.

On the golf front -- it exceeds it.

[JNC Lyon]

Michael Fay:
     You NEED to revisit CC of Rochester, as it has been recently restored by Gil Hanse.  In my book, it went from being not even within my top courses in Rochester to being one of my two or three courses in the area.  I have played it about a dozen times and caddied there maybe ten times, and it is now a very fun and excellent layout.  The new Trent Jones holes have been cleaned up, and now are passable.

     I do second Teugega and CCB, they are both some of my favorites.  Teugega is better than OHCC from a pure Ross standpoint, but not necessarily as far as the overall course is concerned.  

     Unfortunately, I have not gotten over to Irondequoit, even though it is in OH's back yard.  I have seen several holes on the course.  I hate to correct you, but your assertion that it is not a championship course is wrong, as it has begun hosting a Nationwide Tour event.  Don't worry, only a couple of the long fours were extended.  Winning score was something like eight under as a par 70.
 
     Also, what RTJ work are you referring to on the West Course?  My only guess is that he redid the ninth green, which is actually a pretty fun surface.  Other than that, I'm not sure what you mean.

Mark Chalfant:
     I have played CCB out of your list, and though I loved the quarry, and it had a great set of par threes (much better than OHE), it is NOT a better golf course.  The land at Oak Hill is consistently better, and I find myself struggling to remember a couple of the par fours and short par fives.