[JNC Lyon]

Anyone here played it?  I know that it is supposed to resemble holes from the Big Course.  How well does it do this, or does it establish a unique character of its own??  I also notice from an aerial that the tees are designed as fairways. Why?  How does one actually go about playing the course?

[Bob_Huntley]

Quite possibly the best advance in providing an extra treat for golfers after battling the senior circuit.

It's like going to the point of where your drive would end up on the regular course and playing in from there. I must say I have not walked it, because you get there by using a golf cart and one keeps on using them.

I am a fan.

Bob

[JESII]

There are ten holes, eight of which (I believe) are copies of holes on the course. The holes I can think of that are represented are 2, 3, 10, 13, 14, 15, and I think there are two more. There are also two original holes.

I am not sure if this is true of the par 3 copies, but the rest are designed to let you go out to whatever point in the hole you like (the idea being to where you might drive it) and play out the hole from there.

I think the typical time someone has played it is after playing 18 on the regular course you go out there after lunch. I would say the holes are very good imitations of what you'll find on the real course. I would not think it gets a ton of play but I'm really not sure about that either.

[Brendan Dolan]

I believe Fazio has a rendering of it in one of his books.  I don't recall which book it is in, but it is quite fun to look at.

[JNC Lyon]

One thing I noticed from looking at a Google aerial is that some of the hazards found in the driving areas on the real course are carried over to the short course, i.e. the sandy ruts to the right of #2 also appear in the aerial on one of the short course holes.  If so, this seems like a very innovative and unique way to play golf, where the winner of the previous hole in a match could chose to start the next hole from a deep fairway bunker as opposed to a flat, perfectly groomed piece of turf.  If true, this sounds interesting indeed

[Ian Andrew]

They are fantastic copies, the holes are really close to the origionals. I played them after playing the original course, and it was a fun way to relax after playing the big course.

It exceeded my expectations of how good it could be. The only minor complaint was the two new holes, they left me flat, since they did not have the feel of the other 8.

Still, all the same, very well done.

[Willie_Dow]

The course is called "A Ransome - Fazio Design".  The longest yardage for the 10 holes is 1956 yards, and the shortest is 1288. #1 is the 10th, #2 - 14th, #3 - 16th, #4 none,
#5 - 15th, #6 - 3rd, #7 - 13th, #8 - 17th, #9 none, and
#10 - 2nd.  Great fun for old timers !

[Tyler Kearns]

I believe Fazio has a rendering of it in one of his books.  I don't recall which book it is in, but it is quite fun to look at.

Brendan,

Tom Fazio dedicates pages 42-49 of his book "Golf Course Designs" to the Short Course at Pine Valley, including a plan and comparative analysis between the two courses complete with pictures. On 6 of the 10 holes, no formal tee ground has been created, allowing players to drop balls at specific points that perhaps give them grief during their matches at Pine Valley. Neat idea.

TK

[Patrick_Mucci]

JNC Lyons,

I'd agree with Ian Andrew.

Fazio did a great job in replicating the holes he chose to duplicate.

It's quite amazing when you think of what he did on a seperate parcel of land.

As much as I like it, having played it a few times, I have NO desire to play it again.

If I'm going to PV, I'd prefer to spend every waking hour playing the "big" course.

[Willie_Dow]

Patrick :  What did Ian say ?  And why ? Not on this thread !

[Willie_Dow]

Sorry Ian, I missed your read !  Agree !

[Bill Wernecke Jr]

Not to repeat what has already been said, but it is a one-of-a-kind experience, quite amazing and original but probably should never be done anywhere else

The holes that duplicate the original 18 are so similar as to be disconcerting; they are virtually identical

You take a cart from the middle of the woods and suddenly appear in the middle of the fairway on Hole #13, which for those who have not played it, is definitely one of the all-time great heroic par 4's ever made.

So why do this?  That is the question.  It is a lot of fun for warming up, or if you don't have enough time to play the big course, or for those older members for whom the big course is starting to become too difficult.

I am a big fan of golf clubs with shorter courses for the reasons above and many more (kids, ladies, early season etc), but it is probably best if the short courses are original!

[ChipOat]

Ian Andrew sort of said it, but maybe I'm the only one who believes the following:

10 holes that would be the best hole on most any golf course on the planet Earth (not every course - but pretty close).

This is one spectacular collection of golf holes, IMO.

Given the choice, I'd certainly join Patrick in preferring a round on the "big" course.  But that's not always possible.  I'd go around the Short Course all day if it was the only option.

It is not particularly easy to walk, by the way.

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