[Jim Franklin]

Any suggestions as to where to play on a Saturday in Denver for someone with a 4:45 flight out of Denver airport? Castle Pines is not an option as the weekends are out. We are already playing Ballyneal and Dismal River on the trip and are looking to round out the trip.

[Doug Wright]

Jim,

I'd suggest Riverdale Dunes, Green Valley Ranch or Murphy Creek in that order. All decent public courses and proximate to DIA. If you need more details IM me.

[Doug Wright]

Play Riverdale Dunes, the good one. (TD calls the two courses the good one and the "other one".

Yes, don't be shunted to Riverdale Knolls next door or you'll regret it...

[Matt_Ward]

Jim:

Play Bear Dance in Larkspur (south on I-25 about one hour from the airport) -- the ones Doug mentioned are good choices for being nearer to DIA.

In fact the connection to Bear Dance via the express beltway makes for a quick trip to DIA.

Either way -- enjoy the golf you have planned.

[cary lichtenstein]

Jim:

Sanctuary has alot of charity golf events. 100% of the money goes to charity. The golf course is excellent and it would be a nice way to finish off your trip.

Pull up there website and see if an event is scheduled for the day you want to play and contact the charity:

www.sanctuarygolfcourse.com

Cary

[Jim Franklin]

Thanks for the input. One quick question, how far is Red Sky Ranch from the airport? I was thinking of the Norman Course there if we had the time.

[cary lichtenstein]

Red Sky Ranch is about 15 minutes from the Vail airport, the drive to Denver is about 3 hours.

[Matt_Ward]

Jim:

Red Sky only works with a chopper -- don't know of your exact time dimensions. Red Sky Ranch is in Wolcott -- no less than roughly 3 hours from DIA by car -- I'm assuming the I-70 corridor is friendly for you.

Keep in mind that access to the Norman course there is flipped each day with the other Tom Fazio course on property.

You'll need to call -- Jim, the Norman Course is worth playing if you can squeeze it in -- one of the top five public courses in the state IMHO.

[Jim Franklin]

Thanks Cary and Matt, 3 hours may be cutting it close for a 4:45 flight. I think I will look into Bear Dance. I have played Sanctuary before.

[cary lichtenstein]

Try Fossil Trace

[Matt_Ward]

Jim --

Fossil Trace is a good Engh layout for a taxpayer-owned layout -- Bear Dance is one of the top five public in the state IMHO.

[Brad Swanson]

Hey Jim,
   If you play Green Valley Ranch, check out the first name on the Club Champion plaque (2001).  The guy's a hack!  Don't tell Matt Ward though.

Cheers,
Brad

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Cherry Hills

[Tim Leahy]

Buffalo Run golf course is 5 minutes from the airport and is a challenging prairie layout with great greens. Bear Dance is a great mountain layout but is at least 40 minutes from the airport.

[Kirk Gill]

Agreed on Buffalo Run if you have a time crunch. After Ballyneal and Dismal you may find it pedestrian, but I've had some enjoyable rounds there. They push the "links-style" thing too much in their ads and such, and it does not live up to that hype, imo.

Could someone please opine on the merits of Bear Dance? It is a place I might take someone from out of town to play, but I don't even think of it when deciding where to go for a round myself or with friends. I particularly can't stand the 6th hole with its cutesy "bear paw" bunker.

I don't know that Riverdale Dunes will live up to your sand hills excursions either, but it is fun, challenging, inexpensive (if that matters), and much closer to DIA than Bear Dance.

[Matt_Ward]

Kirk:

You are singling out one item at Bear Dance -- the ill-created paw -- the rest of the course is rock solid IMHO. Would love for you to pick out five better public courses in all of Colorado.

[Tim Pitner]

Kirk and Matt,  

I like Bear Dance.  It's very scenic and is a great place to bring out of towners.  Regarding the golf there, it's mostly okay and sometimes better than that.  There aren't many great holes--I'd nominate the par 3 2nd, and the par 4s 9 and 10 as my favorites--but there aren't many bad ones either.  I also like 4 and 11--two dogleg left, par 4s.  

I don't care for the bearpaw hole, mostly because the layup option left is a very awkward shot, which means that there aren't many choices there--you just blast away with driver.  I also don't care much for the drop shot par 4 16th, nor 17, the par 3 with the artificial babbling brook.  13 and 15, both uphill, dogleg right holes, are a bit too similar.  

They've taken some of the contour out of some of the formerly more severe greens there--on 11, for example.  I don't think that was a change for the better.  All in all, it's fun course to play, but not an example of great architecture, IMHO.  

Since we're talking about Denver public golf, I'll throw out another course--Heritage at Westmoor, a Hurdzan/Fry course in Westminster.  I like it better than Green Valley, Murphy Creek and Buffalo Run.  

[Jim Franklin]

How far is Fossil Trace from the airport?

[Kirk Gill]

"The Ill-created paw."

Well said.

You ask me to list five better public courses in Colorado, to which I respond that I'm no good at that particular game. There's a host of courses I'd play before Bear Dance, but not necessarily because they're "better." I found Bear Dance to be beautiful scenically, and there are some holes there that I remember (other than the bear paw), including the 9th. But the course kind of left me cold, from an architectural and playing standpoint. I didn't want to get back out there and play it again, and as I said before, it doesn't come up between myself and friends when deciding where we want to play on a given day. And they've played it, too.

This all may be MY fault. I have NOT played all of the public courses in Colorado, much less Denver (for instance, I haven't gotten to the Heritage at Westmoor referenced in Tim's post). I found Bear Dance pricey, and others may have as well since I see on their website that rates have gone down some since I played there. I've only given it two chances, both before experiencing the edifying effects of participation in this forum. Perhaps it deserves another play.

I'll give you one example of a course I enjoy playing more than Bear Dance - Vista Ridge by Jay Morrish. Its setting is nowhere near as stellar as the mountainous backdrops of Bear Dance, but the greens have more movement, and the bunkering is more strategic (to my mind and for my game).

Jim - Fossil Trace (another course I'd rather play than Bear Dance) is just under 40 miles from DIA, in Golden.

[astavrides]

How far is Fossil Trace from the airport?

35 minutes

[astavrides]

Kirk:

You are singling out one item at Bear Dance -- the ill-created paw -- the rest of the course is rock solid IMHO. Would love for you to pick out five better public courses in all of Colorado.

off the top of my head..
red sky norman
red sky fazio
broadmoor east
redlands mesa
lakota canyon

If you call the first three i named 'resort' rather than public, then maybe bear dance makes the top 5.

[Matt_Ward]

Stavros:

You earned a few points for me when you started your list with Norman's Red Sky Ranch -- but then you lost me with the idea that TF's layout at the same place is worthy of such high acclaim.

Not in my book -- it's akin to what you see with TF's work at Cordillera. Scenic. No doubt. Have any real shotmaking depth? Very little.

Redlands Mesa is also quite good but Engh has done better with the likes of Lakota Canyon Ranch. If you want a posssible layout that can match up with Redlands Mesa head to Delta -- 50 miles south of Grand Junction and play Rick Phelps Devil's Thumb.

On the public side I would also add the work Phelps did with Antler Creek in Falcon -- just outside of Boulder. It gets little attention because it falls outside the immediate Denver orbit of courses.

One last thing -- concur with you on Broadmoor too. I'd still keep Bear Dance because too many people fail to itemize how good the putting surfaces are -- turf wise and strategic wise.

[Tim Pitner]

Kirk:

You are singling out one item at Bear Dance -- the ill-created paw -- the rest of the course is rock solid IMHO. Would love for you to pick out five better public courses in all of Colorado.

off the top of my head..
red sky norman
red sky fazio
broadmoor east
redlands mesa
lakota canyon

If you call the first three i named 'resort' rather than public, then maybe bear dance makes the top 5.

Riverdale Dunes makes this list quite comfortably.  

[Doug Wright]

On the public side I would also add the work Phelps did with Antler Creek in Falcon -- just outside of Boulder. It gets little attention because it falls outside the immediate Denver orbit of courses.

Uh, Matt Antler Creek is east of Colorado Springs. You clearly play WAAAY too much golf and can't keep these things straight...

[Matt_Ward]

Doug --

It's better I know the course than the actual city. You can't live without the name of the layout -- you can use Mapquest or other such items for the location.

By the way -- Antler Creek is well done for a course located off the beaten track of Falcon. At least I got thaaaat city right.

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