The Best Golf Architecture book I have ever read...

[Marty Bonnar]

Gentlemen,
as you can imagine esp. if you know me that, in common with many others here, I possess and have read and re-read ad nauseum most of the great works/words on our collectively favourite subject (mostly 'cos of professional necessity, i.e. Mr Hurdzan, but occasionally also out of gleeful schadenfreude, i.e. Mr Fazio).

However, I am currently in the middle of reading messrs. Wethered and Simpson's 'The Architectural Side of Golf' for the first time and, quite frankly, am enjoying it more than mere words can express. Suffice it to say, if it were a woman I'd marry it (or at least chain it to the bed and have my wicked way with it thrice weekly).

EVERY paragraph, nay SENTENCE, contains more meaning, sentiment, emotion, scientific analysis and plain good old common sense than any other architecturally-angled book I have ever laid eyes upon. It's bloody marvellous!

May I take this opportunity to heartily recommend that you make every possible effort to find this one and read it as avidly as I - or maybe even take it to Bed (if the wife doesn't mind too much!)

FBD.

[Lou_Duran]

FBD,

After having a very difficult time finding it, I stuggled through it.  Only Behr's stuff and some of Hunter are more perplexing and confusing to me.  Can you amplify what you've found in the book that makes it so outstanding?

[RJ_Daley]

Dearest Nephew Marty,

Ha'ye furgottin ahl tae wunderous books I sint yea fer yur birthdays whin ye whas'a wee lad?  You know, "My Friend Flicka", "The Wee Red Fire Engine That Could", and'a curse "Angus the Tartan Goat"?  

My but ye half gruan tae be a cumplexed adoolt whi yer reefeye'nt taestes o'architicturahl seiets o'gawf.  Bah pulleese tell me laddie, yer nah a doin thinks unter tae cuvers whi tha book aer ye?

Really, I once purused this book in the University of Wisconsin Ag library many years ago, and have heard Tommy wax on about it's great insights.  I will have to get to it sometime before too much longer.  I take your enthusiasm as a great recommendation Marty.

[Tim_Weiman]

Martin,

I agree with the sentiment you've expressed. The Wethered and Simpson book probably gets the least attention of the classic era golf architecture books, but it is really great.

[Marty Bonnar]

Lou,
admittedly some of the prose is a tad 'flowery', but in my opinion, this only adds to the book's (line of) charms.
To illustrate though, here's a randomly (honest!) picked paragraph:

"A sense of connection and rhythm is to be looked for as much on a golf course as in a picture. If this rhythmic element be absent, the defect is at once noticeable. Instead of appealing to the artistic as well as to the practical sense, it introduces a problem needing no thought to overcome its difficulties and yields little more than the satisfaction of the uninspired shot accurately played. A hole can very easily be cold, empty and lifeless in spite of apparently being full of incident; on the other hand, if the design be clearly and economically expressed, it will be found to contain vitality and the refinements which add attractiveness without losing force".

Which I think illustrates nicely my point about them managing to cover everything from design to philosophy, from practicality to spirituality. Great reading!

Uncle Dicky,
as a grown man, my nighttime manouevres are my own business, ye ken. Luckily, thon boaxin' gloves ye sent me fer last crissmuss are comin' in gae handy though!

Tim,
glad to meet a fellow admirer!

FBD.

[George Pazin]

Martin, considering the passage you chose and the writing style, I can only say that I hope I am present the day you meet Adam Clayman.

Excellent book, though when it comes to writing I am biased in favor of the modern classics by Geoff, Tom, Brad, George, etc.

[Lou_Duran]

FBD,

Huh?  What are the authors saying in this paragraph?  Maybe it is just me, but even if I can get beyond the 'flowery' stuff, I have a hard time keeping my simple mind on the key thought.  I guess economy is a good thing in architecture and construction, but not in writing.  Though I think I know what they're trying to impart, I have to work way too hard to get there.

The paragraph and the overall writing style reminds me of a discussion on public TV in Boston in the mid-70s on male homosexuality.  A very refined, highly articulate ex-homosexual was developing a lengthy and detailed thesis to support his contention that sexual orientation is cultural and learned (therefore, it could be altered through therapy and retraining).  Admittedly, I was highly impressed with this man's oratory style, though I could only understand about half of what he said.

Awhile later, when it was the non-repentant homosexual's turn to speak (a rough-looking, muscular biker-type with Ivy League school credentials), he bluntly, but simply stated that he didn't have a clue as to what his opponent had just said, therefore, it must be bulls--t.  In the course of a few minutes, he layed down a simple, but precise argument on why he believed it was physiological in nature and not alterable through behavior modification.  While I was not necessarily predisposed to the latter argument, I came away much more open to this explanation than the other.

Moral of the story-  if you want to reach people, at least folks like me, don't make it too hard to understand your point.  Challenge me more with reasons as to why things are as they are, come up with some postulates and conclusions, and force me to think why and how these apply under different circumstances.  Whatever treasures are buried in the W & S book which comes so highly recommended by many qualified sources, they are lost on me.  Nevertheless, as soon as I finish Daley's fine GAvol.2, hopefully before 3 arrives, I'll pull W & S for a second reading.

Thanks for bringing it up, Martin.

George,

Why do you wish that on poor Martin?    Hell, Adam is as likely to point and make all sorts of gestures as he is to talk.

[Paul Richards]

"Discovering Donald Ross"  by Bradley Klein.

It's my favorite since my name is in it twice.
 

 


Really, it's an excellent book.

 

[RJ_Daley]

The paragraph and the overall writing style reminds me of a discussion on public TV in Boston in the mid-70s on male homosexuality.

I've heard a lot of flowery, oratory that sometimes winds up to say very little.  Sometimes the verbosity of a style of writing or speech is beyond the import of the message.  But, I don't generally have the mental facility nor keenly focused interest in an unrelated lifestyle subject to harken back to the 70s and any sort of obscure discussion in order to produce an analogy taken from a subject that far afield, like that Lou.  

I can see the context of the passage Martin offers to be within the realm of analogy to a previously heard discussion of themes found in "The Fountainhead" or a discussion of a comparative analysis of any artform or craftsmanship medium.  

I honestly don't see the passage offered by Martin as too hard to understand at all, when taken in the comparative analysis of golf course architectural styling, and merits of various elements of playability as they relate to the aesthetic sense.

Can someone please tell me if Lou's perceptions are that of a left brained businessman - economist, thus he is not able to comprehend or appreciate the architectural side of golf on an artistic level, rather than evaluation with calculator, scorecard and pencil?  

[Marty Bonnar]

I will confess to having had to re-read the occasional sentence or two in order to grasp the full nuance of what W&S are saying. But I'm actually finding that less of a chore, more of a pleasure. I'm normally a very fast reader, but here I'm having to take my time, so I'm actually deriving more (masochistic?) pleasure out of it.
I guess the book is causing me to ANALYSE each and every sentence, thus making me HAVE TO THINK!
I am, of course, LEFT-HANDED...

FBD.

PS What the HELL is an EX-homosexual? Eh?

[Lou_Duran]

Dick,

I was not making an analogy to the referenced program, only that reading that particular paragraph from W & S brought to mind that interview/debate.  BTW, as I recall, I did very well on the MAT (Miller's Analogy Test) some 30 years ago.  Perhaps you do not possess the ability to access long past experiences when evaluating new ones.  Or maybe you can look at things in part or in isolation (e.g. the efficacy of government providing universal health coverage), an ability not without merit, without it triggering a wider, more holistic examination.

Perhaps I am not an artsy kind of guy.  I like books that are thought provocative, but not overly difficult to understand (physics texts put me to sleep) what the author is trying to say.   An example or analogy might be the style of Matt Damon's character in "Good Will Hunting" as opposed to that of the pseudo-intellectual long-hair who was trying to impress the chicks.

Martin,

That's a great question.  In the context I refered to, it is a man with prior homosexual tendencies who, as a result of whatever therapy or reprogramming he went through, claimed he no longer had.  I should have known better than to bring up this somewhat taboo, politically correct subject, but when I read the paragraph from W & S you provided, that's what popped up into my apparently troubled mind.

 

[Mike Nuzzo]

Martin,
I very much enjoy the book, but often find myself stuck looking at the pictures.  Maybe those are more Lou's speed...  

I had just finished reading Macwoods essay in Golf Architecture volume 8 - from Australia and thought it was great.
I was going to start a thread about it after the Scarlet thread went away.

The rythm of a course is not easily described, and if it were easy to capture, there would be a whole lot more great courses in the world.

I am working on a small piece based on the following quote..
"the satisfaction of the uninspired shot accurately played"
It is also laced with psychology so maybe it will have appeal to public television as well...

[RJ_Daley]

Mike, the quote of the partial sentence: "...the satisfaction of the uninspired shot accurately played" is only understandable in the negative of what I think W&S are trying to say.  I think they are actually saying there is a lack of satisfaction in an accurate shot where there is only the obvious do or die situation.  Drastic and certain consequences of that missed shot not accurately played becomes a humdrum of tedium.

Don't you think they are saying that the presentation of a hole that one dimensionally dictates what is perhaps one difficult shot that must be made, is technically demanding, but has no "soul" as a word to be substituted for rhythm and connection.  The rhythm arising from the manner the course plays as a series of holes presented artfully on a property to combine with degrees of playing difficulty and challenge yields more food for thought.  The connection being the setting of the hole within a place in nature that draws equal attention to other possibilities within the environment, be they alternate approaches or that old line of charm thing that presents multiple choices that intrique and tease one away from the one and only accurate shot that must be played.

Perhaps deception in the form of camoufauge, or tie ins in the case of contour blending offering ground game options, or skylines in the case of the thrill of the uncertain or vague, all presented artfully in connection to natural settings, to offer us more than that one no-brainer way to play the hole is what W&S want to say, but may be to flowery for some tastes.

Lou, my memory is very shoddy all too often unless jogged by something extraordinary in the sensory realm.  Anotherwords, I can't remember certain golf holes that I may have birdied (oh so rarely) because they were of that 'do or die' ilk and I made it.  (Or more likely they were a lucky swipe at a rolling donut) Even smell can put me in mind of a particular hole or rhythim of a course I played, with the obvious being pine needles recalling to mind a setting at one of the Ross courses in the Southern Pines area. Texture is another sensory thing.  I can and do often visit rough areas.  They have a texture that when I experience a certain texture, I remember certain situations on well designed and interesting holes.  Some are wispy and fit a recovery strategy in the design, some are juicy and inextracable which brings an entirely different rhythm to one's game.  Firm and fast VS chocolate pudding is another sensory thing that brings certain situations on various golf course designs and holes to mind in a memorability sense.

Yet, I can remember old and new holes played in the context of what I identify as the rhythm and connection to setting and nature, and thoughts that the presentation of the hole gave me, because they made me think how to play or simply appreciate where I was at, as opposed to hit it here exactly or fuggetaboutit.  Then, I usually fuggetaboutit.

[Lou_Duran]

Hey Nuzzo,

When I was young and "read" Playboy, it was certainly for the pictures and not for that narcisstic liberal bs that was masquaraded as sophisticated and avant-garde.  They say a picture tells a thousand words.  But I don't have to tell that to a guy from Jersey who was probably weened on Hustler and Penthouse.

[Mike Nuzzo]

RJ,
Yes, it isn't an overly positive piece...

Lou,
Cheri and Swank = Jersey  

[Jeff_Brauer]

Martin,

I will go back and read my copy again. I recall being impressed with it, but still like Thomas book the best.  Next is the Ross book, where his unfinished writings were heavily edited by Ron Whitten to take out the unnecessary crap.  I think the Tillie books would have been better both edited, and perhaps put in chronological order, so you could get some sense of them.

Of course, when I get my Cybergolf columns finished, and if I can get someone interested in publishing it, that will be my favorite book. And you can bet it will be more direct and less flowery than the old writers, even if I take a "mulligan" and rewrite some of the stuff to be better and more complete.

[Mark_F]

Is 'The Architectural Side of Golf' generally available?

Anyone help me out with who publishes it?

Thanks.

[Lou_Duran]

The original was published by London; Longmans, Green, 1929.
I suspect that one of these in decent shape would fetch well above $1,000 US if it could be found.

I am pretty sure that I got my 2001 reprint of the original from George Lewis at Golfiana.com.  His website didn't allow me to see if he currently has one, but you may wish to try later or send him an email through the link at his site.  My reprint is the Flagstick Books edition with the Foreword by H. W. Wind, ISBN 0-940889-57-9.

[Jeff_Brauer]

I think Ann Arbor Media is planning on rereleasing some of the old gca books, but not sure which ones.

I reread parts of S and W.  Lots of interesting stuff. The more I read old books like that, the more I think they are trying to say - albeit in stilted language - about the same stuff modern architects are trying to say. They were trying to make it fairer, trying to make the greens accomodate the shots people were playing, etc.

Is it a coincidence that many of those Golden Age books open, or at least contain, a rant against greens committees? The more things change, the more they stay the same.....

[Lou_Duran]

MarkF,

Just got an email from George Lewis with the following link:

http://shop.classicsofgolf.com/Detail.bok?no=311

I clicked on it and they have the reprint for $33.

Good luck.

[Andy Levett]

I was about to post the same link as Lou.
If you are as cheap as me, the 1952 reprint,titled Design For Golf but with the same text and illustrations, can be a very inexpensive ebay alternative.
As for the question, it is good but Anatomy and Spirit aren't bad either.

[Paul Richards]

"The Future of Golf" by Geoff Shackelford, 2005, is a MUST-READ for anyone interested in golf course architecture.

[T_MacWood]

I like the 'Spirit of St. Andrews'.

[Mark_F]

Lou Duran,

Thanks for the info, much appreciated.

Great site!

in a real dilemma, now, however.  Shop there, or buy Rich Goodale's book on Dornoch...

[Lou_Duran]

I second TMac's nomination of "Spirit".

High on my list are Doak's "Anatomy" and Schakelford's "Golden Age" and "Captain".