[Patrick_Mucci]

If you're going to Sand Hlls, or anywhere within 200 miles, don't miss going to Wild Horse.

It was a wonderful surprise.

It had everything GCA.com'ers tend to like.

Centerline bunkering on the drive and second shots, wonderful green complexes with terrific putting surface contours, wind, blindness, options, wind, good greenside bunkering, the ground game, challenge, sport, fun, great conditions and the wind.

My one regret was that I didn't get a second bite of the apple, hence I would suggest that you play 36 holes if you go there.

The familiarity gained from the first round will enhance your enjoyment of your second round, and with daylight savings, I'd shoot for 54 holes.

Tony Chapman,

Thanks for setting us up, it was nice to meet you and a truely enjoyable day of golf and comraderie.

RJ Daley,

It was also nice to finally meet you.

But, tell the hardcore Marine to stop wearing those Greg Norman shirts.

[THuckaby2]

Gosh this is getting nauseating but again I must concur with Mr. Mucci.    Wild Horse is an absolutely fantastic golf course, as I've said several times before, and I learned a bunch playing it my third time the other day.  It's also one of those courses one wouild surely never tire of.  54 holes on a visit is a very good call.

Pat, please say something about the greatness of Notre Dame football so I can get back to my comfort zone of disagreeing with you....

 

[Mike_Sweeney]

I did not take too many of the courses, as they have been documented in the past, but this picture sums up Wild Horse for me:

Huck in a deep center line hairy bunker with Tony Chapman carrying his bag behind him and the Shinnecock-like setting of the clubhouse behind them.

[THuckaby2]

God what a choke that was... two great shots then dump an easy pitch in a bunker.. that was obviously BEFORE my Pat Mucci wedge lesson.

 

That does sum up WH well... the feeling, that is.

[Doug Sobieski]

I played WH on the 20th instead of watching the final round of the Open. If I didn't know that Sand Hills existed and someone told me that Wild Horse was our ultimate destination, I would be equally happy. Our group actually debated whether or not we'd prefer WH or SH for one final round, it was that much fun. The ground game was much more important at WH. I will definitely make sure I get back to WH in the future. Heck, I'd be happy just spending another day around the practice green!!! And those bluegrass/rye fairways were absolutely a treat to play from.

Every hole out there left me wanting to play it again. Personally, I thought #15 was one of the coolest drivable par 4's I'd ever played (due to the green site). Naturally, I had the front bunker between me and the hole with no conceivable way to get the ball up and down!!!

[RJ_Daley]

Pat, thanks for the praise of Wild Horse.  While I can only call it a second home course due to the fact I only play about 8-10 rounds a year there, and it is far away from my actual home, one does so want people to like their favorites as well.  

I do have to add one caveat to your list of praiseworthy characteristics that you observed many of us GCA diehards like so well.  I can honestly say that the two days I was there this weekend, they were about the mildest wind conditions I've experienced there.  You ought to see it when the wind actually becomes interesting!  Ask Adam Clayman about hitting a 9I or wedge to the 11th by aiming over the high dune to the right of the green complex!

BTW, I hope your man Charlie Weis works out, otherwise you may be down to Regis Philbin for the next HC job...

[Tony_Chapman]

Sorry, I just found this thread!  

Anyway, Mr. Mucci this was all Mike Sweeney's doing and I was happy to be along for the ride!! It was good to meet all of the guys.

Huck: You are wrong about that picture. That was your drive on the 7th that you put in the centerline bunker there. Sorry I had to remind you!!  

[cary lichtenstein]

Pat:

When Bette and I leave Snowmass, we're headed to Sutton Bay.

Should we first head to Gothenburg and then to Agar?

Anything else between those points we should look at?

Cary

[Tony_Chapman]

Cary - If it is on your intended route, I wouldn't miss it -- that's for sure.

Tony

[Scott_Burroughs]

Cary,

Between Gothenburg and Agar (a little detour), stop in at Hanse/Wagner/Shackelford's Prairie Club just SW of Valentine, (those guys are probably there now) to see how the construction is going.

After that, say hello to the guy in Valentine who has lost almost 600 pounds in just over a year since GB surgery.  He started at 1072 pounds, and is now under 500.  

[BCrosby]

I agree. Wild Horse is not to be missed.

A very special golf course, maybe even a radical gof course. In the most unlikely of settings.

I understand that A&P are doing a course in north of Atlanta soon. If it is anywhere near as good as WH, I am one lucky guy.

Bob

[Pat_Mucci]

Cary,

Heading east on route 80 get off at the Brady exit, head north.

Go over the railroad tracks and make an immediate right (east)

Go a few miles and you'll see a VERY SMALL sign on the west side of the entrance.  Take that left and follow the road until you come to a T.  Go right and you'll see the entrance to the clubhouse.

When you can see a large structure on the horizon as you're driving east you'll know that that left turn into the club drive is nearby.

Don't miss it. And, my advice is to play 36.
The first 18 can be baffling to the first time player.
The second 18 will be rewarding.

Also call them in advance and ask if they can get you a caddy who KNOWS the layout, it will be very beneficial.


Don't miss it.

P.S.  Let me know how long it takes you to get across the tracks.

[Geoffrey Childs]

Wild Horse is what golf is all about. Fun Fun Fun.

Pat et al- I'm glad you got to play it.  It was one of the great surprises and delights of my golfing life.

Why are there not more places like this open for all to play? Rustic Canyon followed it.  What is next?

[RJ_Daley]

Scott, your knowledge of local stuff baffles me.  I can't help but chirp in off topic.  When I was up in Valentine last fall with Geoff and Gill, the Doc took us to a buffet bar restaurant in town.  There I thought I had seen the biggest human I had ever encountered.  He was a Native American chap who had to be 6-7 or 8.  He was leaving the buffet with a 2 big plates of grub in each hand piled high, but they looked like tea saucers in that gents hands.  He walked to a solitary table and if I'm not mistaken sat his rump on two chairs side by side.  He looked something like the big man in "One Flew Over the Cookoo's Nest".  That can't be a co-incidence.

Cary, I can tell you I have never seen any caddie on Wild Horse.  But, Pat is right about 36.  Take one round to casually bat it around, then play whichever tees suit you for your more determined round.

Pat, that old Marine doesn't listen to a single word I say.  He knows better than to take fashion advice from a man who doubles for Simon Hobday on dress down Friday.

[Ted Kramer]

I did not take too many of the courses, as they have been documented in the past, but this picture sums up Wild Horse for me:

Huck in a deep center line hairy bunker with Tony Chapman carrying his bag behind him and the Shinnecock-like setting of the clubhouse behind them.

Do all the bunkers have that long grass around the edges?
I'm not trying to be Mr. Negative, I'm just not a real big fan of that look/style.

Do you guys generally like bunkers with high grass around them?

-Ted

[Brad Swanson]

Ted,
   Notice the length of the grass next to the bunker from the side in which the ball would enter.  Its pretty short.  Usually is IIRC.  I don't like high grass around the bunkers preventing a ball from getting into the bunker.  Otherwise I'm OK with it.

Cheers,
BRad Swanson

[Scott_Burroughs]

Dick,

Believe it or not, I don't think it's the same person!  There was an article in our paper recently on this Guinness record-sized guy's 1-year anniversary on his GB surgery and he had lost 573 pounds at the time.  

"He hadn't left his bedroom in seven months. He'd barely been outside in seven years. He couldn't sit up. He couldn't roll over by himself."

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/health/2002348570_fatguy25.html

Don't think he was tall and Native American either (didn't look it).

[Pat_Mucci]

RJ,

That fellow died of Scleraderma, (Progressive systemic Sclerosis) several years ago.  It's a thickening of the connective tissue, the opposite of Lupus.

Ted Kramer,

When the rough looks like that, long grass around the bunkers is in perfect harmony with the setting.

[John Foley]

Carey,

I know that you are an astute judge of golf course architecture.

I know that you are rabid in you discovery of new, interesting & challanging golf courses.

I know that when you leave Wild Horse your opinon of Lakota Canyon will change dramaitcally.

Wild Horse is more than that good!!

[Greg Beaulieu]

What's the story behind this course, particularly the economics of it? I went to the website of the club and membership is a whopping $400/yr. Now I know it's in the middle of nowhere and the town of Gothenburg is less than 4000 residents, so top dollar is unlikely to be had. But how could you build and maintain a golf course ubder those sort of economic realities? I just don't see how it's possible even if someone gave you the land for free.

[A_Clay_Man]

greg- Dick Daley will know the specifics. They are somewhat complicated, but did involve the sale of lots surrounding most of the course. The structure and course was built for less than 1.2m, or so I'm told.

Mostly the course was just there. As Dick told me, they just turned over the loam and grew grass. It's a testament to the ground and climate, that the conditions perfectly meld with the architecture.

One of the keys to WH's success can be directly attributed to the fescue green surrounds, an added expense for sure, but one totally justified, IMO.

[RJ_Daley]

I truly doubt the manner of capitalization, cost, and community spirit to bring this all about will ever occur again.  Perhaps the only other effort on this modest of a scale was documented in Ireland at Connemara where a community with the assistance of Eddie Hackett built their little version of heavenly links.

Wild Horse was a privately owned parcel where a development plan was conceived by folks tired of playing in a virtual 9 hole cow pasture river bottom bog that they previously had.  With the land owners receiving a modest sum, an intra-state share offering was sold and a subdivision of modest homesites bordering the golf course was placed in a homeowners association trust and sold to capitalize approximately 1.3million in course construction, maintenance facility construction, and a modest clubhouse!  There was a lot of donated labor in terms of construction of the buildings by various community carpenters, plumbers, electricians, and such.  Obviously, ongoing sales of green fees and f&b pays for needed maintenance machinery upgrades and employee costs of operations, etc.  There are private and course leased cart fee storage arrangements as well.  I believe you must be a community resident, share holder, or lot owner to get that modest membership annual fee. But, guest fees are moderate and one might be happy to pay between $35 and $45 to play the course on infrequent visits.

I was just thinking yesterday as I played my home area course which is typical parkland, very treed, and landscaped, that the mere absents of trees at Wild Horse reduces daily maintenance tasks considerably.  The thing Wild Horse has to do, that most places can't or don't need to do is burn the native rough yearly.  That is a careful operation for obvious reasons. But comparatively, Wild Horse can get by on specialized maintenance practices by a talented super that are somewhat less costly than most places.

[John Foley]

Dick,

I've always wondered why does Wildhorse burn their natural area's yearly? Is it less expensive than to mow it?

A few heavily fescued courses here in Western NY cut it down severly, usually very late in the growing season.

[A_Clay_Man]

TY Dick, I did fail to mention Josh Mahar.

Greg, He's the talented one who is ultimately responsible.

[RJ_Daley]

John, they burn the rough because the native can't stay typically native when there is active irrigation spray drift, and some fertilizer migration, and distribution of broadleaf weed seeds that tends to occur.

A person has to be careful with what they describe as heavily "fescued".  Usually when folks describe a rough patch as heavily fescued, it actually has a mish-mash of grasses, most commonly blue grasses.  The native will come back rapidly after a burn.  But so will the undesirable understory of blue grasses.

While the long term drought of the last few years tended to help keep the native more wispy and ideally the texture that works for this sort of links-emulation golf, it is difficult to wish for given the devistation it brings to the ag economy out there, and how it lowers the surface water bodies and the high plains aquifer.  This year with increased rain, the rough that was burned in the fall and this spring has regrown vigorously, with more broadleafs and heavy blue understory than we've seen in past years.  So, one has to accept a few lost balls if you stray into it.  BTW, they call the rough "wooga".

I do wish that an economical fix could be found to promote the true native grass texture, without lighting up the broadleafs and blue understory.  But, I'm not aware of a maintenance program that can achieve that.  I'd be real happy to hear from our fine turf and grass growing experts that might have ideas to advance this rough area maintenance question.

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