[Rob_Waldron]

I had the opportunity to play Mattaponi Springs GC, the recently opened upscale DF just north of Richmond and I am glad I did! Bob Lohmann has created a masterpiece over this heavily wooded site. The course is routed through 330 acres of rolling terrain with several extreme elevation changes.

The conditioning of the course is outstanding from tee to green and unlike may new courses, all of the amenities are available including clubhouse, driving range, and on course rest rooms. Mattaponi offers a wonderful golfing experience free of houses and traffic.

There is a great mix of short and extremely long par 4's, risk/reward par 5's, and par 3's ranging from 145 yards to 235 yards.

The staff led by GM/DOG Mac Ellett are well trained and very helpful. A yardage guide and range balls are all included with your greens fee.

If any one else has played Mattaponi Springs I would be interested in your thoughts.

[DTaylor18]

Rob, thanks for the heads up, it sounds like it's worth a trip.  You mentioned several extreme elevation changes.  Is it walkable?

[Rob_Waldron]

I saw two "younger" gentlemen walking the course well ahead of us. I do emphasize younger. Actually the distances between greens and tees is minimal so it is very walkable from that perspective.  The club is hosting a collegiate tournament in the fall which is being hosted by VCU. I know the college kids will be walking!

[ChasLawler]

I was able to get out to Mattaponi Springs late yesterday afternoon, and my overall impression was very positive. The place is literally in the middle of nowhere - even more so than Royal New Kent, but it is convenient to I-95.

The property itself is phenomenal. I was very impressed with the routing, with a good mix of downhill, uphill, short and long holes. The extreme elevation changes (100+ft?) on 9 and 18 may be a bit too severe however.

Much of the course seems to be cut through dense woods and pine. The hole corridors themselves are very wide and the fairways generous, but Lohmann did have to use some artificial mounding in places to protect balls from disappearing into the woods.
 
As far as walkability goes, Rob hits the nail on the head. Tee to green relationships are minimal. The extreme elevation changes on 9 and 18 or both downhill, so while they may be tough on the knees, the lungs get a break. Carrying your own bag is certainly an option, and I saw a number of other golfers with bags on their backs.

The greens are what really define this course however – very significant elevation changes with multiple tiers. At first I was smitten with them, but after about 8 holes it started to get repetitive. Almost every green on the course has 3 tiers. Not one of them is the same as far as the configuration of the tiers, but the “green within a green” theme certainly pervades here. Get yourself on the wrong level, and 2 putting becomes quite a challenge. I’m usually a fan of tough greens with a lot of movement, but it just seemed to get old and repetitive after a while. I’d be particularly interested to hear what others have to say about the greens.

Like I said earlier, the fairways are generous overall, as the nature of the greens really make this a second shot golf course. Having only played it once, and with the extreme nature of the greens, it seems some local knowledge would go a long way here when approaching the greens.

Overall, I’m eager to go back and I would highly recommend Mattaponi Springs to anyone in the area. Is it worth a special trip?…. probably not - but if you’re within a couple hours you should check it out. As far as DF and resort courses go in Virginia, I’d probably put this behind only the Cascades and Golden Horseshoe – Gold. It’s in the same boat as Royal New Kent and Stonehouse.

[RE Blanks]

Royal New Kent may be a fun place to play but that name is the worst I have ever heard outside of Bogey Busters Golf Club in Richmond Ky.

[John Moore II]

I saw this topic when I searched the archives after playing this course. I figured I'd bring this one out of the abyss rather than starting a new topic and chewing up more server space and such.

I really enjoyed this course. I had not seen any pictures of this course prior to going there and I had not read this thread. It was really spur of the moment that I decided to play there. I played here because it was rated on the most recent Golf Digest Public Top 100. From the other courses on that list I have played, it is worthy of being included on that list. The course does have some very severe elevation changes, with #1, #9 and #18 being the most prominent.

The fairways were unique in my experience. Having not played any golf in the north (Mattaponi Springs is the northern most course I have played) I had never played on zoysia fairways. They were interesting. Very firm and compact. I didn't pay enough attention to the rough to recall whether or not it was zoysia or bermuda.

The greens were exceptional, possibly the best set overall that I have played. These greens could be really monsterous is they played fast. Some of the greens were semi-flat, but most of them had several levels and could be really tough two putts if you hit into the wrong area.

The three holes that border the irrigation pond are the worst three on the course, and thats saying plenty since they are not terrible holes. I have to wonder if they could have put that pond in a better area, like the large space between 10, 11 12 and 18; those holes form box that has 3 creeks running into it. I would think they could have possibly routed the holes around a pond in that area and had it look more natural. But all that being said, the 3 holes around the pond are not poor and provide some good options for play.

I will post a full course tour of pictures tomorrow, probably, and we can see what people think of that. But overall, I thought it was a very good course, if you can get there. Maybe not worth a long drive, but if you are transiting north or south on I-95 between Richmond and DC, this is certainly a good place to stop, and as said in another thread, probably one of the best.

[Roger Wolfe]

I watched that course grow in for about 6 years.  Its a beautiful piece of property truly in the middle of nowhere.  The front nine greens are excellent while the back nine is a little nutty (construction company shaper versus independent).  I consulted for them when they first opened and the "Elite Daily Fee" writeup on the website is my handiwork.  The owner is a very driven man and the course is truly a labor of love for him.  4-5-6-7 is a stunning stretch of holes as is 12-13-14-15-16.  I would say the only weak hole on the entire property is the par 3 number 3.  My favorite thing are the trees.  It was obviously clear cut years ago and pines were replanted.  The course is lined with the small pines while the outer perimeter is hardwoods.  It is absolutely stunning when the fall colors are out.

Great course and a MUST PLAY for anyone traveling I-95 north or coming south.  You get off just past Kings Dominion or just before the Wilson Bridge on the beltway.  There is a secret bridge that crosses the Potomac from VA to MD on Rte 301.  Rte 301 runs from Waldorf MD to I-95 just north of Richmond.  Skip the nightmare I-95 up North and stop at Matt Springs.  100% worth the trip.

[Jerry Kluger]

I too really enjoyed the course.  A friend played it who regularly plays the municipal courses in our area and he complained that the green contours were too severe - I guess "Joe average golfer" will never appreciate quality unless it looks pretty.

[John Moore II]

I watched that course grow in for about 6 years.  Its a beautiful piece of property truly in the middle of nowhere.  The front nine greens are excellent while the back nine is a little nutty (construction company shaper versus independent).  I consulted for them when they first opened and the "Elite Daily Fee" writeup on the website is my handiwork.  The owner is a very driven man and the course is truly a labor of love for him.  4-5-6-7 is a stunning stretch of holes as is 12-13-14-15-16.  I would say the only weak hole on the entire property is the par 3 number 3.  My favorite thing are the trees.  It was obviously clear cut years ago and pines were replanted.  The course is lined with the small pines while the outer perimeter is hardwoods.  It is absolutely stunning when the fall colors are out.

Great course and a MUST PLAY for anyone traveling I-95 north or coming south.  You get off just past Kings Dominion or just before the Wilson Bridge on the beltway.  There is a secret bridge that crosses the Potomac from VA to MD on Rte 301.  Rte 301 runs from Waldorf MD to I-95 just north of Richmond.  Skip the nightmare I-95 up North and stop at Matt Springs.  100% worth the trip.

Roger-While you and I both think the course is very good, we disagree on which holes we like and don't like. I do like 12, 14 and 15, but I thought 13 and 16 around the irrigation pond were just average. Those two holes, along with 17, are all pan flat compared to the rest of the course. I also thought 3 was a very good little drop shot par 3, and the green has some good movement as well.

I had also wondered about the pines inside the course. I thought when I first saw them that they were planted after the property being timbered at one time of another.

Roger-What are your favorite holes on the course, one from each par? Mine are #14 for the par 3, #1 for the par 5 (though I really liked the double fairways on 11) and 5 for the par 5. And where do you rate the course using Doak's scale? I say 6.

I too really enjoyed the course.  A friend played it who regularly plays the municipal courses in our area and he complained that the green contours were too severe - I guess "Joe average golfer" will never appreciate quality unless it looks pretty.

Funny thing is, Mattaponi is very 'pretty.' It was far more hilly than I expected and had some great vistas looking over the rolling hills and just nature. Very good looking course I thought.

[Jonathan Cummings]

I think Pendleton across I95 from The Springs doesn't get enough love.  A fine and easy-to-do 36 hole day is The Springs, 10 minuite drive and Pendleton.  JC

[Rob_Waldron]

I must say that my opinion of Mattaponi drastically changed when I went back two years ago. The conditions were terrible and the attention to detail had disappeared. I will admit the owner said he was changing grasses and was in transition. The other problem was that I had played Spring Creek the day before and Mattaponi had no chance matching up to that gem! I have heard that the conditions have improved since my last visit. Tough location to draw play.

[Cliff Hamm]

I remember too many greens with an upper plateau occupying a small portion of the green.  The plateaus tended to up a steep incline rather then gradual.  This feature was used way too much and took away, I thought, from the course.

[Chris_Blakely]

Mattaponi Springs for me was just OK.  In defense of the course, I went in with VERY HIGH EXPECTATIONS b/c it was rated higher than Greywalls in Michigan.  I did not even think it was a question of what course was better after playing Mattaponi Springs.  I did not care for the holes around the irragation pond.  I too noticed what Cliff Hamm did, but I did not ping the course for the severe greens - I think my problem was expecting something that the course was not.

Chris

[CJ Carder]

Mattaponi is probably one of my more favorite courses in VA.  I haven't yet played Spring Creek, but I'd be hard pressed to name 5 courses I'd play before Mattaponi.  I've been played there 5 times and have some thoughts on other comments people have made so far:

Roger-While you and I both think the course is very good, we disagree on which holes we like and don't like. I do like 12, 14 and 15, but I thought 13 and 16 around the irrigation pond were just average. Those two holes, along with 17, are all pan flat compared to the rest of the course. I also thought 3 was a very good little drop shot par 3, and the green has some good movement as well.

John - I agree that #3 is a really solid hole - I was surprised that Roger thought it was the worst of the par 3's - I'd never put #17 ahead of #3.  I'd say it's probably the second best par 3 on the course after #7.  That said, I think you're being too hard on #16 as I really like the idea of giving the player one last shot to "go for it" towards the end of the round and providing a pretty stiff penalty for missing.  Even for a medium length hitter like me, I've always had to think about whether or not to go for it in 2.

I remember too many greens with an upper plateau occupying a small portion of the green.  The plateaus tended to up a steep incline rather then gradual.  This feature was used way too much and took away, I thought, from the course.

Cliff - do you remember which holes were setup this way?  Off the top of my head, I can only recall #14 having a real severe slope.

There is a great mix of short and extremely long par 4's, risk/reward par 5's, and par 3's ranging from 145 yards to 235 yards.

I think this is what really makes Mattaponi Springs a solid course and such a joy to play.  But while I disagree about the steep inclines in the greens, I won't disagree that they require a solid day of ball striking and short game to play well. 

John I'll be interested to see your pictures - I have a number of them myself that I took very early on in the life of the course so I'll be interested to compare the two if I have the chance.

CJ

[Chris_Blakely]

Mattaponi is probably one of my more favorite courses in VA.  I haven't yet played Spring Creek, but I'd be hard pressed to name 5 courses I'd play before Mattaponi.  I've been played there 5 times and have some thoughts on other comments people have made so far:


I'll give this a shot and only go with Virginia courses (maybe I had a bad experience there, but still):

Primland -the Highlands Course, Meadows of Dan, VA
Spring Creek GC, Gordonsville, VA
Poplar Grove GC, Amherst, VA
Cavalier G & YC (private) Virginia Beach, VA
Great Oaks GC, Floyd, VA
The River Course at Virginia Tech, Radford, VA
Royal New Kent GC, Providence Froge, VA
King Carter GC, Irvington, VA


Chris

[Roger Wolfe]

I watched that course grow in for about 6 years.  Its a beautiful piece of property truly in the middle of nowhere.  The front nine greens are excellent while the back nine is a little nutty (construction company shaper versus independent).  I consulted for them when they first opened and the "Elite Daily Fee" writeup on the website is my handiwork.  The owner is a very driven man and the course is truly a labor of love for him.  4-5-6-7 is a stunning stretch of holes as is 12-13-14-15-16.  I would say the only weak hole on the entire property is the par 3 number 3.  My favorite thing are the trees.  It was obviously clear cut years ago and pines were replanted.  The course is lined with the small pines while the outer perimeter is hardwoods.  It is absolutely stunning when the fall colors are out.

Great course and a MUST PLAY for anyone traveling I-95 north or coming south.  You get off just past Kings Dominion or just before the Wilson Bridge on the beltway.  There is a secret bridge that crosses the Potomac from VA to MD on Rte 301.  Rte 301 runs from Waldorf MD to I-95 just north of Richmond.  Skip the nightmare I-95 up North and stop at Matt Springs.  100% worth the trip.

Roger-While you and I both think the course is very good, we disagree on which holes we like and don't like. I do like 12, 14 and 15, but I thought 13 and 16 around the irrigation pond were just average. Those two holes, along with 17, are all pan flat compared to the rest of the course. I also thought 3 was a very good little drop shot par 3, and the green has some good movement as well.

I had also wondered about the pines inside the course. I thought when I first saw them that they were planted after the property being timbered at one time of another.

Roger-What are your favorite holes on the course, one from each par? Mine are #14 for the par 3, #1 for the par 5 (though I really liked the double fairways on 11) and 5 for the par 5. And where do you rate the course using Doak's scale? I say 6.

I too really enjoyed the course.  A friend played it who regularly plays the municipal courses in our area and he complained that the green contours were too severe - I guess "Joe average golfer" will never appreciate quality unless it looks pretty.

Funny thing is, Mattaponi is very 'pretty.' It was far more hilly than I expected and had some great vistas looking over the rolling hills and just nature. Very good looking course I thought.

I probably appreciate the lake holes because I know what it took to build it.  They were blasting a highway somewhere up in Maryland and the owner cut a deal for them to bring the rock to MPs.  One guy, armed with a track hoe, placed each rock on the sides of that pond one at a time over one winter.  Let me go hole by hole...  but remember I haven't been there since 2004.  I have heard they redid #3 since my time. I am not familiar with the "Doak scale" but would love to have it emailed to me...

#1.  Great elevation drop from tee to fairway.  Solid par 4.
#2.  A very busy uphill par 5 with some strange fairway contours.
#3.  We have been through this one.
#4.  Wonderful, difficult par 4 that starts you back up the hill.  Probably my favorite on the course.
#5.  Great short little par 4 that can be dangerous off the tee if you are not careful.
#6 and #7.  Scenic and pretty par 5 and par 3 that take you back down into the valley.
#8.  Short dogleg left par 4 uphill.
#9.  Tee and fairway are elevated then its straight downhill to the green.  #18 is very similiar.

#10.  I don't care for this one either.  Flat straight par 4
#11.  Cool split fairway that was built like Augustine #1 in Stafford however green is elevated over an environmental area.
#12.  Where the green contours start to get a little crazy.  Another swooping par 5 with a big environmental area.  Crazy tiered green with severe slopes.
#13.  Rising par four with the water on the right.
#14.  Par 3 over the consistent back nine environmental swale.
#15.  Short par 4 with another severely contoured green.
#16.  Par 5 that ends on the water.
#17.  Sig hole (I don't agree) par 3 with waterfull and rocks and the lake.
#18.  Hit way down a sloping fairway then up to a green cut into the hillside over a creek.  Very pretty.

Fariways and tees were zoysia when it first opened.  Drought and lack of water led to problems growing in the fescue rough.  I am interested to see what grass they have now.  Some of the contours on the back nine greens were "unmowable" if I remember.  I still love the place.  There aren't many that are pure golf... no houses... no roads... no nothing!

Favorite par 5 - number 5.
Favorite par 3 - number 6.
Favoriite par 4 - number 4.

I believe Spring Hill and Pendleton must have been built after my time.  I ran Augustine in Stafford from 97-01 then Swan Point in Maryland from 01-04.  In those 7 years I think I played every single course in the state of VA!!

[John Moore II]

Roger here is the scale I was talking about:

1: Very basic course; clear architectural malpractice and/or poor maintenance. Avoid even if desperate for a game.

2: mediocre course with little architectural interest, but nothing really horrible. (Play it in a scramble and drink a lot of beer).

3: about the level of the avg. course in the world.

4: modestly interesting; with at least a couple of distinctive holes or some scenic interest. Also reserved for some very good courses which are much too short or narrow to provide sufficient chalenge for low-handicappers.

5: Well above the avg. course, but the middle of this scale. A good course if in the vicinity, but not worth setting aside a day to visit.

6: A very good course, definitely worth a game, but not necessarily worth a special trip to see. It shouldn't disappoint you.

7: An excellent course, worth checking out if within 50-100 miles. You can expect sound design; interesting hiles; good conditions and a pretty setting; if not necessarily anything unique to the world of golf.

8: One of the very best in the region and worth a special trip to see. Could have some drawbacks, but will make up for them with something really special.

9: Outstanding course. One of the best in the world with no weaknesses. Should see in your lifetime.

10: Nearly perfect. If you skipped even one hole you would miss something worth seeing. MUST see these courses to appreciate how good golf architecture can get.

Examples:
10-Pinehurst #2, Pine Valley
9-Pebble Beach, Shadow Creek
8-World Woods (Pine Barrens), TPC Sawgrass
7-Old Town, The Dunes Club
6-Country Club of North Carolina (Dogwood)
5-Pinehurst National
4-Talamore, Pinehurst #5

In my opinion, I think Mattaponi Springs is better than Pinehurst National and on roughly the same level as CCNC, so I gave it a 6. (Tom thinks we over-rate our opinions, so...) Based on the definition, you might think its a 7, but I am not sure its that high.

[John Moore II]

As promised, the photo thread from Mattaponi Springs.

Hole 1



Hole 2



Hole 3


Hole 4



Hole 5


Hole 6



Hole 7


Hole 8


Hole 9




Hole 10


Hole 11



Hole 12




Hole 13



Hole 14


Hole 15



Hole 16



Hole 17


Hole 18



I will do a write-up of the holes to go along with these pictures tomorrow.

[Mike Hamilton]

John,

Thanks for brining this one back up and posting the photos.  I agree Mattaponi probably a "6" or maybe even a 6 1/2.  It is certainly boosted by it's location in the middle of nowhere....nice to play golf with nothing around.  I first played there last September and have played maybe 5 rounds there total.

Some of my thoughts FWIW on the holes.  Not a fan of the opener.  The highly elevated tee is scenic but the shot is tough to judge, and unless you squeeze your tee shot into the narrow left hand shoot, you are facing a 150-180 approach over a hazard for your second shot of the day.  Don't really like this hole in general and even less as the first hole.

Also not hugely crazy about #2, you again face fairways that feed left to right into another hazard.  I like this hole better than the 1st, but don't like the fact that they are 1 and 2 and back to back.

I agree that 3 is a nice short par 3 and one of three very good Par 3's (17, on the other hand I think is easily the worst hole there).

The 3 through 8 stretch is the best on the course.  4 is a good long testing Par 4.  Hole 5 is a great short Par 4 and my favorite hole overall...it's layout tempts a shot over the bunkers on the left, but its very easy to be deceived by this hole and to push your tee shot into the trees on the right.

As far as the Back 9, the holes around the lake are a bit disappointing, but I think 17 is really the only very mediocre hole.  I like the fairway and green undulations on the approach to 13 and the risk / reward of 16.  I think the disappointment is that the routing on the plateau with the lake just assumes a very artificial feel after so many holes winding through the hilly property.

A great mix of Par 4's on the Back.  11 with the split fairway, the Short 15 and the 18 which gives a number of options off the tee.

The greens are mostly as you noted very fun, but unfortunately as mentioned in a couple of places a bit overcontoured.  I think 12 is the worst and I think every time I have played the pin has been set on the highest tier and the far left of the green which I believe is a ridiculous placement.

But overall worth a play...it's a very short detour off 95 for anyone coming through.

Thanks again John!

[John Moore II]

Mike-I thought #1 was a very good hole, though I did think it was a bit much for a opener. I have to believe that pond was out of necessity because of that area being so low in relation to the rest of the property; most of the property likely drains there. It requires you to hit a precise shot right out of the gate and I have nothing against that. However, I think its a bit tough for an opener. I was fortunate enough to play the hole into a hurting wind, so the pond was less in play. Of course that left me with a 5 iron approach. Still not a bad hole. #2 is much the same way. It can be reached in two if you want to chance hitting over the right, short bunker, but if you play safe and lay back, you have no bargain of a second shot. This hole actually has some interest in the second shot, which many par 5's do not have.

#5 I think is a better hole from the more forward tees. I played all the way back and there is basically no chance to try for that green. It would take a really massive hook from back there, unless you have Hogan-like precision with your driver and can take it exactly down that tree line.

And I agree with most of your other statements about the course. I think the three holes around the lake are the weakest, yes with 17 being the weakest of the three.

Not sure what to say about the green on #12. I'll have to see it again and look closer. But when I played the hole was cut far left on the high tier for me as well. I missed the green pin high right, hit a pitch directly into the bank of the tier and rolled it up to 3 feet. So I can't really comment on how tough that placement is. And overall, I didn't think the greens were too wild. I'd like to play them when they are rolling fast, like 9-10 fast. That would make for a really sporty day. Anything greater than 10 though and I think they'd get nearly unplayable.

If you have any plans to go there this summer, after mid-June, let me know. I'd love to go up and play it again.

[Mike Hamilton]

Mike-I thought #1 was a very good hole, though I did think it was a bit much for a opener. I have to believe that pond was out of necessity because of that area being so low in relation to the rest of the property; most of the property likely drains there. It requires you to hit a precise shot right out of the gate and I have nothing against that. However, I think its a bit tough for an opener. I was fortunate enough to play the hole into a hurting wind, so the pond was less in play. Of course that left me with a 5 iron approach. Still not a bad hole. #2 is much the same way. It can be reached in two if you want to chance hitting over the right, short bunker, but if you play safe and lay back, you have no bargain of a second shot. This hole actually has some interest in the second shot, which many par 5's do not have.

#5 I think is a better hole from the more forward tees. I played all the way back and there is basically no chance to try for that green. It would take a really massive hook from back there, unless you have Hogan-like precision with your driver and can take it exactly down that tree line.

If you have any plans to go there this summer, after mid-June, let me know. I'd love to go up and play it again.

Based on what I've read, I think you are about minus 20 years and +60 yards off the tee so we will probably see things differently on a few holes  ....and I would not be playing the Back Tee on #5, but not likely driving the green from the 280 tees either....but still very much like how this hole was set-up. 

Next time I think about heading up there will let you know!

[John Moore II]

I like how 5 was set up as well, its just not a reachable par 4 from the back tees, and in some ways, thats a bit of a waste for a short par 4 like that. As far as age and length, I'm 27 and from the back tees at Matt Springs, I hit driver into the left side bunker on 2, driver to 150 yard out on #4 and had inside 200 yards to the green on #16...so...take from that what you will.   

Hope to meet up with you some day.

[Jonathan Cummings]

Mattaponi is probably one of my more favorite courses in VA.  I haven't yet played Spring Creek, but I'd be hard pressed to name 5 courses I'd play before Mattaponi.  I've been played there 5 times and have some thoughts on other comments people have made so far:


I'll give this a shot and only go with Virginia courses (maybe I had a bad experience there, but still):

Primland -the Highlands Course, Meadows of Dan, VA
Spring Creek GC, Gordonsville, VA
Poplar Grove GC, Amherst, VA
Cavalier G & YC (private) Virginia Beach, VA
Great Oaks GC, Floyd, VA
The River Course at Virginia Tech, Radford, VA
Royal New Kent GC, Providence Froge, VA
King Carter GC, Irvington, VA


Chris

Chris - good list - I agree with most all of them.  I would throw The Federal Club in there as well.  JC

[John Moore II]

Mattaponi is probably one of my more favorite courses in VA.  I haven't yet played Spring Creek, but I'd be hard pressed to name 5 courses I'd play before Mattaponi.  I've been played there 5 times and have some thoughts on other comments people have made so far:


I'll give this a shot and only go with Virginia courses (maybe I had a bad experience there, but still):

Primland -the Highlands Course, Meadows of Dan, VA
Spring Creek GC, Gordonsville, VA
Poplar Grove GC, Amherst, VA
Cavalier G & YC (private) Virginia Beach, VA
Great Oaks GC, Floyd, VA
The River Course at Virginia Tech, Radford, VA
Royal New Kent GC, Providence Froge, VA
King Carter GC, Irvington, VA


Chris

Chris - good list - I agree with most all of them.  I would throw The Federal Club in there as well.  JC

I would certainly add in Golden Horseshoe (Gold) to that list as well. Very good golf course, especially if you can play in the winter for the $49 rate. What a steal.

[Mike Hamilton]

I like how 5 was set up as well, its just not a reachable par 4 from the back tees, and in some ways, thats a bit of a waste for a short par 4 like that. As far as age and length, I'm 27 and from the back tees at Matt Springs, I hit driver into the left side bunker on 2, driver to 150 yard out on #4 and had inside 200 yards to the green on #16...so...take from that what you will.   

Hope to meet up with you some day.

So 19 years and maybe 60 yards on a good day.  We'll have to meet up and I'll bring ear plugs to wear on the tee!

[Tags:]

Tags:

[Tags:]

Tags:

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()