Who are the most under-rated working architects?

[Mark Brown]

A lot of the most under-rated architects become so because they stick to a limited region of the country, although there are also some that scatter their work and are still under-rated.  Who are they, what are their best courses and why are they good?

Smyers is one who has courses all over the Eastern U.S. and the world. I think he just needs a break thru site and a developer like Bandon Dunes.

Other possibilties: Strantz, Bobby Weed, Hurdzan & Fry, Cupp, Morrish, Kay, Engh,Devries

[Sam Sikes]

I certainly wouldn't call Hurdzan&Fry or Bob Cupp underrated.  The former have had good sites all over the U.S. and some in Canada.  Still they have yet to produce a unique, national rank caliber golf course, except maybe Calusa Pines.  I speak mainly of one of my home courses, The Ledges, which is all the site the two could have ever asked for.  Instead, we got a golf course and residential development that would achieve a 4, 5 or maybe a 6 on the doak scale.  (he may think more highly of it, I dont know) It is still a great place to play, I might add.  You certainly have to commend them on their sales pitch though.  I remember when the Ledges was just an idea, and Hurdzan Fry were in my living room I was looking at their design/construction book blah, blah, thinking, "wow, these courses look pretty good in the pictures, why haven't I heard of them."  I would soon find out.  BORING.  Every par 4 between 400 and 459. Shortest of 5 par 3s, 180.  Three par 5s over 570. IMO, the routing sucks.  There is not a single hole on the golf course where the "Ledge" is to the right, which is an automatic two shot penalty in the variety category.  The views are beautiful though. Anyway, they did a great job convincing the developers that they were the guys.  Hurdzan is really good at regurgitating that scientific turfgrass and drainage jargon that makes everyone feel stupid.  Concurrently, I had just purchased the Confidential Guide and mentioned Doak's name, for which the Developers did not bat an eye.(at my 14 year old, chubby, goldylocks)  I wish I knew how that would have turned out.  As you might have guessed, the ledges never gained the national acclaim the site was worthy of, and the financial burden has shifted hands several times as a result.  And, I have no sympathy for them.  Jim Howell does keep the place in superb shape.  Also, with the exception of the lower holes, there was very little dirt moved, and they still screwed it up.  Please note, this is not a knock on their character, both are tremendously nice guys.

[Mike Nuzzo]

Smyers is one who has courses all over the Eastern U.S. and the world. I think he just needs a break thru site and a developer like Bandon Dunes.

Are you saying you don't think Smyers is successful?
I understand his work is enjoyed by many.

[Andrew Summerell]

Does 'under-rated' sometimes mean 'under self promoted'?

[Kyle Harris]

Jim Blaukavitch of Quakertown, PA.

He has around a dozen or so courses in the Philadelphia area, all of which are worthy of play and all of which are in the less than $50 range.

Some of his notable designs:

Olde Homestead: Semi-Mountainous with a great routing and a lot of variety... great three shotters
Island Green: Near miracle of a course considering it's on an old industrial site, very clever routing and a lot of variety.
Bella Vista: My favorite of his, great piece of ground and a great routing.
Stone Hedge: A lot of people's favorite from him, in the Poconos.

He is easily one of my favorite architects.

[TEPaul]

I once asked Coore who he admired most in the field of architecture today for what he might be able to create or do. I guess he must've assumed I was asking him the one who he perhaps thought had the most talent or something---and he said it was a guy who'd I'd probably never heard of and probably never would. That was some years ago so maybe his opinions have changed at this point but that sounded to me like he must have been describing someone who was underrated for whatever reason---either he didn't promote himself or he didn't do that much or whatever. He was right that I'd never heard of him but he did mention his name so obviously I've heard of him now. I even met him one time at Friar's Head when Ben and Bill and some of the rest of the crew were brainstorming about the concept of the holes before they went into construction. They all stood around what was to become hole #5 and talked over concept, construction, strategy, look, whatever for about half and hour and then went onto to the tee stake on #6. Bill said to me this was basically the first hole they found out there it was set up so naturally for a golf hole. But how to exactly place and do the green was obviously a question. So they turned to this guy and he said to them---"don't worry about it--I've got it all worked out", so they all said OK and marched directly up to the tee stake on #7. Obviously they all had a ton of respect for his ability! That was the guy Coore said he had the most respect for that I'd probably never hear about. So to me I guess I'd say he's the most underrated I've ever heard about.

[Steve Lapper]

  An obvious choice for myself, and I suspect many who are familar with his work, is GCA's own: Kelly Blake Moran.

  Kelly has consistently created notable examples of enjoyable, fun and strong courses with ample variety that reflect an intelligent and minimalist style. His routings mate common sense and practicality with identification of prominent and playable natural earth movements and let the golfer experience the very best of what Mother Nature has provided. KBM's aversion to moving too much dirt or creating too many artificial hazards easily seperates him from most of the list of those cited on the opening post of this thread.
 
   Other than perhaps his western counterpart, Jim Engh (whose work has to, and deserves to, shine above the declaration of under-rated...he did win best new course last year and finish highly several others), KBM is among the best we have today at tackling severe landscapes (see Morgan Hill) and producing a great result.
     
    Kelly also seperates himself with his adherence to traditional "old-course" and classic architecture principals and near religiously incorporates those shot-making values into his courses. His variety or green sizes along with their constant movement (get the dramamine out at MH!!) give the golfer challenge, laughs and yet, frequent rewards.

    Perhaps Kelly's outspoken and honest nature and adherence to a no BS  or self-promotion policy has cost him the "ratings" notice some others seek, but his work easily deserves to sit along-side or higher than many of his peers. Just ask anyone who plays his courses vs. those of the list (ex. Engh and maybe Smyers for his unique sandbelt-like style) that Mark Brown cites.

     Like Sam Sikes said, H&F are very nice guys, but their work is neither individually nor collectively that unique or special. The bunker-styles and their maintenence alone are enough to earn just enough demerits to keep them off the list.

      I encourage anyone who hasn't yet seen a KBM routing to get out and do so...you won't be disappointed.

   

[T_MacWood]

I suspect the most underrated architect is an associate or junior architect for a larger firm whose work is rarely acknowledged and whose name is rarely seen.

[TEPaul]

Steve:

To me H&F are sort of in a category by themselves. Each course I've played of theirs plays pretty interesting--pretty strategic really but I can't get over the highly and heavily shaped look of all of them. They always look so man-made artistic or man-made stylistic to me---stuff like interesting light and shade across the hugely shaped contours of their man-made architecture that creates massive shadow patterns and stuff. They do or did a lot of that kind of stylistic stuff on purpose--just read Michael's book---it's very comprehensive and explanatory!

[Steve Lapper]

Steve:

To me H&F are sort of in a category by themselves. Each course I've played of theirs plays pretty interesting--pretty strategic really but I can't get over the highly and heavily shaped look of all of them. They always looks sort of man-made artistic or man-made stylistic to me---stuff like interesting light and shade across the hugely shaped contours of the man-made architecture that creates massive shadow patterns and stuff. They do or did a lot of that kind of stylistic stuff on purpose--just read Michael's book---it's very comprehensive!

   Tom,

   I don't disagree! I have no doubt they intend and set out to create that heavily shaped effect. It would be damned near impossible to have it emerge naturally! They are artistic and stylistic. Unfortunately, like an abstract-expressionist painter who goes overboard with providing little or no relief or perspective, it misses when judged for appeal and respect relative to those peers that succeed in impressing and engaging the viewer (golfer).
    Sticking to that analogy, it was Jackson Pollock and Franz Kline who perfected the art of juxtaposing severe activity inside the borders of a canvas without overwhelming the canvas and obscuring the effect of their action-style. It was often the margin and remaining placement of the "negative-space" or blank (or black for Pollock and white for Kline) spaces that helped define and accentuate the action of the paint of the other areas. In Pollock's case, a painting didn't work if it didn't have some form of discipline readily apparent.
   IN H&F's case the discipline doesn't appear to shine through regularly or often enough to balance their artistic and stylistic whirlwind, IMHO .


and like some of contemporary art's craziest artists(Schnable/Kiefer,etc)...they are tough to maintain!

[BCrosby]

Our friend Mike Young. He is very good. He works mostly in the SE and understands clay, a suprisingly rare thing.

His new course in Madison, Ga. will be very, very good. It should open this spring. I hear good things about a new course Mike is building near Savannah. I hope they put him on the map. He deserves it.

Bob

[Kyle Harris]

Tom Paul,

Was the H&F Course Jericho?

[Tony_Chapman]

I'll toot Jeff Brauer's horn to death. I think the man is a great architect. He practically brought golf in Nebraska back from the dead with Woodland Hills, Champions Run and Highlands in the early 1990s.

I don't know if he is under rated or not considering the accolades he has received for the Best New Upscale in Minnesota and Colbert Hills in Manhattan, KS just to name a few.

[Brian_Gracely]

Tony,

What do you think of Ron Farris' work up near you?  Hasn't he done some really good work up in South Dakota?

[henrye]

That was the guy Coore said he had the most respect for that I'd probably never hear about. So to me I guess I'd say he's the most underrated I've ever heard about.

OK Tom, so who is it?

[Tony_Chapman]

Tony,

What do you think of Ron Farris' work up near you?  Hasn't he done some really good work up in South Dakota?

Good point Brian. Though others have played it and I haven't, Ron's course Red Rock in Rapid City appears to be quite a test. He doesn't quite have the portfolio of even a Jeff Brauer, but one would think, if given the chance he may be a good guy to build a course. He worked for Pete Dye and worked with Doak at Long Cove in SC.

[TEPaul]

"OK Tom, so who is it?"

HenryE:

That's the fun of it----you'll have to guess. I know there's a least one other contributor on here who knows exactly who I'm talking about since he worked for him.

Steve Lapper:

Very interesting analogy to the painters Pollock and Kline. Like them, I suppose H&F's style might run the risk of being dated or categorized in an era or separate type or style as are Pollock and Kline. I guess that's what can happen in art when one gets really interpretative. That's the interesting thing about a guy like Behr and his golf architectural philosophy---

"The medium of the artist (paint artist) is paint, and he becomes its master, but the medium of the golf architect is the surface of the earth over which the forces of Nature alone are master".

(Certianly a good enough reason to completely understand and use or mimic the formations of Nature to make golf architecture that's structurally enduring as well as aesthetically enduring. I doubt the look of raw nature has ever gone out of style).

[Bill Gayne]

You probably could put Lester George in the under-rated group. He does have a very well recognized and rated course in Kinloch. But if you aren't in the Mid Atlantic region, you've probably never seen his work and only know about Kinloch.

[RJ_Daley]

TEP, I believe Bill Coore also states his most unheard of pick in his interview on the link to one of his interviews... R.W. it is.

Along that same line of thinking, I'll put in a plug for the most unheard of-most talented design/builders (I won't call them architects) as several of the second bananas in the these most heard of brand name firms. There are a good 20-25 of them.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Tom...

Let me guess... uhmmm... Rod Whitman  

[Brian Phillips]

Mark,

Under-rated by whom? The general public? On here? Their peers? New developers?

Brian

[Steve Lapper]

"OK Tom, so who is it?"

HenryE:

That's the fun of it----you'll have to guess. I know there's a least one other contributor on here who knows exactly who I'm talking about since he worked for him.

Steve Lapper:

Very interesting analogy to the painters Pollock and Kline. Like them, I suppose H&F's style might run the risk of being dated or categorized in an era or separate type or style as are Pollock and Kline. I guess that's what can happen in art when one gets really interpretative. That's the interesting thing about a guy like Behr and his golf architectural philosophy---

"The medium of the artist (paint artist) is paint, and he becomes its master, but the medium of the golf architect is the surface of the earth over which the forces of Nature alone are master".

(Certianly a good enough reason to completely understand and use or mimic the formations of Nature to make golf architecture that's structurally enduring as well as aesthetically enduring. I doubt the look of raw nature has ever gone out of style).

Tom:

   TOUCHE!!! Max said it better than most others could....now if only most would listen!

S

[Mark Brown]

Bryan,

Under-rated by the avid golfer who also has a keen interest in architecture.

[TEPaul]

"Tom:
Max said it better than most others could....now if only most would listen!"

SteveL;

You're not kidding. Either listen or just read him. I know his writing style is odd but anyone with an IQ of 100 can get the gist if they'd bother to read him a couple of times.

Then you get boneheads on here like Rich Goodale who can't even figure out how to read him and he has the arrogance to say that Arnold Haulasstrain is a better writer than Max.  Arnold Haulasstrain is right up Rich's alley though. Arnold was great at describing the footprintless look and feel of the dew on a golf course in the early morning and obviously that gives Rich Goodale a really warm and cozy feeling making him think that's deep but Arnold Haulasstrain wasn't in the same universe as Max when it came to getting to the essence of golf and architecture.

It's depressing to discuss these things with people like Rich they're such boneheads. You try to feed them teeeny little spoonfuls of pablum but all they do is spit it up all over their bibs!

[Brian Phillips]

Bryan,

Under-rated by the avid golfer who also has a keen interest in architecture.

Mark,

Then I would say nearly every architect in the world apart from the big boys like Nicklaus and Fazio.  Most people (even on here) just have no idea how much background work is done by architects to get a job and then get it done within budget.

Brian