Larry Packard?

[Buck Wolter]

Does anyone have any thoughts about Larry Packard and his designs. Came across a course recently in St. Louis that he designed ( later added to by Father and Son Kern). Innisbrook seems to be his most famous design.

I can't say I've ever heard of him but he has a biography available on amazon:

Double Doglegs and Other Hazards
The Life and Work of Larry Packard, by Mickey Rathbun
Larry Packard was the embodiment of 1960's golf course design.  His best known creations are courses at the Innisbrook Resort and the Eagle Ridge Resort.  A past President and Fellow Member of the American Society of Golf Course Architects, he designed or worked on over 300 courses throughout his career.

Embodiment of '60's architecture sounds pretty ominous.

Larry Packard Golf Courses (Doesn't look to be comprehensive)
 
 http://www.golflinks.com/Default.aspx?tabid=86
 
1901 - Elgin Country Club
1926 - Bass Lake Country Club
1958 - Westward Ho Country Club - Long Course
1958 - Westward Ho Country Club - Short Nine Course
1960 - Carlinville Country Club
1960 - Elmwood Golf Club - Championship Course
1960 - Oakwood Park Golf Course
1961 - Baraboo Country Club
1961 - Faries Park Golf Course
1961 - Hampshire Country Club - Classic Hampshire Course
1962 - Ravinia Green Country Club
1962 - Western Lakes Golf Club
1963 - Deerfield Golf Club
1963 - Pekin Country Club
1963 - Peninsula State Park Golf Course
1963 - Pennyrile Forest State Park Resort
1963 - Shiloh Park Golf Course
1964 - Beaver Hills Country Club
1964 - Midland Trail Golf Club
1965 - Glacier Wood Golf Club
1965 - John J. Audubon State Park Golf Course
1965 - Palatine Hills Golf Course
1965 - Wausau Country Club
1965 - Wildwood Golf Course
1966 - Brown County Golf Course
1966 - Countryside West Golf Club
1966 - NAGA-Waukee Golf Course
1967 - Riverside Country Club
1967 - Urban Hills Country Club
1968 - Elliot Golf Course
1969 - Platteview Country Club
1970 - Burning Tree Golf Course
1970 - Echo Valley Country Club
1970 - Hickory Point Golf Course
1970 - Theodore Wirth Golf Course - Par 3 Course
1970 - Turnberry Country Club
1970 - Wedgewood Golf Course
1971 - A. H. Blank Golf Course
1971 - Highlands of Elgin, The
1971 - Indian Springs Golf Club
1972 - Boots Randolph Golf Course
1972 - Deer Creek Golf Club
1972 - Woodlake Golf & Country Club
1974 - Hillsboro Country Club
1975 - Chaska Golf Course
1975 - Rend Lake Golf Course - East/West Course
1975 - Rend Lake Golf Course - South/East Course
1975 - Rend Lake Golf Course - West/South Course
1976 - Lick Creek Golf Course
1978 - Lake Barrington Shores Golf Club
1981 - Cypress Run Golf Club
1983 - Eagle Creek Country Club
 
 
Buck

[Mark_Rowlinson]

And what of Roger Packard?

This is a very rare situation for me.  Normally I don't have an internet conversation with any of you because I have switched off my computer before you have risen for the day.  Here I am sitting in California and you eastern seaboarders and mid-westerners have already gone to bed!  Back to normality next week.

[Buck Wolter]

One bump and I'll let it die. No one has any thoughts on Larry Packard? He looks prodigious if nothing else.

The Confidential Guide gives credit to Innisbrook to Larry and Roger as Mark's post brings up.

We're these guys just house painters or is there anything of interest in what they did?

Buck

[Mark_Rowlinson]

I was in correspondence with Roger about the extensive changes he made to Medinah #3 for the 1990 US Open.  He was very diplomatic but, in describing the changes, he said, "There's not a lot of Roger Packard here."  His new 17th was heavily criticized and the hole was completely rebuilt for the 1999 US PGA.  I can guess, but does anyone actually know what he meant in that remark?  

[Jason Topp]

I'm familiar with Wedgewood, A.H. Blank and Echo Valley.  All are pretty much straightforward 60's designs.

[Jonathan Cummings]

I chatted with Packard on the phone last summer.  I wanted to learn more about Eddie Ault and his impact on the early ASGCA (1960s).  (Few people realize how much impact Ault had on the society).  Packard was less than coorperative.  He basically refused to answer any of my questions, instead almost yelling at me that the media doesn't give his courses enough credit.  He told me that instead of writing about Ault, I should be studying Packard's work at Innisbrook and writing about it.  

Well, needless-to-say I got little out of him and couldn't hang up fast enough.  My next call was to Geoff Cornish.  Talk about polar opposites!  Cornish was charming, informative, inquisitive and more helpful than I could ever hoped for.  He spent an hour on the phone with me telling me stories about the early society.

Someone should write a book about Cornish!

JC  

[Yancey_Beamer]

Geoff Cornish is just the greatest gentleman in golf. Also, he is living history. I've certainly enjoyed every conversation with him.

[RJ_Daley]

My regular home is Brown County.  It is a very solid golf course.  Packard did a lot of work here in Wisconsin.  He was a protege of R.B. Harris.  Yes, they had a design philosophy that was a 50s-60s style which was strongly oriented towards easy maintenance resulting in affordable golf.  I bet they were held in much higher esteem by superintendents than we GCA critics and various raters.

There were a large group of R.B. Harris protegees sometimes called the Chicago school, including Dick Phelps, Dick Nugent, Ken Killian, John LaFoy, and they spun out a second generation (including Roger's son Larry, Dick's son Rick, and numerous fellows that worked with Killian and Nugent before and after they split up as a team, including Lohmann, Bruce Borland, and some guy named Keffrey Brouder   )  

Larry's son Roger had worked with Andy North as his player consultant.  But, Larry and Roger are listed together on many courses in my home area.  I enjoy all of the ones I"ve seen.  They are solid golf courses.

Jonathon, your experience with the interview with Packard VS the experiences with Mr Cornish just shows that various people may age more gracefully than others. These gentlemen are qetting along in their years now...

[Buck Wolter]

Dick-
Thanks for the input. I'll definitely take a look at the course when the weather improves around here. When I drove by it was under 6" of snow and I think all golf courses look good that way.

Buck

[Jeff_Brauer]

Jonathan,

IF Larry Packard was rude to you, it was an unusual occurrence, based on my experiences with him.  He has never been anything but gracious in the time I have known him, which dates to the 1970's, and includes him setting up golf for us at Innisbrook just a few Christmases ago.  Playing with him was a joy.  He may have been having a bad day, which, as RJ suggests, can occur more randomly as anyone reaches Larry's age.

RJ,

John LaFoy was a protege of George Cobb, not the Chicago school.  He was the banjo school from South Carolina!

Other RBHarris protoges include Jim Spears and David Gill.  I don't know of any Spears off shoots, but David Gill spawned Garret Gill (personally and professionally) and you might include George Williams of Abiliene, TX in that Chicago lineage.  After Garrett started his own practice in Wisconsin, Dave partnered with Steve Halberg, a former park district employee and LA student from U of I. He was a year ahead of me, and was the class hot shot, so I know he is talented, but haven't seen any of his work.

After Bob Lohmann and I left K and N, Dick Nugent mentored some others you don't mention, including Jim Engh, and I think Stan Gentry (later of Hale Irwin) so the generation expands.  The next generation continues, as I have trained Jeff Blume (who occaisinally has posted here) Steve Plumer and Johh Colligan, all of whom you will hear of soon, I am sure.