How do you beat a golfer who's better than you?

[Steve Lang]

 

from www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn:
steady..
not subject to change or variation especially in behavior; "a steady beat"; "a steady job"; "a steady breeze"; "a steady increase"; "a good steady ballplayer"


one may be a steady bogey man just as easy as a scratchman

better..
(comparative of `good') superior to another (of the same class or set or kind) in excellence or quality or desirability or suitability; more highly skilled than another; "You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din"; "a better coat"; "a better type of car"; "a suit with a better fit"; "a better chance of success"; "produced a better mousetrap"; "she's better in math than in history"

so Gunga din.. you're pumped and going to use a 4 iron?? I'm using my 5 wood, lets see who's closest for a buck?  If we both get to 15 feet of the hole from 195 yards, is the better ball striker (i.e., the one able to hit iron??) the better golfer??? or the one that sinks the longest putt??

[THuckaby2]

I'll never forgive Huckaby for placing the Armenian and myself against one another at the first King's Putter Cup. That just wasn't right. Huckaby knew it too!

Thomas:  just remember, he REQUESTED that he play with, and against you.  What was I supposed to say, no?

 

[George Pazin]

George Pazin,

Did you have a BET with them at the start of the round, or was it just a friendly game of golf ?

Pressure to perform can do funny things to everyone.

No, I didn't, I was just out enjoying the day, so you're certainly correct in that my steady play was without pressure other than that of being a high handicapper playing with a bunch of strangers.

 

[TEPaul]

Bob Huntley said;

"It is the unexplained foozle,sclaff, shank,duck hook, wicked slice, pop-up, worm burner...."

Hold on a second Bob, just hold on here!!!

"sclaff??? SCLAFF!!!

I've heard of all those other mis-hit shots and I know what they all mean, including a foozle----but a SCLAFF???

This is the website that knows everything and I want a total and comprehensive definition of a "SCLAFF", INCLUDING THE COMPLETE ETYMOLOGY OF THE WORD and I want it on my desk BEFORE THE END OF THE DAY!!!

[George Pazin]

I was reading Mike Clayton's book last night and he referred to someone as a sclaffer. Must be a British Empire term.

[ForkaB]

George

To sclaff is to mishit the ball, usually a little behind and a little squint and a little weakly so it is hit with the sole or the heel of the club and scuttles off like a wounded quail, right or left with no power and little elevation.

As for its etymology, it is onomatapoetic.

[Bob_Huntley]

Rich,

You answered the question correctly, without help.

Bob

[ForkaB]

Thanks, Uncle  Bob.  Can I have a lollipop?

[Rick Shefchik]

Sounds like a sclaff is a very close relative to the skank, as in, "I sclaffed my first approach, and then hit the next one skanky, too."

[Patrick_Mucci]

Steve Lang,

The patterns of play of the, "steady bogie player", if there is such a golfer, are wildly variant then those of the "steady par golfer".

I maintain that finding a "steady" bogie golfer is more difficult and rarer then finding a needle in a haystack, even with a magnet or a pack of matches.

It's a contradiction in terms, a bogie player is inherently unsteady in his play of each hole and his journey around the entire golf course.

Next you'll be telling me about the "steady" double and triple  bogie player.

Remember too, that the handicap system artificially controls and adjusts the scores used to determine ones handicap, eliminating the "unsteady" spikes in high scores on a given hole.  Left to a purist method of determining handicap the steady bogie golfer would be revealed as anything but steady.

A ZERO or better handicapper doesn't tend to have those aberrant spikes, or has the ability to offset them during the course of his round.

[SL_Solow]

Pat, I agree with you for the most part.  The most common exception to your rule is the older player who due to loss of strength can no longer play to a low handicap but remains able to repeat his swing.  His score may be much higher than it was but the variances are relatively small.

[Patrick_Mucci]

SL Solow,

You're not permited to discuss my game without my prior written consent.  

In losing one's strength, the ability to return the club face to the proper position at impact becomes more difficult, creating a more divergent shot pattern.

It also prohibits reasonable recovery from rough, bunkers and poor lies, and usually impacts ball trajectory as well.

Hitting a 7 iron from 150 is a different experience then hitting a 4-5 iron from the same distance.  The ability to maintain an aerial game, and the ability to hold a green are compromised.

At 180-190, what may have been a 3-4-5 iron can be a 2-iron or 3-wood, and if the player has to carry bunkers or sand, that shot presents far more problems, as do the resulting shots.

[Pat Brockwell]

Ah Grasshopper, before you can beat an opponent you must first master youself.

[Sean_A]

Rick

Skank, mmmmm.  Not sure about this one.  Where I'm from this term is used to describe certain unmentionable females in a less than flattering manner.

Ciao

Sean

[THuckaby2]

Rick

Skank, mmmmm.  Not sure about this one.  Where I'm from this term is used to describe certain unmentionable females in a less than flattering manner.

Ciao

Sean

Same goes where I'm from.  At times the word "ho" is added to it.  All the others I have heard in the golf context, even sclaff.  But not skank.

Of course it does fit.  Hell anything does when it comes to bad golf shots.  I could call a shot a gerfleckt and make it work.

 

[JakaB]

To quote Dale's daddy from the movie 3..

"It's not the best golfer who wins the match, it's the one who refuses to lose."

[Dan Kelly]

Sean, Tom IV --

I do believe you've interpreted Mr. Shefchik's intentions quite precisely!

[Steve Lang]

Steve Lang,

The patterns of play of the, "steady bogie player", if there is such a golfer, are wildly variant then those of the "steady par golfer".

   Pat, i disagree..  too much generalization for only missing 1 of 4-5 shots, that's still one batting 0.750 +..

I maintain that finding a "steady" bogie golfer is more difficult and rarer then finding a needle in a haystack, even with a magnet or a pack of matches.

   Pat, i partially disagree, see below.
 
It's a contradiction in terms, a bogie player is inherently unsteady in his play of each hole and his journey around the entire golf course.

   Pat, i disagree in context of a "round," not that a player will shoot consistent bogy for 18 holes.. over a round different bad things occur, both good and bad, maybe only on 1/3 of the holes or so..

Next you'll be telling me about the "steady" double and triple  bogie player.

  Pat, I  agree with you there.. i do draw a line at the "90" score player.. see below.

Remember too, that the handicap system artificially controls and adjusts the scores used to determine ones handicap, eliminating the "unsteady" spikes in high scores on a given hole.  Left to a purist method of determining handicap the steady bogie golfer would be revealed as anything but steady.

A ZERO or better handicapper doesn't tend to have those aberrant spikes, or has the ability to offset them during the course of his round.

   Pat I aggree with your last point, but let's flip the discussion's perspective from that of a steady zero player "missing" par, to that of a player beginning to approach par from a bogey-plus game.. i.e., one that's improving and passing through a state of " bogey equilibrium".. indeed he can be steady, that really should be a possible given,..

In my own case such a state was caused by several things that were "fixable" in technique and realization of alternative playing strategies.. things only accomplished when I could play 120+ rounds per year at The Woodlands CC, being able to walk 9 holes and play two balls to practice shotmaking
versus playing seasonally 35-40 times per year on numerous publinks, no real serious practice, living in western Ohio..  

When I got to being able to play par golf from the white tees, I could play steady bogey golf from the tips..

Ultimtely, no fear of competitor, competition or course became my formula to beat a better golfer.. with all those psy-ops occuring as others have noted..

[Patrick_Mucci]

Steve Lang,

You can disagree all you want, your position is far removed from reality.

Basically, a bogey golfer shoots 90 on a par 72 golf course.
On average, with the scores represented by selecting the best ten of his last twenty scores

Roughly an 18 handicap.

A handicap arrived at by taking the best ten out of his last twenty scores.  If you removed equitable stroke control and posted all twenty scores I'd bet that the 18's handicap would go up.  Why..  because he's inconsistent and doesn't possess the talent to be a "steady" golfer.

Equitable stroke control and only posting his good rounds misrepresents the broader, inconsistent, unsteadier aspects of his game.  It's a false numerical adjustment which caps his high scores on each hole and limits his bad scores for a round from being counted in determining his ability/handicap.

Having played with plus handicaps to 36 handicaps for a few years I can tell you that 18 handicappers games are far from steady, from the executed shot department to the score on each hole department to the consistency of rounds department.

You're being delusional, but, that's okay.
That's what keeps golfers coming back to a game that is difficult, or impossible to master.  It's what allows us to face a new challenge after having been demolished and demoralized in our last attempt to bring the golf course to its knees.

[TEPaul]

"Rich,
You answered the question correctly, without help.
Bob"

BobH:

You know damn well that's a virtual impossibility for Rich to answer a question like that correctly but if you're willing to put you imprimatur on what Rich said about a "sclaff" I'll definitely accept it. However, this claim of his that the etymology is onomatopoetic is too much for me to accept just like that. Next time I see him I want a demonstration and I'll be there with my audio tape recorder to establish the bona fides of his etymologic onomatopoetic claim. Even if the mishit does sound like "SCLAFF" I'll still demand that he say "Etymologic Onomatopoeia" 20 times within 12 1/2 seconds or I will not endorse his claim!

[Doug Siebert]

Steve Lang,

The patterns of play of the, "steady bogie player", if there is such a golfer, are wildly variant then those of the "steady par golfer".

I maintain that finding a "steady" bogie golfer is more difficult and rarer then finding a needle in a haystack, even with a magnet or a pack of matches.

It's a contradiction in terms, a bogie player is inherently unsteady in his play of each hole and his journey around the entire golf course.

Next you'll be telling me about the "steady" double and triple  bogie player.

Remember too, that the handicap system artificially controls and adjusts the scores used to determine ones handicap, eliminating the "unsteady" spikes in high scores on a given hole.  Left to a purist method of determining handicap the steady bogie golfer would be revealed as anything but steady.

A ZERO or better handicapper doesn't tend to have those aberrant spikes, or has the ability to offset them during the course of his round.

What would you say John Daly's handicap is?

Would you say that he's "steady" by any reasonable definition? (unless you just define steady to mean scratch or better, in which case just say scratch instead of steady)

[Patrick_Mucci]

What would you say John Daly's handicap is?

First, his life style choices or demons.

Secondly, It would depend on what condition he was in when he teed it up.  John Daly has had a roller coaster ride in life and golf.

I don't think you can cite as an example someone incapable of finishing a round due to personal problems and someone who plays brilliantly when he's in tune with himself.

You don't win the PGA and British Open by not being a "steady" golfer.[/color]

Would you say that he's "steady" by any reasonable definition? (unless you just define steady to mean scratch or better, in which case just say scratch instead of steady)

There were times when John Daly couldn't finish a round or break 80 due to personal issues.

I think John's brilliant potential conflicts at times with his life style choices.

When not hounded by demons, I'd describe his play as "steady"[/color]

[JESII]

JES II,

I think it's possible that you and others are laboring under a conflict in principles.

How does a 10, 15, 20, 25 or higher handicap play STEADY ?

How do the above golfers CONTROL the ability to turn their games ON and OFF the STEADY mode ?

It's beyond the realm of their ability.

Patrick

I disagree, I have not read the posts sisnce yours here due to time, but steady golf is a relative term. For you steady may be fairways and greens and a couple of bogies countered by a couple of birdies, while the bogey player has shots he can control better than others and playing to these strong suits is how he can play "STEADY". I am not sure what the dictionary definition for STEADY is, but STEADY Golf could probably be defined as playing within ones abilities with patience and confidence.

Sure the 20 will miss shots that were intended to be conservtive, but that is the point of playing conservative, to give yourself the widest margin for error.

I'll try to catch up on the thread and cover my ass if I have to, but I think STEADY GOLF is the best way to beat someone marginally better than you.

Jim

[TEPaul]

"I'll try to catch up on the thread and cover my ass if I have to,"

Jim:

You never need to cover your ass regarding anything Pat Mucci says to you on here as long as I'm around. If he gives you any guff at all on here, I'll just slap him upside the head a few times and send him back to his room!

[Steve Lang]

 

TEP,

Could you use a 2x4 on Pat for me?  I don't think anyone has ever called me delusional in 53 years whether being complementary or trying to rebuff an arguement!