The Oxymoronic 7th At Cuscowilla

[Mike Hendren]

I like trees.  The cognoscenti don't.
I dislike the 7th at Cuscowilla.  The cognoscenti love it.

What's up with that?

The two trees are too near the green to carry and the second shot is too short to accomodate a cut around them.  Essentially, they turn an artificially enhanced pine straw bed into a hazard.  

I do not like this.  Oh no I do not.

Mike

[Brian_Gracely]

The two trees are too near the green to carry and the second shot is too short to accomodate a cut around them.  

I hate to argue with a guy that lives by the cut shot, but I disagree with that statement.  How much distance does it take to hit a cut?  

If you hit a drive to parallel with the tree on the left, your approach is in the 130-150yd range.  Not enough distance?  And a cut is really only needed for a middle or right flag, not all flag positions.  

....Or hit enough draw off the tee to get to the left side of the fairway.

....Or....(feeling Moriarty creeping into my keyboard)....hit a running approach as the green is open in the front

[Carlyle Rood]

[blasbe1]

The two trees are too near the green to carry

First time I played the hole I blocked driver into the right rough from the back tees and drew an 8 iron from 145 over the trees to a back left pin (and missed the 10 footer for birdie, of course).  

That's one of the features I like so much about that hole and so many others there, one bad shot can be saved by one great shot.

[THuckaby2]

I like Cuscowilla.
I love the place
I like #7
It is a nice change of pace
You are forced to hook
Then forced to cut
If you can't do that
Then kiss my butt.

If every hole were like this
Then I might not say so
But this hole is different
So you can go blow.

 

TH

ps - I severely sprained my wrist the other day, I can barely type and for sure can't hold a golf club, I have about 15 hours of work to catch up on, so bear with me.  It's the pain speaking.

[BCrosby]

I've played the hole with a couple of young bombers who bombed it straight down the fairway and never did get to the green.

A very good hole. I wonder, however, if the effect of the tree on the left could be achieved by other, more permanent means. Wouldn't a deep, nasty bunker at that spot force the same shot choices?

The indispensable trees on 7 are the ones along the right side of the approach to the green.

Bob

[Brent Hutto]

The two trees are too near the green to carry and the second shot is too short to accomodate a cut around them.  Essentially, they turn an artificially enhanced pine straw bed into a hazard.  

The second shot is only as short as the first shot is long, no?

If you need a 6-iron in hand to reliably play a slice then perhaps laying up to 6-iron distance off the tee would be the "strategic" play. Heck, I can hit driver off the tee and still need at least a 6-iron to reach the green.

Another strategy is to blade your second shot so it rolls to the right of the tree and leaves you pin high and 30 yards right of the green. I tried that one and for some reason it didn't work out too well. It did take the tree out of play, though.

[Brent Hutto]

The indispensable trees on 7 are the ones along the right side of the approach to the green.

Totally. If those trees were to get the beetles or something I'd assume the course would have to transplant a couple of mature trees to replace them. Otherwise the seventh would turn from an interesting shotmaking challenge into a bomb-it-and-chip short hole (although birdie still wouldn't be assured given the green contours).

[GeoffreyC]

I like Cuscowilla.
I love the place
I like #7
It is a nice change of pace
You are forced to hook
Then forced to cut
If you can't do that
Then kiss my butt.

If every hole were like this
Then I might not say so
But this hole is different
So you can go blow.

 

TH

I for one really like the new Huckaby.  The east coast and a drive through New York has done wonders for you.

[THuckaby2]

GC - it had to be the slice of pizza I had yesterday in Manhattan... I have now TRULY seen the light.  Those little golf courses I played were truly meaningless compared to this religious pizza experience.

And I do mean what I say about #7 Cuscowilla, btw.  Oh, if EVERY hole there required working around trees like this, it would get old quick... but that's not the case, so it works for me just fine.

TH

[Pete Buczkowski]

I like trees.  The cognoscenti don't.
I dislike the 7th at Cuscowilla.  The cognoscenti love it.

What's up with that?

The two trees are too near the green to carry and the second shot is too short to accomodate a cut around them.  Essentially, they turn an artificially enhanced pine straw bed into a hazard.  

I do not like this.  Oh no I do not.

Mike

Mike,

I am certainly not one of the cognoscenti...in fact my recent hillbilly status makes me quite the opposite...however I'll take issue with your stance...the hole really requires only one curved shot...a drawn tee ball to the left side will leave you a straight shot in.  If you don't hit a draw off the tee then the you can play a fade to the left side of the green, or hit the high lofted shot that Jason has in his bag.  This is one of the few holes I had success on as I was able to play it both ways...wait a second...maybe it is a bad hole...

Pete
A Casual Poster

[Pete Buczkowski]

GC - it had to be the slice of pizza I had yesterday in Manhattan... I have now TRULY seen the light.  Those little golf courses I played were truly meaningless compared to this religious pizza experience.

And I do mean what I say about #7 Cuscowilla, btw.  Oh, if EVERY hole there required working around trees like this, it would get old quick... but that's not the case, so it works for me just fine.

TH

Tom H,

I saw some evidence of your "business trip" to NY on Monday...do they have any openings at Clorox...

Pete
A Casual Poster

[THuckaby2]

Pete:

Not yet - not my job anyway.
But it's still pretty early in the morning here.
As for what I did on Monday, well... it is a tough life.  

 

[Brian_Gracely]

What is the distance between those two trees and the front of the green?

It's probably 30yds from the tees to the front of the green.  

There is room to hit a running shot into the green, and there is even room to hit a straight shot to the left side of the green (if you're on the right side of fairway).  

Hell, you could hit a running shot through the pine needles at that flag if you wanted to.

[Pete Buczkowski]

WAIT!!!

Looking more closely it is pine needles NOT sand below the trees.

This requires more thought......

What is the distance between those two trees and the front of the green?

someone?

Bill,

There is about 20-30 yards between the tree and the green...I was able to cut a 7 iron to a right pin on Saturday and hit a straight 9 iron from the left side on Sunday...is that really anti-strategy...please enlighten me.  Not to mention that the green contours will feed a ball right with a fade.  Edit:  As Brian said below...the fairway kicks it left, and there's at least 25 yards of fairway left of where this picture was taken.

Tom,

I meant an opening for me...

Pete
A Casual Poster

[Brian_Gracely]

The real kicker that nobody is talking about is the fairway slopes from right to left, so it makes a cut shot into that green somewhat difficult.  

So boo-hoo.....golf ain't fair

[THuckaby2]

redanman:  I wish I had some percocet.  I have yet to go see a professional such as yourself... may do tomorrow...

To answer your questions...

It is sand needles on top of a sandy base under that tree.  Damn tough shot.  I bumped a 7iron from there, got it on OK.  It's about 10 yards from the last tree to the front of the green, going over the sandy needly base, then over fairway grass, up a slope, on to the green.

TH

[JakaB]

Come on Huck....you have got to tell us how and where you sprained your wrist Monday...it is too late for any of the access whores to hitch a ride on your star..

If you recall....I hit a perfect run up shot from the right side of 7 that caught a pine cone or two and came up short....the pine cone is a wicked use of random neostrategy....I guess that did make me angry...

[THuckaby2]

Pete - gotcha.  Well, we can always use good people.  I just can't promise the perqs I get... that takes a slavish devotion to screwing around.  

JK - yes, you got coned.  That was bad luck.  As for my trevails, it was actually kinda cool how it happened... my wrist was feeling sore all day... right in the "pad" of the hand, ya know?  Kinda makes bravery part of the golf shot... and at WF, well one has enough to think about... well I perservered all day, it wasn't THAT bad... until what was going to be our second to last hole... at that point the pain was getting worse, but no complaints, we were almost done... So I go down after an 8iron out of the rough on #9 WF East, hit it clean, but know right away that's it for me, because the pain was pretty unbearable upon impact on that one and then right after, I couldn't clench my hand at all.  But the ball got on the green 20 feet away... having not made a birdie in Mamaroneck I had to try the putt... and damned if I didn't knock it in, pretty much one-handed (side though - new putting stroke if and when I recover?).  I figure this was the golf gods' way of rewarding me for bravery, but also telling me to go home where I belonged.

This birdie put me one up on Mr. Sweeney.. so after trying to one-hand one on our last hole and damn near whiffing, I conceded, we halved that match, all was well with the world.

[Mike Hendren]

So all trees with a cleared high canopy are now okay?

Who the heck can fade a nine iron any more?

Lay back with a six-iron to have a six-iron in?  

Are C & C so ingenious that they now design for the aerial game too?  

They INTRODUCED additional pine straw under that tree - much like I would mulch around my shrubs at home.  It was loose and a solid foot thick when I played there in April.  That's my biggest problem.  I saw a guy run a low shot in there that tunneled into the pine straw.  

This, and the 18th, look like they belong on a state park course in Tennessee.

For the record, I drove the ball straight down the left-hand side (my equivalent of a duck hook) and hit a 9-iron ten feet past the hole on Sunday.  

Since when is skirting trees form the middle of the fairway with an ideal shot good architecture?

Is this dog-pile on Mike day?  

Or do I need to turn in my credentials?

Mike
A Confused Poster  

[THuckaby2]

Mike:

My low-level poetry must be undecipherable to your high-level brain.

The hole is a change of pace.  It works in that respect.  It's a very difficult golf hole, but in a different way from the others there.  I continue to like it.

TH

[Pete Buczkowski]

So all trees with a cleared high canopy are now okay?

Who the heck can fade a nine iron any more?

Lay back with a six-iron to have a six-iron in?  

Are C & C so ingenious that they now design for the aerial game too?  

They INTRODUCED additional pine straw under that tree - much like I would mulch around my shrubs at home.  It was loose and a solid foot thick when I played there in April.  That's my biggest problem.  I saw a guy run a low shot in there that tunneled into the pine straw.  

This, and the 18th, look like they belong on a state park course in Tennessee.

For the record, I drove the ball straight down the left-hand side (my equivalent of a duck hook) and hit a 9-iron ten feet past the hole on Sunday.  

Since when is skirting trees form the middle of the fairway with an ideal shot good architecture?

Is this dog-pile on Mike day?  

Or do I need to turn in my credentials?

Mike
A Confused Poster  

Mike,

Which tees did you play?  Since I am not one of the cognoscenti I played the middle tees...it does open up the left side of the fairway from there.  The back tees are 20-30 yards farther back and a good 15 yards left of the middle tee.  And I already turned in my credentials so don't listen to anything I have to say.  The trees that really bother me were the ones to the right of the 9th tee...I couldn't take advantage of the turbo boost in the fairway...that's when I put up the white flag for the round.  I have also taken issue with the ones behind 10 & 11...I tried to do my part on 10 by knocking it well over the green and taking an exaggerated practice swing...it didn't help.

Pete
A Casual Poster

BTW I am going to stop posting now so I don't lose my moniker.

[Doug Wright]

I'm with Mike Hendren on this one. I didn't like 7 though I didn't play it just observed whilst looping for Brad S.. Although I fade the ball and could do so into that green on the second shot, I think the trees are too close to the green--they are literally on top of it, and there's no way to fly them. Brad and I thought the hole would be better if the green was maybe 40 yards further back from its present location, allowing for more options. Also, I looked at it and didn't think the ground game option was viable--there's really not that much room at the front opening.

The rest of the course was way better by comparison...

And Huckster, sorry about your wrist. Probably started when you swung to hard with the hickory... At least it happened at the END of your latest journey.

Best,

[Brent Hutto]

So all trees with a cleared high canopy are now okay?

No, just those trees on the seventh hole.

Who the heck can fade a nine iron any more?

I can't fade it but I can slice the heck out of it.

Lay back with a six-iron to have a six-iron in?  

Only if you think that's the best way to make birdie on the hole.

Are C & C so ingenious that they now design for the aerial game too?  

Nah, Kavenaugh says it's all random anyway.

They INTRODUCED additional pine straw under that tree - much like I would mulch around my shrubs at home.  It was loose and a solid foot thick when I played there in April.  That's my biggest problem.  I saw a guy run a low shot in there that tunneled into the pine straw.  

I think that would be a mistake. The way it was this weekend wasn't bad at all, though.

This, and the 18th, look like they belong on a state park course in Tennessee.

The eighteenth is pretty boring, granted. I think the seventh is a fun hole that would be an improvement on most state park courses. I've never been to Tennessee.

For the record, I drove the ball straight down the left-hand side (my equivalent of a duck hook) and hit a 9-iron ten feet past the hole on Sunday.  

Since when is skirting trees form the middle of the fairway with an ideal shot good architecture?

If you get the tee shot far enough left those trees are out of play.

Is this dog-pile on Mike day?  

Yes, didn't you get the memo on that?

Or do I need to turn in my credentials?

Hey, I thought it was a great topic. Thanks for starting it. I like the hole even though I have no credentials at all. Hell, I can't even spell "congnagentski".

[David_Madison]

I loved #7 for a few reasons. First, other than for moving about as much dirt as my son and I could dig by hand in a few hours to build the greens complex (yes, I know that you have to dig the whole thing out, etc. etc., but the end result looks like there's very little change from the natural grading) all that C/C had to do was pick the right trees to remove and the ones to keep, and the hole was done. A "found" hole wins over a "built" hole every time in my book.

I appreciate holes that reward two different shot shapes, in this case a draw off the tee and potentially a fade to the green. But thinking more about it, you really only needed one of those, the draw, if you could get it far enough left. The pin position that we saw on Sunday, front right, would seem to be one that the guarding right hand trees would impact a lot. I drew a 3-wood into the left center of the fairway, hit a slightly drawn PW (anything not moving hard left is a fade for me) 15' left of the hole, and then made the putt for birdie. And that's the best reason of all why it's a great hole!  

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